Invitation to discuss low-calorie approaches to weight-loss on alt.support.diet.low-calorie

"The Queen of Cans and Jars" wrote in message
. ..
teachrmama wrote:

Gosh, I am so glad nobody gave up on me because of all the times I tried
to
do things my way. Or on certain family members who went to 12 step
meetings for "support" but really didn't follow the program. All of us
seem
to have stumbled and bumbled our way to truths that we were blind
to--sometimes by choice--in the past. If I were to be judged only by my
past choices, I would never be free to be the person I am becoming today.
2002 was 5 years ago--I'm talking to him today.

You really don't get it, do you? Caleb's not stumbling. He
*deliberately* loses and regains weight. Wake the hell up and pay
attention to what people are telling you.

You honestly think he *deliberately* regains weight? What makes you say
that?

On Feb 4, 5:15 pm, "teachrmama" wrote:
"Caleb" wrote in message

ups.com...

On Feb 4, 11:01 am, "teachrmama" wrote:
"Caleb" wrote in message

roups.com...

snip





I do not write these posts to irritate you or anyone else but to
support those going on their difficult journey.

I'd be happy to discuss any aspect of my approach to weight loss with
anyone who is asking a serious question. This topic is too important
to shut out voices that may be helpful.

You're right about the fact that losing weight is not that difficult,
Caleb.
It really isn't. That's why some of these weight loss companies are
thriving. They depend on people eating their prepackaged, low calorie
meals--and the pounds fly off. It isn't the losing that is the difficult
part of the proposition--it's keeping the weight off. That is the part
of
your plan that I have not seen you talk about yet. I would be interested
in
knowing how you plan to maintain your weight loss once you reach your
goal.
For me, I am still in the process of losing weight, but I know that once
I
get to goal, I will need to continue to keep watch on how much I eat, and
will need to continue with my physical activities to maintain my weight.
There is no option to go back to the way I ate before.

Teachrmama -

I agree with you about this weight-loss thing. There are two aspects
to it, I think:
1. Weight loss, and
2. Weight loss management.

I think I'm pretty good at systematic weigh loss now. I used to be
fairly good at maintenance but then I hurt my back and required
surgery. Before then I would run long distances, probably completed 10
marathons, etc. With the removal of disk L5-S1, my jogging days were
over. And so in 1999 my weight reached 272 pounds (I think). And it
hit me on a trip to my physician that if I were good for the next
hundred days, I would be a hell of a lot healthier. (The trip to the
doc was about my 23rd wedding anniversary.) I also realized that 100
days from that point would take me to the day before Thanksgiving. I
penciled it out, realized what I had to do, and I did it. I lost about
50 pounds in that time. I've done that several times since then.

I haven't been as good at weight loss management. My plans now are to
take my scale downstairs after I reach 200 pounds and weigh myself
every night before dinner. And if I go over a five pound limit (such
as 205), to immediately return to a vigorous weight loss regimen. (You
can take a look at the "hacker's diet" on Wikipedia for one successful
approach to this conundrum.) I too have to cut down the calories. Also
I know that I can't do the kind of heavy exercise I used to do,
although I did just come back from three and a half hours of heavy
snowshoeing and I feel great!

Seems to me that if I had a neighbor who was a skilled plumber but a
lousy gardener, I probably would ask about plumbing matters, such as
repairing a leaking faucet. And so would a lot of other people who
wanted faucets that don't drip. (There is a great quote I remember
from grad school: "If a society prizes philosophy above plumbing,
we're going to have pipes that leak and ideas that don't hold water!"
Seems to me that if we emphasize generalities and denigrate specific
methods, we will employ a lot fewer successful methods.)

Wow. I'm sorry to hear about the back problems. Have you consulted an
expert in the area of exercise (or physical therapy) to find out what form
of exercise would be one you could follow regularly in spite of your injury?
I know you realize that physical activity is very important in maintaining a
healthy body.

Have you come up with a specific plan for maintenance, other than your 5
pound rule? Such as what foods you will eat in moderation, and which you
will eat rarely, etc. I know that being careful what foods I keep in the
house helps me a lot. And my teenage daughters are forming some very good
habits, too. Hopefully they will never have to lose weight--they will have
formed the habits that will help them maintain the proper weight, including
both eating and exercise choices.


Yup --

Days of beer every night are behind me, I'm afraid. (Not only behind
me but also around my hips, etc.) And I certainly agree that limiting
the variety of foods is important, getting out of the kitchen and
staying out of the kitchen after dinner is important. I will also have
to generally monitor the calories consumed in the course of a week,
especially if the scale creeps up.

Good for the healthy habits of you and your daughters!

Overweight runs heavily in a part of my family and I resemble no one
so much as my previously very overweight grandfather (who has long
since passed away). Indeed, I look so much like him, I use his picture
to shave by! (That's a terrific joke by Mark Twain who would send this
response to everyone who sent him a picture saying how much so-and-so
looked like Twain.) However, our children are very athletic and
resemble my far better half in the weight department.

For me walking -- especially walking uphill -- has replaced jogging.
There is a little hill close by -- 600 feet gain -- and I walk the
mile and a half up it about every other day. A friend and I park a car
at the top and we walk up to the car. Today the same friend and I went
on a snowshoe hike around Mt. Hood. Beautiful out there. Two weeks ago
I "hit the wall" because I didn't have enough calories and at the
third hour, i got dizzy, had vision problems, etc., until my friend
gave me an energy bar. Today I had more than sufficient calories and I
think I could have done the same trek twice today.

I like going uphill because it's easy to control how much of a workout
one gets -- a little faster and I'm gasping. Also, I don't get the
pounding that going downhill on pavement bring about. After going up
this hill for about 7 years, I think that if we were going to move,
I'd like to move to a place with a similar hill. It is just very, very
handy.

Hope things continue to go well!

Yours truly,

Caleb

teachrmama wrote:

"The Queen of Cans and Jars" wrote in message
. ..
teachrmama wrote:

Gosh, I am so glad nobody gave up on me because of all the times I tried
to
do things my way. Or on certain family members who went to 12 step
meetings for "support" but really didn't follow the program. All of us
seem
to have stumbled and bumbled our way to truths that we were blind
to--sometimes by choice--in the past. If I were to be judged only by my
past choices, I would never be free to be the person I am becoming today.
2002 was 5 years ago--I'm talking to him today.

You really don't get it, do you? Caleb's not stumbling. He
*deliberately* loses and regains weight. Wake the hell up and pay
attention to what people are telling you.

You honestly think he *deliberately* regains weight? What makes you say
that?

Google is your friend.

On Feb 4, 8:33 pm, (The Queen of Cans and Jars)
wrote:
teachrmama wrote:
"The Queen of Cans and Jars" wrote in message
...
teachrmama wrote:

Gosh, I am so glad nobody gave up on me because of all the times I tried
to
do things my way. Or on certain family members who went to 12 step
meetings for "support" but really didn't follow the program. All of us
seem
to have stumbled and bumbled our way to truths that we were blind
to--sometimes by choice--in the past. If I were to be judged only by my
past choices, I would never be free to be the person I am becoming today.
2002 was 5 years ago--I'm talking to him today.

You really don't get it, do you? Caleb's not stumbling. He
*deliberately* loses and regains weight. Wake the hell up and pay
attention to what people are telling you.

You honestly think he *deliberately* regains weight? What makes you say
that?

Google is your friend.

Teachrmama -- I was pretty sure you wouldn't receive a decent response
to your question.

I wonder if Google can tell me my favorite color? How many coins I
have in my pocket? How many teeth I have in my mouth?

This is typical of a lot of criticism -- make the accusations and then
run away when someone asks you to be specific. Throw enough stuff
against the wall and maybe some of it will stick, or people may just
remember that there was a lot of criticism, whether or not all of it
is just baloney.

I really don't know why people dislike my posts the way they do. As I
have said earlier, I do not swear at others, etc., and am not negative
unless others are negative first. Also, the specifics of what I
propose regarding weight loss are extremely mainstream, something that
physicians are generally likely to agree with. Speculating as to
motives is usually not very helpful.

I don't have a medical degree - don't pretend to be a physician, etc.
-- but I do find it curious that so many people on ASD state as
medical fact things that still uncertain or even proven to be untrue.
Rather reminds me of the prototypic Englishman who -- when visiting
foreign countries and being unable to speak the language of that
country -- simply starts to yell to get his point across. (An early
developmental milestore is for children to be able to state things in
different ways if people cannot understand what they are saying the
first time.)

Yours,

Caleb

"teachrmama" wrote in message
...

"LFM" wrote in message
. ..

"teachrmama" wrote in message
...

"The Queen of Cans and Jars" wrote in message
. ..
teachrmama wrote:

I'm just not clear on why you think that gives you the right to tell
me I
shouldn't talk to him either.

Talk to him all you want - in the group that he set up for talking
about
it. Is it really all that hard to understand?

Actually, yes it is. Why shouldn't we be free to talk here? There are
certainly some extremely obnoxious threads here right now that haven't
been jumped on the way this rather innocuous thread has been.

Caleb posts are considered trolling and off topid to ASD. Therefore if
you want to continue with an off topic dialog with a troll, then do not
be surprised with others chose to classify you in the same category as
they do him, and kill file you, ignore you and lose respect in you. Your
credibility is at risk by continuing your dialog with him in this forum.

Why are you so upset about something so minor? You are making yourself
look like a control freak. Just ignore the threads you do not want to
participate in. That's what I do.

I guess we're just a bunch of control freaks then. Have fun with Caleb.

"Caleb" wrote in message
ps.com...
On Feb 4, 6:42 pm, "LFM" wrote:
"teachrmama" wrote in message

...



"The Queen of Cans and Jars" wrote in message
...
teachrmama wrote:

I'm just not clear on why you think that gives you the right to tell
me
I
shouldn't talk to him either.

Talk to him all you want - in the group that he set up for talking
about
it. Is it really all that hard to understand?

Actually, yes it is. Why shouldn't we be free to talk here? There are
certainly some extremely obnoxious threads here right now that haven't
been jumped on the way this rather innocuous thread has been.

Caleb posts are considered trolling and off topid to ASD. Therefore if
you
want to continue with an off topic dialog with a troll, then do not be
surprised with others chose to classify you in the same category as they
do
him, and kill file you, ignore you and lose respect in you. Your
credibility is at risk by continuing your dialog with him in this forum.

LFM - Who exactly died and made you chief of the world? Guilt by
declaration is right up there with a belief in a flat earth.

Your accusations are childish, shrill, and will turn others against
you. They are so 7th and 8th grade: "If you're friends with Lucy then
you can't be friends with me! But I will like you if you don't like
Lucy!"

I'll talk to almost anyone on matters of importance -- and I sure wish
that Herr Bush would do the same thing.

By the way, what is the secret group that you're a member off that
gets to decide who the trolls are and whether I'm off-topic "to ASD"?
What is your secret hand shake? Do you get to wear masks and
headdresses? Reminds me of Senator Joe McCarthy (intoning slowly
because it seems as though he knows what he's tlaking about): "My
friends, I have in my hands a list of the communists who have taken
over the government... Are you now or have you ever been a member of
the communist party?" Ooo! Ooo! I have just the update: "Are you now
talking to -- or have you ever talked to -- Caleb on ASD after we told
you not to do so?"

Inquiring minds want to know -- when did the secret group convene? Do
you have the minutes of the meeting? Who wrote up the bylaws? Who else
is on the docket in the future to be so censured?

What weight-loss topics are fobidden on ASD? etc., etc.

So one can see that trying to stiffle free speech on this group is
somewhat like trying to capture a cloud with a butterfly net. Pretty
darned tough to do. You are responsible for yourself, and perhaps your
children (if you have any), and for your dog. I'd try not to
micromanage the cat, though. Our cat hates it.

Yours,

Caleb

And to think you are a clinical psychologist. Unbelievable. You know, you
live in my zip code, maybe we could meet for coffee or something, and you
could really psychoanalyze me.

"teachrmama" wrote in message
...

"LFM" wrote in message
. ..

"teachrmama" wrote in message
...


I don't doubt that you have a darn good reason for your choices. I'm
just not clear on why you think that gives you the right to tell me I
shouldn't talk to him either. THAT's the part that I find odd.


I didn't say you couldn't/shouldn't talk to him - I suggested to you that
if you wish to continue the dialog with him that you take it to the
appropriate newsgroup that he setup for his plan, out of respect to the
rest of this group.

Do you tell everyone that participates in threads you do not approve of
the same thing?

YES. Especially with the track record this moron has.

On 2 Feb 2007 09:06:46 -0800, Caleb wrote:

If anyone else wants to share their successes or questions about
losing weight through low-calorie methods, I'd be delighted to see
them there!

Yours,

Caleb

Why don't you tell us how much you lost on the last 100 day diet, and
how much you regained from day 101 onwards?

janice

So it is him!

Yup! It sure is me. I'll be posting on alt.support.diet.low-calorie my
progress.

I guess one of my points is that it simply is not that difficult or
complicated to take the weight off. There is no need for people suffer
emotional turmoil, self-doubt, etc. If they follow a sensible dietary
approach over time, they WILL lose weight. Nothing rocket science
about it. However, following a sensible approach over time is not
easy.

I've done it before (quite simply) and I'll do it again this time --
hope it's the last time -- but regardless, it's just not that tough to
do. I sure am a hell of a lot healthier than when I first started this
approach in '99. I am alive, am far more physically fit, etc., etc.

Couple of points for people to remember:

There's a lot of bad advice out there competing for their attention.

It all does break down to calories in versus calories used up.

Weighing regularly is probably essential for most people. (I have a
simple balance beam system that I have found very helpful since '99
that you can read about if you search "indicator" "caleb" "balance
beam" on Google.)

Recording calories -- or at least insuring that what you eat adheres
to your dietary goals -- is important.

Regular exercise is important, although the recent research from
Pennington (Ravussin et al) shows that exercise is not a panacea and
that some of the vaunted effects of exercise (e.g., muscle speeding up
metabolism) are not supported by current data.

Most important is just to keep at it -- put your nose down and just
keep plugging along. For every one who unreasonably assails you, you
might imagine their face at a trough, wonder exactly what their weight
loss history is (is there a weight-loss wing of the Mayo Clinic in
their name?), etc. As Rosie used to say, "Your mileage may vary!" And
certainly it is true that there are different strokes for different
folks.

To repeat, weight-loss is not rocket science but it still is not easy.
Too bad we can't be like a horse in blinders that continually plows a
road in a field, undistracted by harmful or inconsequential things.

Yours,

Caleb

Caleb, Mu here.

Counting calories is such an inexact computation as to be practically
worthless. Would you care for Mu to explain?

Cals in, cals out, thermodynamics OK, real usefulness = ZERO.

Reg exercise is of no real ongoing value for overconsumption control, so
few can or elect to do so. Scratch that.

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On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 08:11:46 -0800, determined wrote:

You know what?

Shut up?

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On Sat, 3 Feb 2007 14:32:44 -0800, determined wrote:

SFRunner -- May I suggest you use your block sender button if you
don't like my posts?

This "some of us are sick and tired" sounds quite childish and makes
use of a logical fallacy called "the band wagon effect."

Seems to me that some people are very, very quick to criticize
others.

Caleb

Oh bull****, Caleb. Seriously, and I thought you were an educated adult.

No one here thinks that of you.

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