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Dieting vs. Exercise for Weight Loss



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 3rd, 2012, 08:46 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Dogman
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Posts: 540
Default Dieting vs. Exercise for Weight Loss


http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/0...loss/?src=recg

"Two groundbreaking new studies address the irksome question of why so
many of us who work out remain so heavy, a concern that carries
special resonance at the moment, as lean Olympians slip through the
air and water, inspiring countless viewers to want to become similarly
sleek.

"And in a just world, frequent physical activity should make us slim.
But repeated studies have shown that many people who begin an exercise
program lose little or no weight. Some gain."

Ahem.

--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman
  #2  
Old August 3rd, 2012, 10:17 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
[email protected]
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Posts: 993
Default Dieting vs. Exercise for Weight Loss

On Aug 3, 3:46*pm, Dogman wrote:
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/0...rcise-for-weig...

"Two groundbreaking new studies address the irksome question of why so
many of us who work out remain so heavy, a concern that carries
special resonance at the moment, as lean Olympians slip through the
air and water, inspiring countless viewers to want to become similarly
sleek.

"And in a just world, frequent physical activity should make us slim.
But repeated studies have shown that many people who begin an exercise
program lose little or no weight. Some gain."

Ahem.

--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman


Of course, as usual, if one reads the actual article instead
of relying on your hysteria, the research doesn't say what
you or even the authors say it does. What the researchers
concluded was this:

"The implication, the scientists concluded, is that “active,
‘traditional’ lifestyles may not protect against obesity if diets
change to promote increased caloric consumption.” That is, even active
people will pack on pounds if they eat like most of us in the West."

This comes as shocking news to you?

Then we have this:


"People stick with low-calorie diets more readily than they continue
with exercise to drop pounds."

Maybe true, but diet hasn't proven successful in stopping the obesity
epidemic either. And following Doggie's logic, both are just an
issue of "personal responsibility" so it's irrelevant how easy or
hard it is to follow.

And this:

"One of the few studies ever to have scrupulously monitored exercise,
food intake and metabolic rates found that volunteers’ basal metabolic
rates dropped as they lost weight, even though they exercised every
day. As a result, although they were burning up to 500 calories during
an exercise session, their total daily caloric burn was lower than it
would have been had their metabolism remained unchanged, and they lost
less weight than had been expected."

Two things worth noting there. Number one is that while excercising
they were burning 500 calories. The other is the statement that this
study is one of the few studies like this ever done. So,
sounds like the answer is we don't know exactly what is going on.
And only a fool would jump to wild conclusions absent a lot of data.
But then Doggie jumps to wild consclusions even when they are
directly contradicted by a mountain of irrefutable studies, so no
surprise there.


And then we end with this gem:

" She is perhaps her own best advertisement. In the past few years,
she’s shed 70 pounds and, using her formulas for how many calories
she’s actually burning each day thanks to a daily walk, has regained
none of it."


I love it when Doggie doesn't comprehend what he's posting.
He does this all the time. He posts some crap thinking it
makes his case for whatever when it actually is directly
opposite his argument. Clearly the article concludes with
the position that excercise is beneficial with regard to
weight loss. The main position is that as one loses weight
it effects metabolism so that it's more difficult to keep
shedding weight as you lose. Something we've talked
about for years here in the group. But perhaps Doggie
missed it.

Anything else I can help you correctly interpret Doggie,
just let me know.....







  #3  
Old August 4th, 2012, 12:00 AM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
[email protected]
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Posts: 993
Default Dieting vs. Exercise for Weight Loss

On Aug 3, 6:21*pm, Dogman wrote:

Of course, as usual, if one reads the actual article instead
of relying on your hysteria, the research doesn't say what
you or even the authors say it does. *What the researchers
concluded was this:


"The implication, the scientists concluded, is that active,
traditional lifestyles may not protect against obesity if diets
change to promote increased caloric consumption. That is, even active
people will pack on pounds if they eat like most of us in the West."


That's exactly what I've been saying. *You just cant read for
comprehension.


You must have been saying it somewhere else,
because you sure haven't been saying it here.




Then we have this:
"People stick with low-calorie diets more readily than they continue
with exercise to drop pounds."


Maybe true, but diet hasn't proven successful in stopping the obesity
epidemic either.


Have I said it has? *Really, you're a piece of work.


No, but you just continue to say personal responsibility
works. Obviously it hasn't worked in helping stop the
obesity epidemic. That is the point I made. That is the
point Doug made. Capiche?

There are logical reasons for this, which I explained.
I think Doug explained it too. But of course you just
reject it.





And following Doggie's logic, both are just an
issue of "personal responsibility" so it's irrelevant how easy or
hard it is to follow.


More straw men! I didn't say degree if difficulty is irrelevant, I
said the issue is personal responsibility. *Period.


Are you as sure about that as you are that HIV
doesn't cause AIDS?





And this:


"One of the few studies ever to have scrupulously monitored exercise,
food intake and metabolic rates found that volunteers basal metabolic
rates dropped as they lost weight, even though they exercised every
day. As a result, although they were burning up to 500 calories during
an exercise session, their total daily caloric burn was lower than it
would have been had their metabolism remained unchanged, and they lost
less weight than had been expected."


Two things worth noting there. *Number one is that while excercising
they were burning 500 calories. *The other is the statement that this
study is one of the few studies like this ever done.


And now you're *complaining* about studies?!


Not complaining. Just pointing out that they say only
a few studies on the subject have even been done.
So, I don't pretend to know all the answers. You on
the other hand claim you do, no studies required.





Make up your freakin' mind.

So,
sounds like the answer is we don't know exactly what is going on.


Of course we do! The study showed that many people gain weight when
they exercise.


The report on the study that you provided the link to
does not say the study showed that at all. But at
least for once you have a link to something. Now if
you could just learn to read what is there instead of
making it up.....





And then we end with this gem:


" She is perhaps her own best advertisement. In the past few years,
she s shed 70 pounds and, using her formulas for how many calories
she s actually burning each day thanks to a daily walk, has regained
none of it."


But it says ZERO about her diet! Plus, she didn't lose the weight
through exercise. It was through diet (counting calories is a form of
diet).


We're not taking about her diet. We're talking about the
fact that she includes walking excercise as part of her
weight loss program. Ergo, the article concludes with
endorsing excercise as part of a weight loss and
maintenance program. Exactly the opposite of what
you claim. And it would be pretty rare for an article
to conclude with talking about exercise if all it did
was make you gain weight, eh?




Only a moron could come to that conclusion, which is why it's a waste
of time discussing anything with you.


Yes, it's a waste of time for you to discuss anything with
anyone with even reasonable intelligence. Because you can't
fool them with your nonsense and they demolish your crap
again and again. Unable to provide any links to science
that supports your positions, you turn to name calling.
That leaves you in a tiny group of losers. Loser who
believe:

HIV doesn't cause AIDS
HIV is harmless
No virus can cause cancer
HPV is not a cause of cervical cancer.

The list of ignorance grows daily. Now go ahead, compare yourself
to Galileo.





BUT REPEATED STUDIES HAVE SHOWN THAT MANY PEOPLE WHO BEGIN AN EXERCISE
PROGRAM LOSE LITTLE OR NO WEIGHT. SOME GAIN."


Just like repeated studies show the within a year or
two the vast majority of people fail at whatever diet they
try and regain the weight or more.


  #4  
Old August 4th, 2012, 12:47 AM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
[email protected]
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Posts: 993
Default Dieting vs. Exercise for Weight Loss

On Aug 3, 7:25*pm, Dogman wrote:
On Fri, 3 Aug 2012 16:00:36 -0700 (PDT), "





wrote:
On Aug 3, 6:21 pm, Dogman wrote:


Of course, as usual, if one reads the actual article instead
of relying on your hysteria, the research doesn't say what
you or even the authors say it does. What the researchers
concluded was this:


"The implication, the scientists concluded, is that active,
traditional lifestyles may not protect against obesity if diets
change to promote increased caloric consumption. That is, even active
people will pack on pounds if they eat like most of us in the West."


That's exactly what I've been saying. You just cant read for
comprehension.


No you said excercise won't help one lose weight, period.
The above doesn't say any such thing and is something very different,.



And now you're *complaining* about studies?!


Not complaining. *Just pointing out that the article

says only
a few studies on the subject have even been done.


How many studies do *you* have that say otherwise?


I'm not the one making the claim that exercise while
dieting doesn't lead to increased weight loss. You
are. Ergo, it's up to you to come up with the studies.
The one article that you provided TALKS about a study
and concludes with exactly the opposite, basicly
ending with an endorsement of exercise.



Make up your freakin' mind.


So,
sounds like the answer is we don't know exactly what is going on.


Of course we do! The study showed that many people gain weight when
they exercise.


The report on the study that you provided the link to
does not say the study showed that at all. * But at
least for once you have a link to something. * Now if
you could just learn to read what is there instead of
making it up.....


The articles words speak for themselves.


Yes and the article doesn't say what you claimed it
does. And in fact it concludes with endorsing excercise
as part of a weight loss program.


And then we end with this gem:


" She is perhaps her own best advertisement. In the past few years,
she s shed 70 pounds and, using her formulas for how many calories
she s actually burning each day thanks to a daily walk, has regained
none of it."


But it says ZERO about her diet! Plus, she didn't lose the weight
through exercise. It was through diet (counting calories is a form of
diet).


We're not taking about her diet. *We're talking about the
fact that she includes walking excercise as part of her
weight loss program.


Yet she said:

"But repeated studies have shown that many people who begin an
exercise program lose little or no weight. Some gain."

Focus on those words, say them slowly, and see if, over the nxt few
days or weeks, they eventually make some sense to you. *Feel free to
hire a tutor!


Just like study after study has shown that at 1 or 2 years
after starting a diet, people have similarly failed and
put the weight back on and maybe more too.

Capiche?



Only a moron could come to that conclusion, which is why it's a waste
of time discussing anything with you.


Yes, it's a waste of time for you to discuss anything with
anyone with even reasonable intelligence.


That would mean that we couldn't discuss anything, right, because
you're waaaaay below the "reasonable intelligence" line.

Yet I persist, mostly because it's really fun to make a fool out of
you.


Yes, tell everyone here one more time how
HIV isn't the cause of AIDS. Tell them how it's
caused by lack of sleep. Tell them how no virus
can cause cancer. I want everyone to see
what you are and then they can judge for themselves.

What, you're not going to compare yourself to
Galileo again for us?


 




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