entemans, sugar, "treats" being "good" and "fat people"

Interesting reading on the thread about the LC "goodies"... reading
the group here it becomes clear that a few change forever and most
"try to change" and cling to their old ways and ideas.

5 or 6 who seem to have eliminated sugar who I know here at school
have had longer term success than the ones who have a "small portion"
of their "treats" and time and time again speak on how they "cheated"
or "weren't "good".

Talking to my classmates and friends (and watching the support groups
of other poor behaviors) it becomes clear that while with food you
can't simply stop eating (like you can smoking) you can stop eating
the foods that aren't good for you... even with family and friends
observing and trying to influence your actions...

But there does seem to be a secret that is beyond Atkins (at least
after induction) and that seems to be ELIMINATION OF SUGAR...
overweight people don't have a "normal" reaction to it and then when
they put it back even in moderation after induction many don't really
stay on the losing trend...

That's why so many fear even going off of induction, and then before
you know it they quit.. so perhaps the snswer is:

Eliminate sugars of all types (fruit, breads, milks, etc)...

I have 2 suitemates who did it and don't have the cravings they
had...and yes, they are taking vitamins to make up for the lack of
certain things a body needs.

Just my opinion, but I got a feeling that those who keep "celebrating"
LC fast food and LC "treats" ain't goin' anywhere but back up on the
scale...think of it as a MEDICAL not a DIET issue: sugar in your
system doesn't work like it does for thin people...for some reason it
just hangs around then gives you both mental and physical cravings for
the beast to be fed again...

Time for SPRING BREAK...

Remember: no excuses... just try a few weeks with no sugars of any
sort (or as little as you can)...you just might change your life!

BYEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!

Katie K

Yer a freakin' genius.

--
Most of us probably aren't in danger of eating too little.

Becky P.

"katie k" wrote in message
om...
Interesting reading on the thread about the LC "goodies"... reading
the group here it becomes clear that a few change forever and most
"try to change" and cling to their old ways and ideas.

5 or 6 who seem to have eliminated sugar who I know here at school
have had longer term success than the ones who have a "small portion"
of their "treats" and time and time again speak on how they "cheated"
or "weren't "good".

Talking to my classmates and friends (and watching the support groups
of other poor behaviors) it becomes clear that while with food you
can't simply stop eating (like you can smoking) you can stop eating
the foods that aren't good for you... even with family and friends
observing and trying to influence your actions...

But there does seem to be a secret that is beyond Atkins (at least
after induction) and that seems to be ELIMINATION OF SUGAR...
overweight people don't have a "normal" reaction to it and then when
they put it back even in moderation after induction many don't really
stay on the losing trend...

That's why so many fear even going off of induction, and then before
you know it they quit.. so perhaps the snswer is:

Eliminate sugars of all types (fruit, breads, milks, etc)...

I have 2 suitemates who did it and don't have the cravings they
had...and yes, they are taking vitamins to make up for the lack of
certain things a body needs.

Just my opinion, but I got a feeling that those who keep "celebrating"
LC fast food and LC "treats" ain't goin' anywhere but back up on the
scale...think of it as a MEDICAL not a DIET issue: sugar in your
system doesn't work like it does for thin people...for some reason it
just hangs around then gives you both mental and physical cravings for
the beast to be fed again...

Time for SPRING BREAK...

Remember: no excuses... just try a few weeks with no sugars of any
sort (or as little as you can)...you just might change your life!

BYEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!

Katie K

You will succeed because you have the right frame of mind. Most people I
know that failed did so because of these so called low carb treats which are
pretty much all crap. You will be able to "treat" yourself to the next
smaller size while the people around you try to figure out how you did it.
Kudos.

CM

"JC Der Koenig" wrote in message
news
Yer a freakin' genius.

--
Most of us probably aren't in danger of eating too little.

Becky P.

"katie k" wrote in message
om...
Interesting reading on the thread about the LC "goodies"... reading
the group here it becomes clear that a few change forever and most
"try to change" and cling to their old ways and ideas.

5 or 6 who seem to have eliminated sugar who I know here at school
have had longer term success than the ones who have a "small portion"
of their "treats" and time and time again speak on how they "cheated"
or "weren't "good".

Talking to my classmates and friends (and watching the support groups
of other poor behaviors) it becomes clear that while with food you
can't simply stop eating (like you can smoking) you can stop eating
the foods that aren't good for you... even with family and friends
observing and trying to influence your actions...

But there does seem to be a secret that is beyond Atkins (at least
after induction) and that seems to be ELIMINATION OF SUGAR...
overweight people don't have a "normal" reaction to it and then when
they put it back even in moderation after induction many don't really
stay on the losing trend...

That's why so many fear even going off of induction, and then before
you know it they quit.. so perhaps the snswer is:

Eliminate sugars of all types (fruit, breads, milks, etc)...

I have 2 suitemates who did it and don't have the cravings they
had...and yes, they are taking vitamins to make up for the lack of
certain things a body needs.

Just my opinion, but I got a feeling that those who keep "celebrating"
LC fast food and LC "treats" ain't goin' anywhere but back up on the
scale...think of it as a MEDICAL not a DIET issue: sugar in your
system doesn't work like it does for thin people...for some reason it
just hangs around then gives you both mental and physical cravings for
the beast to be fed again...

Time for SPRING BREAK...

Remember: no excuses... just try a few weeks with no sugars of any
sort (or as little as you can)...you just might change your life!

BYEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!

Katie K

On 13 Mar 2004 05:48:17 -0800, (katie k) wrote:

Interesting reading on the thread about the LC "goodies"... reading
the group here it becomes clear that a few change forever and most
"try to change" and cling to their old ways and ideas.

5 or 6 who seem to have eliminated sugar who I know here at school
have had longer term success than the ones who have a "small portion"
of their "treats" and time and time again speak on how they "cheated"
or "weren't "good".

Talking to my classmates and friends (and watching the support groups
of other poor behaviors) it becomes clear that while with food you
can't simply stop eating (like you can smoking) you can stop eating
the foods that aren't good for you... even with family and friends
observing and trying to influence your actions...

But there does seem to be a secret that is beyond Atkins (at least
after induction) and that seems to be ELIMINATION OF SUGAR...
overweight people don't have a "normal" reaction to it and then when
they put it back even in moderation after induction many don't really
stay on the losing trend...

That's why so many fear even going off of induction, and then before
you know it they quit.. so perhaps the snswer is:

Eliminate sugars of all types (fruit, breads, milks, etc)...

I have 2 suitemates who did it and don't have the cravings they
had...and yes, they are taking vitamins to make up for the lack of
certain things a body needs.

Just my opinion, but I got a feeling that those who keep "celebrating"
LC fast food and LC "treats" ain't goin' anywhere but back up on the
scale...think of it as a MEDICAL not a DIET issue: sugar in your
system doesn't work like it does for thin people...for some reason it
just hangs around then gives you both mental and physical cravings for
the beast to be fed again...

Time for SPRING BREAK...

Remember: no excuses... just try a few weeks with no sugars of any
sort (or as little as you can)...you just might change your life!

BYEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!

Katie K

How about the sugar in berries? Carrots? ....

PJx wrote:

On 13 Mar 2004 05:48:17 -0800, (katie k) wrote:

Remember: no excuses... just try a few weeks with no sugars of any
sort (or as little as you can)...you just might change your life!

BYEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!

Katie K

How about the sugar in berries? Carrots? ....

I've actually gone without berries, carrots, artificial sweeteners,
or sugar of any description, OR junky foods with additives, for
months and months. By the time I finally did start adding
blueberries back, they tasted like a *major* sugar blast!
I used to think blueberries were "mildly sweet" but after
re-conditioning my body to like the food it's *meant* to like, it
was to me what snickers bars are to most people.

By the time my body isn't constantly drip-fed sweet things on a
daily basis the taste buds adjust accordingly. It was getting to
the point where cucumbers tasted extremely sweet to me.

People are often afraid to see what their taste buds will do when
left to their own natural devices. It's understandable. The idea
that a cucumber could end up tasting like watermelon used to, was
once one I scoffed at, myself. Until I tried it, seriously, on myself.

CM

Even though I think this person is a troll, I can't help but wonder if maybe
she's right. If so I will never make it long term on this WOE.
Unlike Crafting Mom, I cannot imagine going for the rest of my life without
sourdough bread, carrots, peas, birhday cake (on birthday's), watermelon or
corn on the cob. People 30 years ago or so did not have the kind of weight
problems we have today, in the numbers we have today. But they ate all of
those things and more. What's the answer here? Are others here ready to give
up all those things, not in just the short term, but forever? Is that what's
neccessary? I find that very discouraging. I don't know that it would be
worth it to me. I don't want to be 350 pounds, but I also don't want to live
like a monk. Giving up every enjoyable treat so that I can have a 38 waist.
I don't know if I'm rationalizing or what. I don't really have an
uncontrolable urge to run out and start wolfing down high carb foods. Maybe
JC was right when he got ****ed off at me and said I would always be fat.
I'm very confused today.
--
Bear
Grrrrrrrrrrrr )
297/264.5/210
http://home.earthlink.net/~polarbear50/







"katie k" wrote in message
om...
Interesting reading on the thread about the LC "goodies"... reading
the group here it becomes clear that a few change forever and most
"try to change" and cling to their old ways and ideas.

5 or 6 who seem to have eliminated sugar who I know here at school
have had longer term success than the ones who have a "small portion"
of their "treats" and time and time again speak on how they "cheated"
or "weren't "good".

Talking to my classmates and friends (and watching the support groups
of other poor behaviors) it becomes clear that while with food you
can't simply stop eating (like you can smoking) you can stop eating
the foods that aren't good for you... even with family and friends
observing and trying to influence your actions...

But there does seem to be a secret that is beyond Atkins (at least
after induction) and that seems to be ELIMINATION OF SUGAR...
overweight people don't have a "normal" reaction to it and then when
they put it back even in moderation after induction many don't really
stay on the losing trend...

That's why so many fear even going off of induction, and then before
you know it they quit.. so perhaps the snswer is:

Eliminate sugars of all types (fruit, breads, milks, etc)...

I have 2 suitemates who did it and don't have the cravings they
had...and yes, they are taking vitamins to make up for the lack of
certain things a body needs.

Just my opinion, but I got a feeling that those who keep "celebrating"
LC fast food and LC "treats" ain't goin' anywhere but back up on the
scale...think of it as a MEDICAL not a DIET issue: sugar in your
system doesn't work like it does for thin people...for some reason it
just hangs around then gives you both mental and physical cravings for
the beast to be fed again...

Time for SPRING BREAK...

Remember: no excuses... just try a few weeks with no sugars of any
sort (or as little as you can)...you just might change your life!

BYEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!

Katie K

Back then, they ate less and exercised more. It's a fact.

--
Most of us probably aren't in danger of eating too little.

Becky P.

"Bear" wrote in message
hlink.net...
Even though I think this person is a troll, I can't help but wonder if
maybe
she's right. If so I will never make it long term on this WOE.
Unlike Crafting Mom, I cannot imagine going for the rest of my life
without
sourdough bread, carrots, peas, birhday cake (on birthday's), watermelon
or
corn on the cob. People 30 years ago or so did not have the kind of weight
problems we have today, in the numbers we have today. But they ate all of
those things and more. What's the answer here? Are others here ready to
give
up all those things, not in just the short term, but forever? Is that
what's
neccessary? I find that very discouraging. I don't know that it would be
worth it to me. I don't want to be 350 pounds, but I also don't want to
live
like a monk. Giving up every enjoyable treat so that I can have a 38
waist.
I don't know if I'm rationalizing or what. I don't really have an
uncontrolable urge to run out and start wolfing down high carb foods.
Maybe
JC was right when he got ****ed off at me and said I would always be fat.
I'm very confused today.
--
Bear
Grrrrrrrrrrrr )
297/264.5/210
http://home.earthlink.net/~polarbear50/







"katie k" wrote in message
om...
Interesting reading on the thread about the LC "goodies"... reading
the group here it becomes clear that a few change forever and most
"try to change" and cling to their old ways and ideas.

5 or 6 who seem to have eliminated sugar who I know here at school
have had longer term success than the ones who have a "small portion"
of their "treats" and time and time again speak on how they "cheated"
or "weren't "good".

Talking to my classmates and friends (and watching the support groups
of other poor behaviors) it becomes clear that while with food you
can't simply stop eating (like you can smoking) you can stop eating
the foods that aren't good for you... even with family and friends
observing and trying to influence your actions...

But there does seem to be a secret that is beyond Atkins (at least
after induction) and that seems to be ELIMINATION OF SUGAR...
overweight people don't have a "normal" reaction to it and then when
they put it back even in moderation after induction many don't really
stay on the losing trend...

That's why so many fear even going off of induction, and then before
you know it they quit.. so perhaps the snswer is:

Eliminate sugars of all types (fruit, breads, milks, etc)...

I have 2 suitemates who did it and don't have the cravings they
had...and yes, they are taking vitamins to make up for the lack of
certain things a body needs.

Just my opinion, but I got a feeling that those who keep "celebrating"
LC fast food and LC "treats" ain't goin' anywhere but back up on the
scale...think of it as a MEDICAL not a DIET issue: sugar in your
system doesn't work like it does for thin people...for some reason it
just hangs around then gives you both mental and physical cravings for
the beast to be fed again...

Time for SPRING BREAK...

Remember: no excuses... just try a few weeks with no sugars of any
sort (or as little as you can)...you just might change your life!

BYEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!

Katie K

Bear,

Don't be confused. This is an individual path and you will find what will work
for you.

There are a lot of low carb diet nazi's on this board that think there is only
ONE way to low carb and it's their way. Any other way will insure failure.
It's not true.

The important thing is to know yourself and to learn what will work for you.

I'm with you. I see no good reason to have to give up all treats forever and
ever.
Can they be a regular part of my food plan? NO!
Can I have a cupcake or a slice of cake on my birthday? Yes. Can I have a whole
cake in the house? Nope... cause I"ll eat it. Will I buy a cake and then
send it home with other people who can eat it? yes.

Usually, for my birthday or a special event, I'd rather treat myself to a good
seafood dinner than a piece of cake but every rare once in a while the
chocolate cake sounds better. .... it works for me.

I don't keep junk food in the house and I rarely want it. And to be honest,
even when I'm wanting "junk" the stuff that is available isn't worth it. Now
maybe if it was really excellent I'd be more willing to make an exception but
even then it would be exactly that... a rare exception.

Eating one slice of birthday cake on a "rare" occassion isn't going to make you
fat

If you make those occassions the rule rather than the exception then you're
courting failure.
I have so many birthday's to celebrate in the month of september that I could
easily gain 20#s so I choose to eat a good low carb mean before going to the
celebration so I'm not hungry and easily tempted.
Perhaps if I'm feeling a bit depressed and feeling the need to self medicate
with food instead of going for chocolate cake I'll pick up some shrimp or try
one of the great recipes that I've gotten off of this board. I'll get my
"treat", feel better and not have sabotaged myself.

For me I can't have milk in the house. I can easily drink 1/2 a gallon or more
daily.
I'll have the low carb "dairy beverage" in the house on occassion but dont'
feel like I can have it in here all the time. For some people milk etc is not
an issue and it will go bad in their house.
It's all individual.
I appreciate having lower carb versions of foods like bread available but once
again you have to know yourself. I can have regular super market lower carb
bread in the house without a problem. My mom gave me a loaf of Great Harvest
Breads low carb white bread (5 grams per slice) and it was too good. LOL. I
won't have it in my house on a regular basis. I go through it way too fast.

It's all a learning process. Stick to the basics and real food (low carb) and
you'll do great.
The world will not come to an end if you have the occassional treat.
Ignore the food police (both low fat and low carb versions of the food nazi's).
There are a lot of people in the world who enjoy spewing their opinion out for
all to see and try to make people who don't agree feel bad. Don't fall for it.
They aren't people you'd want to associate with anyway.

JC was not right when he said you would always be fat unless you let him be.
Prove him wrong. You've already done a great job. You know how. It's just a
matter of implementing it on a daily basis. Sort of like an alcoholic. You just
do it now and don't put stumbling blocks in your way.

Personally, I think fitting into my lower size jeans and not having the triple
by-pass that I was destined for "tastes" a lot better than most high carb
treats. It doesn't however, keep me in a straight jacket. I can live my life,
make my choices and live with the consequences. The occassional treat doesn't
immediately throw me into jeans two sizes larger or send my triglycerides sky
high. I've found what works for me. I"m happy. I don't really care what anyone
else thinks. I hope you can find that same thing.

Good luck!!

Susan
aka turtlebeachgal







Even though I think this person is a troll, I can't help but wonder if maybe
she's right. If so I will never make it long term on this WOE.
Unlike Crafting Mom, I cannot imagine going for the rest of my life without
sourdough bread, carrots, peas, birhday cake (on birthday's), watermelon or
corn on the cob. People 30 years ago or so did not have the kind of weight
problems we have today, in the numbers we have today. But they ate all of
those things and more.

They also tended to do a lot more physical labor.




What's the answer here? Are others here ready to give
up all those things, not in just the short term, but forever? Is that what's
neccessary? I find that very discouraging. I don't know that it would be
worth it to me. I don't want to be 350 pounds, but I also don't want to live
like a monk. Giving up every enjoyable treat so that I can have a 38 waist.
I don't know if I'm rationalizing or what. I don't really have an
uncontrolable urge to run out and start wolfing down high carb foods. Maybe
JC was right when he got ****ed off at me and said I would always be fat.
I'm very confused today.

On Sat, 13 Mar 2004 18:10:19 GMT, "Bear"
wrote:
Maybe JC was right when he got ****ed off at me and said I would always be fat.
I'm very confused today.
Bear

Confused? Sure you're confused. Who among us has all the answers?
When you think you have the answer sheet in hand, the questions
change. That's life. But, if you wanna succeed you will succeed.

NEVER accept external negative programming. You will not always be
fat if you have chosen to be thinner. It may take you longer to
achieve your goal than others. However, getting to where YOU want to
be is up to you. You're still in the early stages of understanding
how your body responds to different foods. You're still learning how
to accept portion control as part of eating behavior. You have yet to
push your body down to goal weight and find a comfortable level of
maintenance caloric intake and exercise.

People throw around the bromide "your body - your science experiment".
However, experimenting and learning about your body and how it
responds to various stimuli forms the matrix of success.

Don't stop learning and never give up your dreams. BTW you may find
that you willingly give up some or most of those foods you currently
believe are an all important part of a future menu. By retraining
your body and mind you may find that you become satisfied with
miniscule portions of high quality versions of hitherto "forbidden"
foods. The answers are out there. Never give up.


Lee Rodgers
Lowcarb Retreat http://www.lowcarb.org
CHATroom http://www.lowcarb.org/parachat.html
Low-Carb Connoisseur puts the dash in low-carb
http://www.low-carb.com

Bear wrote:
:: Even though I think this person is a troll, I can't help but wonder
:: if maybe she's right. If so I will never make it long term on this
:: WOE.
:: Unlike Crafting Mom, I cannot imagine going for the rest of my life
:: without sourdough bread, carrots, peas, birhday cake (on
:: birthday's), watermelon or corn on the cob.

I can live the rest of my life without any of those foods, and many others.
However, I don't have to do that to control my weight or maintain my health.

People 30 years ago or
:: so did not have the kind of weight problems we have today, in the
:: numbers we have today. But they ate all of those things and more.
:: What's the answer here?

It's not just about what you eat, it's about what you eat, how much you eat,
how often you eat it, whether you exercise, etc. Also, if you don't
actively strive to keep fit, you won't.

:: Are others here ready to give up all those
:: things, not in just the short term, but forever?

How about 85 to 95% of forever? Would that be so hard? Remember, every
time you eat something it does not have to a mouth orgy. What about eating
simply to maintain health most of the time? If you do that, and get plenty
of exercise on a regular basis, you can have those foods 5 to 15% of the
time, but you must *always* be mindful.

In this post, you're expressing what seems like a love affair with food.

:: Is that what's
:: neccessary?

No.

:: I find that very discouraging.

That part, imo, is a problem.

I don't know that it
:: would be worth it to me. I don't want to be 350 pounds, but I also
:: don't want to live like a monk.

See....so living without corn on the cob is like never having sex? Both of
those are things that can be easily done, BTW.

Giving up every enjoyable treat so
:: that I can have a 38 waist. I don't know if I'm rationalizing or
:: what. I don't really have an uncontrolable urge to run out and start
:: wolfing down high carb foods.

:: Maybe JC was right when he got ****ed
:: off at me and said I would always be fat.

JC is not God nor does he have a crystal ball that works. But the question
of whether you will be fat or not lies solely in your hands. It's your
choice, Bear, and you will have to find what it takes for you, if you choose
that path.

:: I'm very confused today. --

Dietary perfection is not needed. You have not died and gone to hell.
However, dietary control is needed, as well as a strong eye toward
maintaining/improving health via regular exercise. IMO.