Atkins Diet

"Ignoramus24206" wrote in message
...
Well, all diets are restrictive in some way or another.

Yes, because that's the definition of a "diet". But I still believe there
are other way to deal with the problem.

Well, a formerly fat person needs to be on some sort of diet for the
rest of his or her life, to maintain weight loss, right?

Why? What's so special in a former fat person vs a normal person? The normal
person will not need to be on a diet for the rest of her life, she's not
eating anything special to maintain her weight. Actually, most are able to
maintain their weight on whatever cooking style they feel like - including
eat potato chips all day long. So, in essence, you're assuming that there is
something special in that former obese person that prevents her from being
"normal". She's not cured, she's merely on a life long "medication" that
hides her obese condition. Exactly like someone with AIDS who is taking a
tritherapy. The diet has not turned that fat obese person into a slim
person, it has merely turned her into a slim obese.
If you believe that, you're believing that either obesity is a 100% genetic
disease or that it is somehow acquired and uncurable. That's one hypothesis.
Another is that obesity is multi-factorial : genetics, cultural,
psychological... If so, most factors can be changed through proper therapy.
This means you should be able to *cure* obesity instead of merely fixing it,
like diets do.

The key question, if one loses weight on Atkins, would one then be
able to switch to some other way of controlling weight, and control it.

I expect the move to be cahotic. If you're after the biological only
hypothesis, you're going to switch the body through a whole spectrum of
"unhealthy" habits. Like, increasing carbs beyond the limit to switch from
low carb to low fat.
If you believe in the multi-factorial hypothesis, you're switching the whole
person from one belief system (carbs are evil, fats are good) to another
(carbs are good, fats are evil). I would expect such a switch to be
problematic and an occasion for loss of control.

if the choise is between making some adjustments to family eating,
versus dying earlier and living with diseases, then I would choose
making adjustments. Besides, they are not terribly difficult. Being
fat is more difficult.

That's because you're part of the majority. Being cut from your ethnic group
and history when you're part of a minority can be very problematic. Remember
that for some groups, they way they eat is *who* they are - for instance
with Jews or Indians. For an Indian to go on Atkins, it would mean to go
against a few thousands years of dietetic teachings that are both familly
lore and religious values. For Jews, the peculiar eating habits is what has
allowed them to keep their identity and specificities despite being
country-less. Same for European muslims - many do not practice *except* for
their eating habits. It's like telling your Roman Catholic familly that you
have turned gay.
Also, the USA nowadays have a rather weak cultural cuisine, which is quite a
pity actually (and is maybe one of the reason why obesity is so high there).
That's not so true in other parts of the world. Many countries have a strong
link between cuisine and national identity. I suspect it might actually be
easier for an Irish to be fat than to stop drinking Guiness altogether. At
least, being fat lets you have friends and it lets you feel like a full
featured Irish It might be worth wondering if they actually do have to
make these sacrifices. Because there are plenty of rather slim people who do
drink Guiness after all...

"Ignoramus24206" wrote in message
...
Well, all diets are restrictive in some way or another.

Yes, because that's the definition of a "diet". But I still believe there
are other way to deal with the problem.

Well, a formerly fat person needs to be on some sort of diet for the
rest of his or her life, to maintain weight loss, right?

Why? What's so special in a former fat person vs a normal person? The normal
person will not need to be on a diet for the rest of her life, she's not
eating anything special to maintain her weight. Actually, most are able to
maintain their weight on whatever cooking style they feel like - including
eat potato chips all day long. So, in essence, you're assuming that there is
something special in that former obese person that prevents her from being
"normal". She's not cured, she's merely on a life long "medication" that
hides her obese condition. Exactly like someone with AIDS who is taking a
tritherapy. The diet has not turned that fat obese person into a slim
person, it has merely turned her into a slim obese.
If you believe that, you're believing that either obesity is a 100% genetic
disease or that it is somehow acquired and uncurable. That's one hypothesis.
Another is that obesity is multi-factorial : genetics, cultural,
psychological... If so, most factors can be changed through proper therapy.
This means you should be able to *cure* obesity instead of merely fixing it,
like diets do.

The key question, if one loses weight on Atkins, would one then be
able to switch to some other way of controlling weight, and control it.

I expect the move to be cahotic. If you're after the biological only
hypothesis, you're going to switch the body through a whole spectrum of
"unhealthy" habits. Like, increasing carbs beyond the limit to switch from
low carb to low fat.
If you believe in the multi-factorial hypothesis, you're switching the whole
person from one belief system (carbs are evil, fats are good) to another
(carbs are good, fats are evil). I would expect such a switch to be
problematic and an occasion for loss of control.

if the choise is between making some adjustments to family eating,
versus dying earlier and living with diseases, then I would choose
making adjustments. Besides, they are not terribly difficult. Being
fat is more difficult.

That's because you're part of the majority. Being cut from your ethnic group
and history when you're part of a minority can be very problematic. Remember
that for some groups, they way they eat is *who* they are - for instance
with Jews or Indians. For an Indian to go on Atkins, it would mean to go
against a few thousands years of dietetic teachings that are both familly
lore and religious values. For Jews, the peculiar eating habits is what has
allowed them to keep their identity and specificities despite being
country-less. Same for European muslims - many do not practice *except* for
their eating habits. It's like telling your Roman Catholic familly that you
have turned gay.
Also, the USA nowadays have a rather weak cultural cuisine, which is quite a
pity actually (and is maybe one of the reason why obesity is so high there).
That's not so true in other parts of the world. Many countries have a strong
link between cuisine and national identity. I suspect it might actually be
easier for an Irish to be fat than to stop drinking Guiness altogether. At
least, being fat lets you have friends and it lets you feel like a full
featured Irish It might be worth wondering if they actually do have to
make these sacrifices. Because there are plenty of rather slim people who do
drink Guiness after all...

"Ignoramus24206" wrote in message
...
Well, all diets are restrictive in some way or another.

Yes, because that's the definition of a "diet". But I still believe there
are other way to deal with the problem.

Well, a formerly fat person needs to be on some sort of diet for the
rest of his or her life, to maintain weight loss, right?

Why? What's so special in a former fat person vs a normal person? The normal
person will not need to be on a diet for the rest of her life, she's not
eating anything special to maintain her weight. Actually, most are able to
maintain their weight on whatever cooking style they feel like - including
eat potato chips all day long. So, in essence, you're assuming that there is
something special in that former obese person that prevents her from being
"normal". She's not cured, she's merely on a life long "medication" that
hides her obese condition. Exactly like someone with AIDS who is taking a
tritherapy. The diet has not turned that fat obese person into a slim
person, it has merely turned her into a slim obese.
If you believe that, you're believing that either obesity is a 100% genetic
disease or that it is somehow acquired and uncurable. That's one hypothesis.
Another is that obesity is multi-factorial : genetics, cultural,
psychological... If so, most factors can be changed through proper therapy.
This means you should be able to *cure* obesity instead of merely fixing it,
like diets do.

The key question, if one loses weight on Atkins, would one then be
able to switch to some other way of controlling weight, and control it.

I expect the move to be cahotic. If you're after the biological only
hypothesis, you're going to switch the body through a whole spectrum of
"unhealthy" habits. Like, increasing carbs beyond the limit to switch from
low carb to low fat.
If you believe in the multi-factorial hypothesis, you're switching the whole
person from one belief system (carbs are evil, fats are good) to another
(carbs are good, fats are evil). I would expect such a switch to be
problematic and an occasion for loss of control.

if the choise is between making some adjustments to family eating,
versus dying earlier and living with diseases, then I would choose
making adjustments. Besides, they are not terribly difficult. Being
fat is more difficult.

That's because you're part of the majority. Being cut from your ethnic group
and history when you're part of a minority can be very problematic. Remember
that for some groups, they way they eat is *who* they are - for instance
with Jews or Indians. For an Indian to go on Atkins, it would mean to go
against a few thousands years of dietetic teachings that are both familly
lore and religious values. For Jews, the peculiar eating habits is what has
allowed them to keep their identity and specificities despite being
country-less. Same for European muslims - many do not practice *except* for
their eating habits. It's like telling your Roman Catholic familly that you
have turned gay.
Also, the USA nowadays have a rather weak cultural cuisine, which is quite a
pity actually (and is maybe one of the reason why obesity is so high there).
That's not so true in other parts of the world. Many countries have a strong
link between cuisine and national identity. I suspect it might actually be
easier for an Irish to be fat than to stop drinking Guiness altogether. At
least, being fat lets you have friends and it lets you feel like a full
featured Irish It might be worth wondering if they actually do have to
make these sacrifices. Because there are plenty of rather slim people who do
drink Guiness after all...

Lictor wrote:
If you ask an Indian or Japanese never to eat rice again, you're
making his familly life difficult.

However, if said Indian or Japanese person went to their doctor, and
they discovered (as an extreme hypothetical example), a deadly allergy
to rice, said person would say "No problem!"

I used to be on a real low carb diet, but now I eat more variety in my
diet, and yes, I will eat something with my friends. The reason I feel
comfortable doing so, is because during times when for one reason or
another I said "no", they respected that.

While food is a part of North American culture, it is not a means of
communication grin, people can say out loud, in verbal terms, that for
health reasons they are not eating certain ingredient at this time,
and if people are true friends they'll go "Hey no problem, I'm just glad
to have you here anyway".

Lictor wrote:
If you ask an Indian or Japanese never to eat rice again, you're
making his familly life difficult.

However, if said Indian or Japanese person went to their doctor, and
they discovered (as an extreme hypothetical example), a deadly allergy
to rice, said person would say "No problem!"

I used to be on a real low carb diet, but now I eat more variety in my
diet, and yes, I will eat something with my friends. The reason I feel
comfortable doing so, is because during times when for one reason or
another I said "no", they respected that.

While food is a part of North American culture, it is not a means of
communication grin, people can say out loud, in verbal terms, that for
health reasons they are not eating certain ingredient at this time,
and if people are true friends they'll go "Hey no problem, I'm just glad
to have you here anyway".

Lictor wrote:
If you ask an Indian or Japanese never to eat rice again, you're
making his familly life difficult.

However, if said Indian or Japanese person went to their doctor, and
they discovered (as an extreme hypothetical example), a deadly allergy
to rice, said person would say "No problem!"

I used to be on a real low carb diet, but now I eat more variety in my
diet, and yes, I will eat something with my friends. The reason I feel
comfortable doing so, is because during times when for one reason or
another I said "no", they respected that.

While food is a part of North American culture, it is not a means of
communication grin, people can say out loud, in verbal terms, that for
health reasons they are not eating certain ingredient at this time,
and if people are true friends they'll go "Hey no problem, I'm just glad
to have you here anyway".

Lictor wrote:
That's because you're part of the majority. Being cut from your ethnic group
and history when you're part of a minority can be very problematic.

Rant mode on...

There is a lot more to ethnicity than food. I get so sick of the "Waah
waah waah all my friends won't like me, nobody will understaaaaand,
there's so much peeeeeeer pressure!"

So, a person growing up and standing up for their own body's personal
well being offends someone.... well, to that I answer, tough! How badly
does this person want me around say, 5 years from now... 20 years from
now.

True and honest caring comes from people NOTICING AND OBSERVING what
other people need and respecting it! A self absorbed person will say
"What do you MEAN, you're not eating my grandmother's famous recipe for
peanutbutter peach strawberry ratatatah with rice? How rude of YOU to
turn it down! Don't you know she gave me that recipe on her
DEATHBED???"

When people grow up and allow people to do the best good for themselves,
without the manipulative guilt tripping, then I will perceive them as
real and true friends and THEN wanting to be "part of their culture"
will be important to me.

If people are willing to compromise someone else's HEALTH, otherwise
have them be cut off from "culture", then they're not real friends.
They're people held prisoner by a stupid tradition.

Rant off....

Lictor wrote:
That's because you're part of the majority. Being cut from your ethnic group
and history when you're part of a minority can be very problematic.

Rant mode on...

There is a lot more to ethnicity than food. I get so sick of the "Waah
waah waah all my friends won't like me, nobody will understaaaaand,
there's so much peeeeeeer pressure!"

So, a person growing up and standing up for their own body's personal
well being offends someone.... well, to that I answer, tough! How badly
does this person want me around say, 5 years from now... 20 years from
now.

True and honest caring comes from people NOTICING AND OBSERVING what
other people need and respecting it! A self absorbed person will say
"What do you MEAN, you're not eating my grandmother's famous recipe for
peanutbutter peach strawberry ratatatah with rice? How rude of YOU to
turn it down! Don't you know she gave me that recipe on her
DEATHBED???"

When people grow up and allow people to do the best good for themselves,
without the manipulative guilt tripping, then I will perceive them as
real and true friends and THEN wanting to be "part of their culture"
will be important to me.

If people are willing to compromise someone else's HEALTH, otherwise
have them be cut off from "culture", then they're not real friends.
They're people held prisoner by a stupid tradition.

Rant off....

Lictor wrote:
That's because you're part of the majority. Being cut from your ethnic group
and history when you're part of a minority can be very problematic.

Rant mode on...

There is a lot more to ethnicity than food. I get so sick of the "Waah
waah waah all my friends won't like me, nobody will understaaaaand,
there's so much peeeeeeer pressure!"

So, a person growing up and standing up for their own body's personal
well being offends someone.... well, to that I answer, tough! How badly
does this person want me around say, 5 years from now... 20 years from
now.

True and honest caring comes from people NOTICING AND OBSERVING what
other people need and respecting it! A self absorbed person will say
"What do you MEAN, you're not eating my grandmother's famous recipe for
peanutbutter peach strawberry ratatatah with rice? How rude of YOU to
turn it down! Don't you know she gave me that recipe on her
DEATHBED???"

When people grow up and allow people to do the best good for themselves,
without the manipulative guilt tripping, then I will perceive them as
real and true friends and THEN wanting to be "part of their culture"
will be important to me.

If people are willing to compromise someone else's HEALTH, otherwise
have them be cut off from "culture", then they're not real friends.
They're people held prisoner by a stupid tradition.

Rant off....

"Crafting Mom" wrote in message
...
However, if said Indian or Japanese person went to their doctor, and
they discovered (as an extreme hypothetical example), a deadly allergy
to rice, said person would say "No problem!"

Maybe, or maybe not... Remind me of how many diabetics actually manage to
change their lifestyles?
And because he *must* make that change doesn't mean the change will be
without a cost. I don't know about the USA, but here it's not uncommon to
have people on anti-cholesterol diet becoming depressive after a while.
It's also not so rare for people with a strict diet to become overweight,
especially when that diet was forced on them as a kid, partly because of the
pain of being ostracized in their own familly (you know, having your special
meal, not being able to eat with the other kids...).

I used to be on a real low carb diet, but now I eat more variety in my
diet, and yes, I will eat something with my friends. The reason I feel
comfortable doing so, is because during times when for one reason or
another I said "no", they respected that.

But you live in a country where low carb is actually becoming the norm! So,
you are actually moving from one norm (industrialized version of the
traditionnal American diet) to another norm (low carb frenzy). You're also
in a country where the traditionnal cuisine has been destroyed by years of
industrial food and general surgeon good advices. People can't blame you for
not following traditions where there are not much traditions left to follow,
can they?

While food is a part of North American culture, it is not a means of
communication grin, people can say out loud, in verbal terms, that for
health reasons they are not eating certain ingredient at this time,
and if people are true friends they'll go "Hey no problem, I'm just glad
to have you here anyway".

What people say and what they think and what you think they think are
different things And what you feel about it is yet another issue. I mean,
even as someone who is on the process of losing weight, when I see the a
relative eat only a starter and nothing else at a restaurant, my first
thought is that she has no life (well, she *actually* has no life). Many
people will actually think that here, if you can't enjoy food, you're
obviously not enjoying life. I mean, if the goal of a gathering of friends
is to enjoy some food together, why invite you and your weird eating habits?