Diabetes and Stress?

kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
:
snip
The inflammatory cytokines from the visceral adipose tissue (VAT) are
the mediators rather than tissue pH.

Whether acidosis or alkalosis mediate other systemic inflammation?

Not while there is homeostasis.

Are Acidosis or alkalosis not homeostatis disrupted conditions?

They are.

Which of these can cause inflammation?

Acute disruption of homeostasis will lead to death before there is
inflammation.

yes, very narrow range is of blood pH. What is then, acidosis and
alkalosis?

Incompatible with life.

Intimal thickening is pathological.

Whether scleroderma and Intimal thickening are linked to each other?

The autoimmune process in scleroderma would cause intimal thickening.

What are other reasons of getting intimal thickening?

Cigarette smoking.

High blood pressure.

High cholesterol.

One sign and and symptom of scleroderma is;

"Digestive problems ranging from poor absorption of nutrients to
delayed movement of food due to impaired muscular activity in your
intestine.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/scl...362/DSECTION=2 "

How scleroderma is common in diabetis in its innital and later stage?

Scleroderma-like syndrome is reported in 8-50% of insulin-dependent
diabetics:

http://tinyurl.com/vodbh

What about in type2?

Less.

Why Scleroderma-like syndrome is more common in type1 than type2?

Type-1 diabetes and scleroderma-like syndrome are auto-immune related.

Can type2 get auto-immunity?

Yes. However, this is not typically associated with type-2 diabetes.

Can some auto-immunity be also for some
beneficial/needed purpose?

Not clinically seen.

Whether purpose of getting Scleroderma is meant to reduce appetite,
nutients absorptions and supply to tissues?

Anything that causes you to lose your appetite is harming you.

But if you have excess of nutrients etc. in blood, then?

Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus increases appetite.

Whether such surplus in digestive tract or in blood or in tissues?

Everywhere.

Which nutrients surplus, specifically can increase appetite?

This is a nonspecific reflection of conditions optimal for health.

May GOD continue to heal your heart by curing your diabetes, dear
neighbor Kumar whom I love unconditionally.

Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,

Andrew
--
Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit

As for knowing who are the very elect, these you will know by the
unconditional love they have for everyone including their enemies
(Matthew 5:44-45, 1 Corinthians 13:3, James 2:14-17).

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...ad7fe68478acf?

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
:
snip
The inflammatory cytokines from the visceral adipose tissue (VAT) are
the mediators rather than tissue pH.

Whether acidosis or alkalosis mediate other systemic inflammation?

Not while there is homeostasis.

Are Acidosis or alkalosis not homeostatis disrupted conditions?

They are.

Which of these can cause inflammation?

Acute disruption of homeostasis will lead to death before there is
inflammation.

yes, very narrow range is of blood pH. What is then, acidosis and
alkalosis?

Incompatible with life.

People don't die immediately due to different type of acidosis or
alkalosis?

How much change in pH which tissues can tolerate? It may depend on
tissues, but pls tell some?
Intimal thickening is pathological.

Whether scleroderma and Intimal thickening are linked to each other?

The autoimmune process in scleroderma would cause intimal thickening.

What are other reasons of getting intimal thickening?

Cigarette smoking.

High blood pressure.

High cholesterol.

One sign and and symptom of scleroderma is;

"Digestive problems ranging from poor absorption of nutrients to
delayed movement of food due to impaired muscular activity in your
intestine.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/scl...362/DSECTION=2 "

How scleroderma is common in diabetis in its innital and later stage?

Scleroderma-like syndrome is reported in 8-50% of insulin-dependent
diabetics:

http://tinyurl.com/vodbh

What about in type2?

Less.

Why Scleroderma-like syndrome is more common in type1 than type2?

Type-1 diabetes and scleroderma-like syndrome are auto-immune related.

Can type2 get auto-immunity?

Yes. However, this is not typically associated with type-2 diabetes.
Don't type2 get beta cell damage?


Can some auto-immunity be also for some
beneficial/needed purpose?

Not clinically seen.
Can't some beta cell damage be due to excessive insulin is secreted due
to IR?

Can't some anemia and RBCs destruction be to withhold iron or O2
pathogenic bacterias or cancer cells?
Whether purpose of getting Scleroderma is meant to reduce appetite,
nutients absorptions and supply to tissues?

Anything that causes you to lose your appetite is harming you.

But if you have excess of nutrients etc. in blood, then?

Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus increases appetite.

Whether such surplus in digestive tract or in blood or in tissues?

Everywhere.

How nutrient surplus increases appetite?
Which nutrients surplus, specifically can increase appetite?

This is a nonspecific reflection of conditions optimal for health.

Which Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus can increase apetite?
May GOD continue to heal your heart by curing your diabetes, dear
neighbor Kumar whom I love unconditionally.

Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,

Andrew
--
Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit

As for knowing who are the very elect, these you will know by the
unconditional love they have for everyone including their enemies
(Matthew 5:44-45, 1 Corinthians 13:3, James 2:14-17).

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...ad7fe68478acf?

Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
:
snip
The inflammatory cytokines from the visceral adipose tissue (VAT) are
the mediators rather than tissue pH.

Whether acidosis or alkalosis mediate other systemic inflammation?

Not while there is homeostasis.

Are Acidosis or alkalosis not homeostatis disrupted conditions?

They are.

Which of these can cause inflammation?

Acute disruption of homeostasis will lead to death before there is
inflammation.

yes, very narrow range is of blood pH. What is then, acidosis and
alkalosis?

Incompatible with life.

People don't die immediately due to different type of acidosis or
alkalosis?

Still incompatible with life.

How much change in pH which tissues can tolerate? It may depend on
tissues, but pls tell some?

Depends on comorbidities.

Intimal thickening is pathological.

Whether scleroderma and Intimal thickening are linked to each other?

The autoimmune process in scleroderma would cause intimal thickening.

What are other reasons of getting intimal thickening?

Cigarette smoking.

High blood pressure.

High cholesterol.

One sign and and symptom of scleroderma is;

"Digestive problems ranging from poor absorption of nutrients to
delayed movement of food due to impaired muscular activity in your
intestine.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/scl...362/DSECTION=2 "

How scleroderma is common in diabetis in its innital and later stage?

Scleroderma-like syndrome is reported in 8-50% of insulin-dependent
diabetics:

http://tinyurl.com/vodbh

What about in type2?

Less.

Why Scleroderma-like syndrome is more common in type1 than type2?

Type-1 diabetes and scleroderma-like syndrome are auto-immune related.

Can type2 get auto-immunity?

Yes. However, this is not typically associated with type-2 diabetes.

Don't type2 get beta cell damage?

This is not immune-mediated but inflammation-mediated.

Can some auto-immunity be also for some
beneficial/needed purpose?

Not clinically seen.

Can't some beta cell damage be due to excessive insulin is secreted due
to IR?

Not for type-1 diabetes.

Can't some anemia and RBCs destruction be to withhold iron or O2
pathogenic bacterias or cancer cells?

Typically not.

Whether purpose of getting Scleroderma is meant to reduce appetite,
nutients absorptions and supply to tissues?

Anything that causes you to lose your appetite is harming you.

But if you have excess of nutrients etc. in blood, then?

Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus increases appetite.

Whether such surplus in digestive tract or in blood or in tissues?

Everywhere.

How nutrient surplus increases appetite?

By optimizing health.

Which nutrients surplus, specifically can increase appetite?

This is a nonspecific reflection of conditions optimal for health.

Which Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus can increase apetite?

All when there is a deficiency.

May GOD continue to heal your heart by curing your diabetes, dear
neighbor Kumar whom I love unconditionally.

Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,

Andrew
--
Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit

As for knowing who are the very elect, these you will know by the
unconditional love they have for everyone including their enemies
(Matthew 5:44-45, 1 Corinthians 13:3, James 2:14-17).

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...ad7fe68478acf?

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
:
snip
The inflammatory cytokines from the visceral adipose tissue (VAT) are
the mediators rather than tissue pH.

Whether acidosis or alkalosis mediate other systemic inflammation?

Not while there is homeostasis.

Are Acidosis or alkalosis not homeostatis disrupted conditions?

They are.

Which of these can cause inflammation?

Acute disruption of homeostasis will lead to death before there is
inflammation.

yes, very narrow range is of blood pH. What is then, acidosis and
alkalosis?

Incompatible with life.

People don't die immediately due to different type of acidosis or
alkalosis?

Still incompatible with life.

How much change in pH which tissues can tolerate? It may depend on
tissues, but pls tell some?

Depends on comorbidities.

Common acidosis and alkalosis are in ECF or in tissues or in blood.

Intimal thickening is pathological.

Whether scleroderma and Intimal thickening are linked to each other?

The autoimmune process in scleroderma would cause intimal thickening.

What are other reasons of getting intimal thickening?

Cigarette smoking.

High blood pressure.

High cholesterol.

One sign and and symptom of scleroderma is;

"Digestive problems ranging from poor absorption of nutrients to
delayed movement of food due to impaired muscular activity in your
intestine.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/scl...362/DSECTION=2 "

How scleroderma is common in diabetis in its innital and later stage?

Scleroderma-like syndrome is reported in 8-50% of insulin-dependent
diabetics:

http://tinyurl.com/vodbh

What about in type2?

Less.

Why Scleroderma-like syndrome is more common in type1 than type2?

Type-1 diabetes and scleroderma-like syndrome are auto-immune related.

Can type2 get auto-immunity?

Yes. However, this is not typically associated with type-2 diabetes.

Don't type2 get beta cell damage?

This is not immune-mediated but inflammation-mediated.

Inflammation is a part of immune system?

Whether beta cells damage due to type diabetes is an irreversible
damage?
Can some auto-immunity be also for some
beneficial/needed purpose?

Not clinically seen.

Can some conditions express auto-immunity type effects/results but may
not be true autoimmunity(somewhat alike type2 in comparisn to type1
diabetes)?
Can't some beta cell damage be due to excessive insulin is secreted due
to IR?

Not for type-1 diabetes.
What about for type2 diabetes?
Can't some anemia and RBCs destruction be to withhold iron or O2
pathogenic bacterias or cancer cells?

Typically not.



Do our body's natural mechanism damages some of parts for some
beneficial/surrvival purposes behind those? If yes, how and what?
Whether purpose of getting Scleroderma is meant to reduce appetite,
nutients absorptions and supply to tissues?

Anything that causes you to lose your appetite is harming you.

But if you have excess of nutrients etc. in blood, then?

Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus increases appetite.

Whether such surplus in digestive tract or in blood or in tissues?

Everywhere.

How nutrient surplus increases appetite?

By optimizing health.

How nurients still above optimizing health?
Which nutrients surplus, specifically can increase appetite?

This is a nonspecific reflection of conditions optimal for health.

Which Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus can increase apetite?

All when there is a deficiency.

How such condition can be treated as nutrient surplus?

Pls look at last quote in topic about inflamation. As such, can swelled
RBCs show elevated ESR, elevation of PCV or lips/tongue or some other
part to look fiery red in colour instead of normal deep red?


May GOD continue to heal your heart by curing your diabetes, dear
neighbor Kumar whom I love unconditionally.

Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,

Andrew
--
Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit

As for knowing who are the very elect, these you will know by the
unconditional love they have for everyone including their enemies
(Matthew 5:44-45, 1 Corinthians 13:3, James 2:14-17).

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...ad7fe68478acf?

Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
:
snip
The inflammatory cytokines from the visceral adipose tissue (VAT) are
the mediators rather than tissue pH.

Whether acidosis or alkalosis mediate other systemic inflammation?

Not while there is homeostasis.

Are Acidosis or alkalosis not homeostatis disrupted conditions?

They are.

Which of these can cause inflammation?

Acute disruption of homeostasis will lead to death before there is
inflammation.

yes, very narrow range is of blood pH. What is then, acidosis and
alkalosis?

Incompatible with life.

People don't die immediately due to different type of acidosis or
alkalosis?

Still incompatible with life.

How much change in pH which tissues can tolerate? It may depend on
tissues, but pls tell some?

Depends on comorbidities.

Common acidosis and alkalosis are in ECF or in tissues or in blood.

Still depends on comorbidities.

Intimal thickening is pathological.

Whether scleroderma and Intimal thickening are linked to each other?

The autoimmune process in scleroderma would cause intimal thickening.

What are other reasons of getting intimal thickening?

Cigarette smoking.

High blood pressure.

High cholesterol.

One sign and and symptom of scleroderma is;

"Digestive problems ranging from poor absorption of nutrients to
delayed movement of food due to impaired muscular activity in your
intestine.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/scl...362/DSECTION=2 "

How scleroderma is common in diabetis in its innital and later stage?

Scleroderma-like syndrome is reported in 8-50% of insulin-dependent
diabetics:

http://tinyurl.com/vodbh

What about in type2?

Less.

Why Scleroderma-like syndrome is more common in type1 than type2?

Type-1 diabetes and scleroderma-like syndrome are auto-immune related.

Can type2 get auto-immunity?

Yes. However, this is not typically associated with type-2 diabetes.

Don't type2 get beta cell damage?

This is not immune-mediated but inflammation-mediated.

Inflammation is a part of immune system?

It is. However, the terminology immune-mediated is reserved for
formation of specific antibody-antigen complexes.

Whether beta cells damage due to type diabetes is an irreversible
damage?

Loss of beta islet cells is irreversible.

Can some auto-immunity be also for some
beneficial/needed purpose?

Not clinically seen.

Can some conditions express auto-immunity type effects/results but may
not be true autoimmunity(somewhat alike type2 in comparisn to type1
diabetes)?

This is not clinically seen.

Can't some beta cell damage be due to excessive insulin is secreted due
to IR?

Not for type-1 diabetes.

What about for type2 diabetes?

Not determined.

Can't some anemia and RBCs destruction be to withhold iron or O2
pathogenic bacterias or cancer cells?

Typically not.

Do our body's natural mechanism damages some of parts for some
beneficial/surrvival purposes behind those? If yes, how and what?

Overeating is not a natural mechanism but a choice made via the free
will which GOD has generously given to all souls including those
belonging to even fig trees (Mark 11:12-14, 20).

Whether purpose of getting Scleroderma is meant to reduce appetite,
nutients absorptions and supply to tissues?

Anything that causes you to lose your appetite is harming you.

But if you have excess of nutrients etc. in blood, then?

Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus increases appetite.

Whether such surplus in digestive tract or in blood or in tissues?

Everywhere.

How nutrient surplus increases appetite?

By optimizing health.

How nurients still above optimizing health?

No deficiency.

Which nutrients surplus, specifically can increase appetite?

This is a nonspecific reflection of conditions optimal for health.

Which Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus can increase apetite?

All when there is a deficiency.

How such condition can be treated as nutrient surplus?

Empty cups are no longer empty when they are overfilled.

Pls look at last quote in topic about inflamation. As such, can swelled
RBCs show elevated ESR, elevation of PCV or lips/tongue or some other
part to look fiery red in colour instead of normal deep red?

Redness (erythema) at sites of inflammation is not due to swollen RBCs.

A beefy red tongue is a sign of B12 deficiency which will result in
increased MCV, which could possibly be interpreted by a layperson such
as yourself to mean swollen RBCs.

May GOD continue to heal your heart by curing your diabetes, dear
neighbor Kumar whom I love unconditionally.

Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,

Andrew
--
Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit

As for knowing who are the very elect, these you will know by the
unconditional love they have for everyone including their enemies
(Matthew 5:44-45, 1 Corinthians 13:3, James 2:14-17).

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...ad7fe68478acf?

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Kumar wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
kumar wrote:
:
snip
The inflammatory cytokines from the visceral adipose tissue (VAT) are
the mediators rather than tissue pH.

Whether acidosis or alkalosis mediate other systemic inflammation?

Not while there is homeostasis.

Are Acidosis or alkalosis not homeostatis disrupted conditions?

They are.

Which of these can cause inflammation?

Acute disruption of homeostasis will lead to death before there is
inflammation.

yes, very narrow range is of blood pH. What is then, acidosis and
alkalosis?

Incompatible with life.

People don't die immediately due to different type of acidosis or
alkalosis?

Still incompatible with life.

How much change in pH which tissues can tolerate? It may depend on
tissues, but pls tell some?

Depends on comorbidities.

Common acidosis and alkalosis are in ECF or in tissues or in blood.

Still depends on comorbidities.
Whether abnormality in blood is after abnomality in tissues?
Intimal thickening is pathological.

Whether scleroderma and Intimal thickening are linked to each other?

The autoimmune process in scleroderma would cause intimal thickening.

What are other reasons of getting intimal thickening?

Cigarette smoking.

High blood pressure.

High cholesterol.

One sign and and symptom of scleroderma is;

"Digestive problems ranging from poor absorption of nutrients to
delayed movement of food due to impaired muscular activity in your
intestine.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/scl...362/DSECTION=2 "

How scleroderma is common in diabetis in its innital and later stage?

Scleroderma-like syndrome is reported in 8-50% of insulin-dependent
diabetics:

http://tinyurl.com/vodbh

What about in type2?

Less.

Why Scleroderma-like syndrome is more common in type1 than type2?

Type-1 diabetes and scleroderma-like syndrome are auto-immune related.

Can type2 get auto-immunity?

Yes. However, this is not typically associated with type-2 diabetes.

Don't type2 get beta cell damage?

This is not immune-mediated but inflammation-mediated.

Inflammation is a part of immune system?

It is. However, the terminology immune-mediated is reserved for
formation of specific antibody-antigen complexes.
Whether non-infectiousinflammation is not immune-mediated?
Should we not classify infectious and non-infectious inflammations
seprately?
Whether beta cells damage due to type diabetes is an irreversible
damage?

Loss of beta islet cells is irreversible.
Can these be compensated or replced by new beta islet cells?

Can some auto-immunity be also for some
beneficial/needed purpose?

Not clinically seen.

Can some conditions express auto-immunity type effects/results but may
not be true autoimmunity(somewhat alike type2 in comparisn to type1
diabetes)?

This is not clinically seen.

Can't some beta cell damage be due to excessive insulin is secreted due
to IR?

Not for type-1 diabetes.

What about for type2 diabetes?

Not determined.

Can't some anemia and RBCs destruction be to withhold iron or O2
to pathogenic bacterias or cancer cells?

Typically not.
"Iron is an oxidant as well as a nutrient for invading microbial and
neoplastic cells. Excessive iron in specific tissues and cells (iron
loading) promotes development of infection, neoplasia, cardiomyopathy,
arthropathy, and various endocrine and possibly neurodegenerative
disorders. To contain and detoxify the metal, hosts have evolved an
iron withholding defense system, but the system can be compromised by
numerous factors. An array of behavioral, medical, and immunologic
methods are in place or in development to strengthen iron withholding
http://www.cdc.gov/NCIDOD/EID/vol5no3/weinberg.htm "

Pls look at abvove quote and tell.

Do our body's natural mechanism damages some of parts for some
beneficial/surrvival purposes behind those? If yes, how and what?

Overeating is not a natural mechanism but a choice made via the free
will which GOD has generously given to all souls including those
belonging to even fig trees (Mark 11:12-14, 20).
Whether all our body's natural mechanisms(GOD's design) are meant for
our surrvival in best possible way?
Whether purpose of getting Scleroderma is meant to reduce appetite,
nutients absorptions and supply to tissues?

Anything that causes you to lose your appetite is harming you.

But if you have excess of nutrients etc. in blood, then?

Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus increases appetite.

Whether such surplus in digestive tract or in blood or in tissues?

Everywhere.

How nutrient surplus increases appetite?

By optimizing health.

How nurients still above optimizing health?

No deficiency.

Which nutrients surplus, specifically can increase appetite?

This is a nonspecific reflection of conditions optimal for health.

Which Nutrient (not macronutrient) surplus can increase apetite?

All when there is a deficiency.

How such condition can be treated as nutrient surplus?

Empty cups are no longer empty when they are overfilled.
Good words, but still it can be defficient/empity in one of its
contents.
Pls look at last quote in topic about inflamation. As such, can swelled
RBCs show elevated ESR, elevation of PCV or lips/tongue or some other
part to look fiery red in colour instead of normal deep red?

Redness (erythema) at sites of inflammation is not due to swollen RBCs.
What causes some parts to look red?
A beefy red tongue is a sign of B12 deficiency which will result in
increased MCV, which could possibly be interpreted by a layperson such
as yourself to mean swollen RBCs.
Can't increased increased MCV be due to other reason than cell sweling
by hypotonicity/thin blood?
Thanks. Whether beefy red tongue and fiery red tongue(lips also) are
somewhat same? Is it a sign or symptom of some inflammatory condition?

How such condition is common in people esp. in young, nowadays?

Previously I read somewhaere that some B vitamin's defficiency can show
this symptom.
May GOD continue to heal your heart by curing your diabetes, dear
neighbor Kumar whom I love unconditionally.

Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,

Andrew
--
Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit

As for knowing who are the very elect, these you will know by the
unconditional love they have for everyone including their enemies
(Matthew 5:44-45, 1 Corinthians 13:3, James 2:14-17).

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...ad7fe68478acf?

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Overeating is not a natural mechanism but a choice made via the free
will which GOD has generously given to all souls including those
belonging to even fig trees (Mark 11:12-14, 20).

I hope you don't mind me intercepting here, but I have often been
puzzled about that passage in Mark re the fig tree. Why do you think
Jesus forbade anybody from ever to eat the fruit from that tree again?
The fig tree had leaves on it, but it was out of season for figs to
grow, so why was Jesus annoyed by this? Is this more symbolic? Is
Jesus saying that even if we, as people, are not ready when He comes,
because we don't know the time of His returning, that He will rebuff us
too?

Ros
{{{

PS Do you think God has given all matter souls?

Ros wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Overeating is not a natural mechanism but a choice made via the free
will which GOD has generously given to all souls including those
belonging to even fig trees (Mark 11:12-14, 20).

I hope you don't mind me intercepting here, but I have often been
puzzled about that passage in Mark re the fig tree. Why do you think
Jesus forbade anybody from ever to eat the fruit from that tree again?

HE was speaking to the tree in judgment in the manner HE spoke to
demons in judgment by saying they would not possess anyone else again,
thereby destroying the demon as HE destroyed the soul of the fig tree.

The fig tree had leaves on it, but it was out of season for figs to
grow, so why was Jesus annoyed by this?

The fig tree had a soul with the free will to obey GOD the Son to
produce figs out of season but chose to disobey GOD's command.

Is this more symbolic?

No.

Is
Jesus saying that even if we, as people, are not ready when He comes,
because we don't know the time of His returning, that He will rebuff us
too?

No.

Here is more to help you understand (especially the third link):

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...9759318ef2647?

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...0d6d2aa5eed2f?

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...25eb1d5cf468a?

Ros
{{{

PS Do you think God has given all matter souls?

Not all matter but all things that HE will command to obey HIM.

May GOD continue to heal our hearts with HIS living water, dear sister
Ros whom I love unconditionally.

Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,

Andrew
--
Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit

As for knowing who are the very elect, these you will know by the
unconditional love they have for everyone including their enemies
(Matthew 5:44-45, 1 Corinthians 13:3, James 2:14-17).

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...ad7fe68478acf?

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Ros wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Overeating is not a natural mechanism but a choice made via the free
will which GOD has generously given to all souls including those
belonging to even fig trees (Mark 11:12-14, 20).

I hope you don't mind me intercepting here, but I have often been
puzzled about that passage in Mark re the fig tree. Why do you think
Jesus forbade anybody from ever to eat the fruit from that tree again?

HE was speaking to the tree in judgment in the manner HE spoke to
demons in judgment by saying they would not possess anyone else again,
thereby destroying the demon as HE destroyed the soul of the fig tree.

The fig tree had leaves on it, but it was out of season for figs to
grow, so why was Jesus annoyed by this?

The fig tree had a soul with the free will to obey GOD the Son to
produce figs out of season but chose to disobey GOD's command.

Is this more symbolic?

No.

Is
Jesus saying that even if we, as people, are not ready when He comes,
because we don't know the time of His returning, that He will rebuff us
too?

No.

Here is more to help you understand (especially the third link):

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...9759318ef2647?

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...0d6d2aa5eed2f?

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...25eb1d5cf468a?

Ros
{{{

Reading through the third link.....

he other fallen beings were not in the garden of Eden.

The tree of knowledge of good and evil standing in the middle of the
garden was a fig tree and was the source of the leaves that Adam and
Eve used to make coverings for themselves (Genesis 3:7).

It would mean that Eve was not the first to commit sin, but in fact
the tree was the first to commit sin because it could have withered up
its fruit, thereby making sure Eve could not have eaten it.

Blessings, Ros

On Sat, 21 Oct 2006 20:41:07 -0700, Ros attempted to confuse the issue
further by squeaking:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Overeating is not a natural mechanism but a choice made via the free
will which GOD has generously given to all souls including those
belonging to even fig trees (Mark 11:12-14, 20).

I hope you don't mind me intercepting here, but I have often been puzzled
about that passage in Mark re the fig tree. Why do you think Jesus
forbade anybody from ever to eat the fruit from that tree again? The fig
tree had leaves on it, but it was out of season for figs to grow, so why
was Jesus annoyed by this? Is this more symbolic? Is Jesus saying that
even if we, as people, are not ready when He comes, because we don't know
the time of His returning, that He will rebuff us too?

Hmmm, I guess I'm damned to Hell forever, in that case, since I've eaten
figs. Oh, well, the company's better anyway.

{{{

PS Do you think God has given all matter souls?

An interesting question, for a theist, especially a monotheist. Me, I
gravitate between polytheism and agnosticism, though, so it's only mildly
interesting, to me.

--
__________________________________________________ ______________________
Hail Eris! mhm 29x21; TM#5; COOSN-029-06-71069
The God of Odd Statements, the Ugliest Pig****er In The Universe
Stupidity Takes Its Toll. Please Have Exact Change.

If you never read anything else in any of my sigs, read this:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15321167/
http://borealin.livejournal.com/15104.html
Or watch it he
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqxmPjB0WSs
Then, if you manage to read/watch all that, try this:
http://www.newamericancentury.org/Re...asDefenses.pdf
And Molly Ivins had a few choice words to say about it, weeks befo
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/092906B.shtml

"Q: What's the difference between the Vietnam War and the Iraq War?
A: George W. Bush had a plan to get out of the Vietnam War." -- Anon.

Thread where outing begins: http://tinyurl.com/hojf8
George Pickett Memorial Trophy, Special Ops Cody Memorial Purple Heart,
and the Order of the Holey Sockpuppet winner on
outing personal contact info in x-poasted subject lines:
"Plenty of people post under their real names and do not attempt to hide
their contact info. You are scared of being 'outed' because you are a
pathological abuser of usenet, and people rightly despise you for it.
You're afraid of being reported to the authorities or, better, visited
by a couple of guys with baseball bats. Other people don't have this
obsessive fear. Ward Hardman himself has posted plenty of personal
information - nothing that anyone else added was hidden in any way.
You're so ****ing scared you've built up this whole sick mythology about
different categories of bad dudes who 'out' scum like you.

"Meanwhile you are the ugliest pig****er in the universe. You are the
coward without ethics. You call me a 'newbie' - ha! what an asshole you
are. Those who want to remain anonymous do so. There is absolutely no
way you could identify me, not unless you had the sort of subpoena power
that only gets turned on for big-time terrorists. That's because I chose
to be anonymous. Some people don't. Only really stupid dicks like you
choose the sort of semi-anonymity which leaves you in constant fear.

"What a dickless wonder you are 'Snarky' you fat asshole."
-- in MID: . com

"I am the only one who has outer filthed Ward" -- James C. "Crackhead"
Cracked voluntarily self-immolates, in MID:


"When I told Abbie Hoffman that he was the first one who made me laugh
since Lenny Bruce died, Hoffman said, "Really? He was my god." The
combination of satirical irreverence and sense of justice that Bruce and
Hoffman shared was the real spirit behind the Yippies--a term I coined to
describe a phenomenon that already existed: an organic coalition of stoned
hippies and political activists who engaged in such actions as throwing
money on the floor of the New York Stock Exchange, then explaining to
reporters the meaning of that symbolism. Folksinger Phil Ochs summed it
up: "A demonstration should turn you on, not turn you off." So when
journalists link the Yippies with misleading bedfellows, at best it's
careless shorthand; at worst it's deliberate demonization. Osama bin Laden
wanted an aircraft to crash into the Pentagon. Abbie Hoffman merely wanted
to levitate it." -- Paul Krassner, http://tinyurl.com/ehu3v