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#51
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Daily Spirit-guided health tip for 11/27/07.
In article fb13ff50-4b0e-4ae6-a8a8-afb83bad9c88
@x69g2000hsx.googlegroups.com, says... Be hungry.. be healthy... be hungrier... be blessed: --------------------------------- | The Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD FAQ | | Version 1.0, January, 2004 | --------------------------------- Introduction ------------ New people arriving in sci.med.cardiology (s.m.c.) are often puzzled and troubled by the controversy surrounding the poster who posts as Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD (Dr. Chung) and want to know what the controversy is about. This FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) attempts to provide an answer. The FAQ is arranged in typical FAQ form, i.e. a series of questions and answers. For those who donıt wish to read the whole FAQ, the following summary is provided. Summary ------- Dr. Chung represents himself to be a licensed physician specializing in cardiology. In this capacity he responds to medical questions on s.m.c.. If that were all he did, there would probably be no controversy. The controversy arises from Dr. Chungıs other behaviors on s.m.c., in particular: o He uses s.m.c. to not only proselytize his particular interpretation of Christianity, but also to disparage and attack anyone with a different interpretation or different religion. o He uses s.m.c. to promote his unscientific Two Pound Diet (2PD) and, in fact, cross posts this information to other groups in order to gain more exposure. o When challenged on the above issues, or one of his medical opinions, he attacks his challengers as "obsessive anti-Christians", "libelers", "homosexuals", "people who canıt understand English", etc. o When challenged he performs Internet searches on his challengers in order to "get the dirt" on them and smear their reputations. o When challenged, he answers with evasions, non sequiturs, dissembling, rhetorical questions, quotes from the bible, religious mantras, thinly veiled death threats, ad hominem arguments, and other such disreputable, unethical, and unprofessional tactics. o He is insufferably full of himself, claiming to have "the gift of Truth Discernment" and to be "Humble" while behaving anything but humbly. o He uses a foil who posts under variations of the name "Mu" to avoid killfiles. Muıs job is to troll other newsgroups and, when he gets a reaction, to cross post the reaction to s.m.c. so that Dr. Chung can disingenuously claim to be "only responding" to a cross post. Whereas Dr. Chung has to be somewhat careful what he says and so attacks primarily through insinuation and innuendo, Muıs tactics are blunt and direct like those of a playground bully. The above lists only the highlights of Dr. Chungıs egregious behavior on s.m.c.. If anything, it understates it. Everything can be verified in the Google archives. The issue then arises: so what? As long as Dr. Chung provides free medical advice on s.m.c., who cares what else he does? Many people provide free medical advice on the internet. How does one know whether it is good advice or bad advice? If the person giving the advice is, or represents himself to be, a doctor shouldnıt that be enough? Unfortunately, no. Medical education alone is not enough to guarantee good advice. Knowledge must be tempered with judgment, impartiality, integrity, ethics, and professionalism. If someone consistently demonstrates by their behavior that they lack these qualities, how much credence should be given to their medical advice? People arrive in this group looking for help. For their own protection, they deserve to know the quality of the person purporting to dispense that help and not be lulled into a false sense of security simply because someone displays an MD after their name. It is the intention of this FAQ to provide people with enough information to allow them to make an informed decision. List of Questions Answered -------------------------- 1. Who is Dr. Andrew B Chung, MD/PhD? 2. What is the Charter of s.m.c.? 3. Arenıt Religious Discussions Covered by the Charter? 4. So Dr. Chung is Religious... Whatıs the Problem With That? 5. But itıs Just a Little "Tag Line" in His Signature. 6. But Iım a Christian Too! 7. Well, Why Not Just Ignore His Religious Rants? 8. But Isnıt It Wonderful That Dr. Chung Offers This Free Medical Advice Out of the Goodness of His Heart? 9. How Does a Practicing Physician Find so Much Time to Spend on Usenet? 10. Wonıt Challenging Dr. Chung Drive People Away? 11. Doesn't the "Fault" for all Those Posts Lay With Those Who Challenge Dr. Chung? 12. Why Do I see So Many "Ad Hominem" Attacks? 13. I'm Sick of Seeing All This! 14. What is the Two Pound Diet? 15. Is Discussion of the Two Pound Diet "On Topic"? 16. Who is Mu? 17. What is Muıs Role? 1. Who is Dr. Andrew B Chung, MD/PhD? -------------------------------------- The poster who posts as Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD claims to be a licensed physician, practicing internal medicine in Atlanta, Georgia, USA and specializing in cardiology. His signature contains a link to a website which is consistent with his posts. It should be noted that anyone can claim to be anyone on Usenet and so caution is always advised. Indeed there are those who claim that the poster in question is not Dr. Andrew B. Chung, or is not the Dr. Andrew B. Chung listed in the Atlanta telephone directory, and/or has lost his license and/or hospital privileges for misconduct. This FAQ does not attempt to address those claims one way or the other. The reader with an interest in these matters can easily find the relevant discussions archived in Google Groups. This FAQ deals with the poster who posts as Dr. Chung and restricts itself to issues demonstrated by those posts. No position is taken on his "true" identity. 2. What is the Charter of s.m.c.? ---------------------------------- The purpose of this newsgroup is to establish electronic media for communication between health care providers, scientists and other individuals with interest in the cardiovascular field. Such communications will provide quick and efficacious means to exchange information and knowledge, and offer problems to solutions. The sci.med.cardiology newsgroup will welcome participants who are health care providers, trainees, researchers, students or recipients with interest in the field of cardiovascular problems." (ftp://ftp.uu.net/usenet/news.announc...med.cardiology) 3. Arenıt Religious Discussions Covered by the Charter? -------------------------------------------------------- What do you think? 4. So Dr. Chung is Religious... Whatıs the Problem With That? -------------------------------------------------------------- There is no problem with that. Most of the people who participate in s.m.c. are probably religious. However no one but Dr. Chung feels compelled to characterize themselves as the "Humble Servant of God" in their signatures, continually thank God for the opportunity to "witness", question others about their religious beliefs, claim the "Gift of Truth Discernment", etc. When one person insists on introducing his personal religious interpretations into the discussions, it naturally generates responses from others who feel just as strongly that their viewpoints are correct. The resulting debate easily swirls out of control, especially given Dr. Chungıs intolerant and dismissive attitude towards beliefs which differ from his. The situation is further exacerbated by Muıs rabble raising from the sidelines. There are over 160 Usenet groups dedicated to the discussion of religion. Dr. Chung should take his beliefs to one of these and stick to cardiology in s.m.c. It is a simple matter of respect for others. 5. But itıs Just a Little "Tag Line" in His Signature. ------------------------------------------------------- No, it is not. He has even gone so far as to "investigate" someone asking for advice about stents and accuse her of being anti-Christian. 6. But Iım a Christian Too! --------------------------- Lots of people are Christians. There is a time and a place for everything. s.m.c. isnıt the place to "witness" or recruit. In addition, lots of other people are Jews, Moslems, Buddhists, Taoists, Hindus, etc. Would s.m.c. be better or worse if they all emulated Dr. Chung in their proselytizing and recruiting? Furthermore, if you are a Christian, you should be appalled by Dr. Chungıs pharisaical, cynical, and manipulative use of Christianity. He is truly a "whitened sepulcher", loudly proclaiming his adherence to Christian values while overtly lying, carrying on smear campaigns against others, making false accusations, dissembling, and marketing his web site under the guise of altruism. He is "bearing false witness" and true Christians should be concerned. As an example, when John Ritter recently died unexpectedly, Dr. Chung rushed to use this unfortunate event to market his web site. He showed a total lack of Christian compassion for Mr. Ritter and his family, even when challenged to do so. As another example, he recently choreographed a smear campaign against a poster who had criticized him. Dr. Chung found a homosexual author with the same first name and then insinuated that the poster and anyone who agreed with him were engaged in a homosexual relationship. Ask yourself if this the brand of Christianity you identify with. 7. Well, Why Not Just Ignore His Religious Rants? -------------------------------------------------- Why should one individual be given carte blanche to violate the rights of everyone else? Usenet is a community. It is up to the community to sanction its members. There is nothing "ad hominem" about challenging inappropriate and antisocial behavior. 8. But Isnıt It Wonderful That Dr. Chung Offers This Free Medical Advice Out of the Goodness of His Heart? ---------------------------------------------------------- First, it is only of value if it is good advice. Medical education alone is not enough to guarantee good advice. Knowledge must be tempered with judgment, impartiality, integrity, ethics, and professionalism. If someone consistently demonstrates by their behavior that they lack these qualities, how much credence should be given to their medical advice? Secondly, despite his protestations to the contrary, Dr. Chung is not simply motivated by altruism. Every post of Dr. Chung's contains a link to a website with the following quote: "If you are looking for a cardiologist and reside in Georgia, please consider me your best option for a personal heart advocate. Check out my credentials and my background. Additional information is available in the protected sections of this web site. Email me at to me of your interest and I may send you a temporary username and password to allow a preview. The more information you email, the more likely my decision to send you a temporary username and password. If you like what you see and learn from this website and wish to confer with me about your heart, you or your doctor should email me privately or call my voicemail at 404-699-2780 to schedule an appointment to see me at my *real* office." (http://www.heartmdphd.com/office.asp) Thirdly, Dr. Chung has repeatedly stated that one of his key motivations for participating is s.m.c. is to "witness" and win converts to his religious beliefs. 9. How Does a Practicing Physician Find so Much Time to Spend on Usenet? ------------------------------------------------------------------ An interesting question. 10. Wonıt Challenging Dr. Chung Drive People Away? -------------------------------------------------- Perhaps. But not challenging him will drive others away. s.m.c. is historically a "low traffic" group. Therefore, when Dr. Chung misbehaves, he generates an apparently large response. This is compounded by Dr. Chungıs need to "get in the last word" and Muıs provocations. In spite of this, if someone has a question it will usually be answered. Dr. Chung is not the only participant who offers advice in s.m.c. He is not even the only doctor who participates in s.m.c. However, the controversy he generates and sustains often makes it appear that he is the "only game in town". Finally, Dr. Chung himself drives others away including other physicians who leave in disgust after being verbally assaulted by him, and other knowledgeable posters who point out where Dr. Chungıs medical opinion might be in error or at least not the only one generally held. Anyone disagreeing with Dr. Chung on any subject can expect a series of increasingly vitriolic attacks, including threats of libel suits. 11. Doesn't the "Fault" for all Those Posts Lay With Those Who Challenge Dr. Chung? -------------------------------------------------------------- An interesting perspective: blame the victim. No other poster (with the exception of Mu, of course) introduces religion or the Two Pound Diet. How can it be acceptable for Dr. Chung to introduce these topics, but not acceptable for others to respond? In any thread, someone must, of necessity "get the last word". Dr. Chung has amply demonstrated that he will not be outdone in this respect. 12. Why Do I see So Many "Ad Hominem" Attacks? ---------------------------------------------- You are probably referring to an "Ad Hominem" _argument_, which attempts to disprove an adversary's fact by personal attack on the adversary. An example would be "You are opposed to the Two Pound Diet because you are anti-Christian". When someone misbehaves, for example lies or distorts what someone else is saying, it is not an "ad hominem attack" to call them on it. It is a legitimate social sanction. There are also, unfortunately too often, simple personal attacks and insults on both sides. While we can all wish it weren't so, it is simply human nature when an argument becomes heated or the other person is obviously not arguing in good faith. If you are distressed by this, see the next question. 13. I'm Sick of Seeing All This! -------------------------------- There is no reason why you have to see it. Just as you can change the TV channel if you don't like a show, you can killfile a poster or thread you don't want to see. See the manual that came with your Usenet reader for directions on how to do it. Before you do this, however, you may wish to consider if a truer picture of the world is not gained by seeing all that goes on - both the good and the bad. 14. What is the Two Pound Diet? ------------------------------- The Two pound Diet is a diet which Dr. Chung "invented". Itıs only rule is to restrict yourself to two pounds of food per day. Thatıs it. Doesnıt matter if you are a 16 year old girl or an 80 year old man; a 5ı 2" woman or a 7ı man; a weight lifter or a mattress tester. Two pounds. Thatıs it. No more, less if you want. One size fits all. Oh, and the food? Whatever you want: two pounds of lettuce, two pounds of ice cream, two pounds of celery, two pounds of bacon, two pounds of chocolate, two pounds of peanuts... doesnıt matter. Mix and match. Just keep it under two pounds. Dr. Chungıs claim is that this magical weight of food, this universal gustatory constant will cause everyone to arrive at and maintain their ideal weight. His scientific basis for this claim: none. The proof he offers: none. Studies supporting this claim: none. Nutritional explanation: none. Metabolic explanation: none. And this from a doctor who expects people to take him seriously on other issues. 15. Is Discussion of the Two Pound Diet "On Topic"? --------------------------------------------------- Dr. Chung says it is because being overweight is a risk factor for heart problems and therefore discussion of the Two Pound Diet is On Topic. However criticism of the Two Pound Diet is Off Topic as is discussion of any other diet. As with religion, Dr. Chung takes every opportunity to introduce the Two Pound Diet (2PD) into any other thread. In addition Mu trolls other newsgroups, particularly the diet groups looking for opportunities to introduce the 2PD in these groups and then cross post the resulting discussion back to s.m.c so that Dr. Chung can disingenuously claim to be "only responding" to a cross post. Since Dr. Chung and Mu have been laughed off of these other groups and have been asked repeatedly not to bring up the 2PD in them, participants of these groups are understandably angered when it happens yet again=3F and, because of Muıs cross-posting, all their anger spills back into s.m.c. Another reason for ongoing 2PD discussions is Dr. Chungıs habit of researching anyone who criticizes the 2PD and then cross-posting his responses back to other groups which the critic has been found to frequent. He disingenuously claims that he does this as a "convenience" to the critic, but his true reasons are transparent. Once again, the cross-post generates a firestorm in s.m.c. The bottom line is that if the Two Pound Diet is "On Topic" for anyone, it is "On Topic" for everyone... including it's critics. If it is "Off Topic", it should not be continually re-introduced by Dr. Chung. 16. Who is Mu? -------------- Mu is a longtime Usenet Troll who has even merited his own FAQ. He postures as some kind of personal physical trainer, but who really knows? He has allied himself with Dr. Chung and serves as the "Bad Cop" in the Chung-Mu "Good Cop - Bad Cop" routine. He specializes in the short, nasty one-liner and, because, unlike Dr. Chung, he has no reputation to protect, he can afford to be much more direct and offensive. Mu parrots an even meaner-spirited version of Dr. Chungıs "Christianity" and does not hesitate to employ anti-Semitism and homophobia in his attacks. Naturally, most people would have long ago killfiled Mu, so he changes his handle on an almost daily basis. 17. What is Muıs Role? ---------------------- Muıs role is to troll other newsgroups and, when he gets a reaction, to cross post the reaction to s.m.c. so that Dr. Chung can disingenuously claim to be "only responding" to a cross post. Mu is also responsible for pitching softballs to Dr. Chung so he can hit them out of the park, and for re-introducing religion and the Two Pound Diet should the discussion flag. Finally, Muıs role is to tirelessly wear down unsuspecting Dr. Chung critics, deflecting the blows that would otherwise be aimed at Dr. Chung. He is Dr. Chungıs Internet equivalent of the "rope-a-dope". Insults roll off him like water off a duck as do attempts to reason with him or even have a civil discussion. Most people have learned to ignore him and his comment is usually the last one in any thread sub-tree where it appears. Comments and/or corrections to this FAQ will be taken under advisement. |
#52
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Daily Spirit-guided health tip for 11/27/07.
Convicted Andrew B. Chung did scribe-
The login for that one was "sayaah" If that "sayaah" is on Sermo, therefore he or she should know |
#53
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Daily Spirit-guided health tip for 11/27/07.
On Dec 2, 6:24 pm, "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"
wrote: http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...609dd1e2a34ad? http://HeartMDPhD.com/SermoExposed Wow. Did you know you can vote for yourself a gazillion times and thus show a high rating for posts that don't deserve it? :P V |
#54
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Daily Spirit-guided health tip for 11/27/07.
On Dec 3, 4:56 pm, "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"
wrote: brother MU wrote: satan via a sermite sockpuppet (corporeal demon) hissed: Cool! SERMITE sockpuppet demons! V |
#55
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Please pray for the deeply troubled soul of dear convictedneighbor Cary Kittrell.
On Nov 28, 7:46 pm, wrote:
Andrew, people think you are mentally ill. They think you may once have been intelligent, but have had a psychotic break and are delusional and unmedicated for your condition. Correct. You do not get a PhD, write a thesis and pass an oral dissertation and graduate from medical school and answer questions for the professors, finish a residency and answer questions from full time academic staff and pass the oral and written exams for board certification unless reasonably intelligent and reasonably sane. Something had to happen after all of that. What a shame. Maybe someday he will get the treatment he needs and improve - after all Nash (Beautiful Mind) did eventually get successful treatment |
#56
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Daily Spirit-guided health tip for 11/27/07.
In article crinoidgirl writes:
On Dec 3, 4:56 pm, "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" wrote: brother MU wrote: satan via a sermite sockpuppet (corporeal demon) hissed: Cool! SERMITE sockpuppet demons! V We got 'em in Vegemite and Marmite too. -- cary |
#57
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Please pray for the deeply troubled soul of dear convictedneighbor Cary Kittrell.
On Nov 28, 7:46 pm, wrote:
After you were deactivated from Sermo there was a popular thread about you entitled, "GoodRiddance." It has had more participation and attention and meaningful comments as well as jokes and votes than any of the garbage that you ever posted on Sermo had. Absolutely correct |
#58
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Daily Spirit-guided health tip for 11/27/07.
On Mon, 03 Dec 2007 16:26:00 -0800, crinoidgirl wrote:
On Dec 2, 6:24 pm, "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" wrote: http://groups.google.com/group/sci.m...609dd1e2a34ad? http://HeartMDPhD.com/SermoExposed Wow. Did you know you can vote for yourself a gazillion times and thus show a high rating for posts that don't deserve it? Especially if you have so many accounts, you have to number them. (He was up to around 22 for "heardoc" last I saw) -- Mark K. Bilbo a.a. #1423 EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion ------------------------------------------------------------ âThe larger the mob, the harder the test....when the field is nationwide...then all the odds are on the man who is, intrinsically, the most devious and mediocre-- the man who can most easily adeptly disperse the notion that his mind is a virtual vacuum. âThe Presidency tends, year by year, to go to such men. As democracy is perfected, the office represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. âWe move toward a lofty ideal. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.â - H. L. Mencken |
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