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Does Fat interfere with Protein Digestion?



 
 
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  #11  
Old February 4th, 2010, 11:16 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Doug Freyburger
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Posts: 1,866
Default Does Fat interfere with Protein Digestion?

jay wrote:

The first two weeks of a low carb plan ends up a detox plan. *There
are all sorts of effects that end by the time the two weeks are over.


On prior attempts at low-carb, I gave up after about 2 weeks. Maybe I
gave up too early.


The clock of most diets ticks at the rate of one or two weeks. For low
carbing the first tick of the clock is two weeks in. If you stopped
before the first tick of the clock the conclusion is that you did not
start in the first place and thus you can't draw any conclusions form
what you experienced. It sounds harsh and it is, but it's the reality
of how it works.

sore nerves and high cholesterol levels (+400)


I don't know what that means but it does not sound familiar.
Cholesterol readings are to be taken before starting and after being on
low carb 2+ months so this statement makes no sense ...


My family has a history of health issues. I have GI, food allergy and
autoimmune issues


I still don't know what sore nerves means. For that list you really
need to read the book on Atkins and follow it. Look at the eliminate
and challenge aspect of it for intolerance issues.

So you're low carbing for the health benefits? *Nice.


Mostly to see if it will resolve some health issues.


It is likely to do so, especially if you you pay attention to the
elinimate and challenge part that is ignored by most.

... Speaking of
spasms, on some mornings when I contract my calf muscles they seem to
stay contracted. Is this a magnesium deficiency? Do you taking
magnesium supplements?


Calcium or magnesium issues seem to happen early on and then drop off
again. I take cal/mag supplements just because they are beneficial. I
take the belt and suspenders approach of eating plenty of varied veggies
and then figuring that modern farming methods made them devoid of many
nutrients. It's conservative, probably unnecessarily.

I wonder if this explains why I have felt drowsy an hour after some
meals with approx 100g of carbs but not after approx 50g.


Drowsiness comes from insulin swings and blood sugar swings. Drop the
carbs, stabilize insulin and blood sugar, the effect goes away.

In just a
week and a half I have lost couple of pounds even though this isn't a
goal.


Water loss. Low carbing lets folks drop towards their ideal weight
without hunger. If you're already at or below your ideal weight that
doesn't happen. But the body stores glycogen carbs by disolving them in
water. Goodbye stored glycogen, goodbye the water it was disolved in.

Currently this diet has so much fat that it make me queasy and I
don't think I could eat more. Nice to have this problem for a change


Fat is self limiting when there's little carb with it. Sounds to me
like it's time for you to have more protein and less fat. No idea about
the foot pain thing, though.
  #12  
Old February 5th, 2010, 03:00 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Walter Bushell
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Posts: 142
Default Does Fat interfere with Protein Digestion?

In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

For me before starting I had problems from wheat intolerance. By the
end of the first two weeks all sorts of symptoms went away. I don't
know if they would be called inflammation.

Banish that salmon!


Sardines are safer if packed in water or olive oil, water for choice.
Vegetable oil, not so much, as it will be one of the nutrition complex
recommended "healthy" oils.

--
A computer without Microsoft is like a chocolate cake without mustard.
  #13  
Old February 23rd, 2010, 03:20 AM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
jay[_2_]
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Posts: 68
Default Does Fat interfere with Protein Digestion?

The clock of most diets ticks at the rate of one or two weeks. *For low
carbing the first tick of the clock is two weeks in. *If you stopped
before the first tick of the clock the conclusion is that you did not
start in the first place and thus you can't draw any conclusions form
what you experienced. *It sounds harsh and it is, but it's the reality
of how it works.


This is the longest I have been on a low-carb diet. Experienced some
constipation last week so I swapped some veggies for legumes. Any
other tricks to avoid constipation?

I have been averaging around 70% fat, 15% protein and 15% carbs (50g).
A few days ago, I lowered the protein and now I am experiencing a
metallic taste almost continuously. Would this imply that the prior
level of protein/carbs exceeded that needed to keep blood glucose at
or above body's minimum preferred level? Should I try to avoid the
metallic taste? If so, is it better to raise carbs or protein?
  #14  
Old February 23rd, 2010, 05:20 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Doug Freyburger
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Posts: 1,866
Default Does Fat interfere with Protein Digestion?

jay wrote:

This is the longest I have been on a low-carb diet.


Much that happens in the first couple of weeks is different from what
happens later in the plan. Think of the first couple of weeks as a boot
camp.

To me the single biggest advantage that low carbing has is the appetite
drops after a while. The body releases insulin in direct response to
dietary carbs so low carb means low insulin means no carb cravings.

Experienced some
constipation last week so I swapped some veggies for legumes. Any
other tricks to avoid constipation?


First question I have is about empty versus plugged. If you've never
been plugged before it's possible to confuse being empty with being
plugged. Empty is common early in low carbing and empty is not a
problem. Plugged is a problem. Because the initial experiences are
temporary feel free to take non-prescription constipation medication if
you are sure you are plugged not empty.

Because you've been eating plenty of carbs for an early low carber you
should have plenty of roughage moving through your system. Getting to
50 grams net from cauliflower takes a portion bigger than an entire
head. You can try swapping more of the ultra-low-carb items like
lettuce and cucumber and less of the regular-low-carb items like
broccoli to increase roughage.

The mildest treatment is drinking a couple of extra liters of water as a
stool softener. Next is changing the ratios of vegitable types to
increase fiber. Then adding psylium husk to your food to increase
fiber. Now there are dissolving fiber products on the market - Check
them for carbs other than fiber.

I have been averaging around 70% fat, 15% protein and 15% carbs (50g).


Some plans use percentages, some don't. The most popular low carb plans
go by grams and that makes the percentage numbers not useful. Knowing
total calories the percentage numbers turn into grams, but not knowing
total calories the percentage numbers mean very little.

A few days ago, I lowered the protein


Fairly few folks take the route of lowering protein in favor of fat. It
works well but it's far more common to lower fat in favor of protein.
You are now seeing the advantages of making that less popular choice.

and now I am experiencing a
metallic taste almost continuously. Would this imply that the prior
level of protein/carbs exceeded that needed to keep blood glucose at
or above body's minimum preferred level?


The body burns carbs entirely for fuel. Sugars, starched and glycerine
get converted at various rates with near 100% efficiency to glucose.

The body uses fatty acids for cell building and repair. The excess is
burned in 3 parallel processes. One of those processes yields
roughly 10% of the total energy. It uses the glycerol that holds the
fatty acids together. Two glycerols are bonded together to make a
glucode. One process slowly converts fatty acids to acetyl-CoA for use
in aerobic respiration. The last process quickly converts fatty acids
to ketones for less efficient fuel pathways. It's good to use the
stored body fat faster and less efficiently therefore the metalic taste
that says you're in ketosis is a very good thing. Note that the taste
gets extremely faint after about two weeks so focus on it now hoping you
can still tell it's there in a couple of weeks when it's faint.

The body uses amino acids from protein for cell building and repair.
The excess is burned in a large assortment of chemical processes that
yield roughly 50% glucose calorie for calorie in the conversion process.

So in rough terms 10 calories of excess dietary protein make 5 calories
of carbs and 10 calories of excess dietary fat make 1 calorie of carbs.
Counting both protein and fat starting with the excess amounts, whatever
that means. It's easier to estimate the amount of protein grams needed
for metabolic purposes than the amount of fat needed for metabolic
purposes so when I do this arithmetic I ignore the 10% contribution from
fat burning. It's not an accurate accounting method but dieting for fat
loss works anyways.

Swap protein for fat calorie for calorie and you end up with smaller
portions that are just about the same degree of filling. but swap
protein for fat calorie for calorie and you end up with a lot less
insulin released. It's better for loss all the way until you reach a
minimum number of protein grams. For the same total calories it gives
better loss. Read recent discussions of special purpose high fat plans
for epileptics and you'll see it is not uniformly a good idea, but
trading protein for fat does work better for loss. Be cautious about it
and don't get into the low protein range and the biggest downside is
eating greasy foods.

There's a further advantage to higher dietary fat - The hormone glucagon
is released in indirect response to dietary fat. Glucagon is the
hormone that pulls fat out of storage. When losing fat you want
glucagon levels as high as practical. The hormone insulin is released
in direct response to dietary carbs and in indirect response to excess
deitary protein. Insulin is the hormone that pushes fat into storage.
Insulin suppresses glucagon release. You have just triggered a
metabolic loophole that is far from obvious - More dietary fat triggers
more fat to be withdrawn from storage as long as you keep both carbs and
protein low enough. Calories matter so it doesn't help to simply eat
more dietary fat in the hopes of pulling more fat form storage, but the
metalopic loophole is there for the taking - Combined low carb plus
carefully tuned protein then fill in the rest with fat and that's how to
maximize the blood glucagon level.

Should I try to avoid the metallic taste?


Ketosis is to be celebrated as long as you are not a diabetic.

If so, is it better to raise carbs or protein?


I suggest that the food you're eating now is likely to get dull from the
extra fat. Care needs to be taken to keep the food from seeming greasy.
Given how easy it is to have leaner meats and less fat you may not want
to sustain your current menu for long. It works well but it's likely to
be dull and/or more work than you want to put in long term.

But you're at 50 grams of carb. As you are you have the option of going
down to 20 grams of carb in exchange for some more protein ending up
with leaner cuts that are easier to find. A cycle of alternating weeks
at 50 and 20 grams of carb, protein grams to match the same total
calories, the same fat grams - That would be a cycle that rocks for how
it effects the hormone released in response to diet.
  #15  
Old February 25th, 2010, 09:04 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
jay[_2_]
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Posts: 68
Default Does Fat interfere with Protein Digestion?

To me the single biggest advantage that low carbing has is the appetite drops after a while. The body releases insulin in direct response to dietary carbs so low carb means low insulin means no carb cravings.

It's nice not to feel hungry for 6 to 9 hours.

tricks to avoid constipation?


First question I have is about empty versus plugged ...


I ate some well-cooked rib bones. I guess the extra calcium was
plugged up the works.

Fairly few folks take the route of lowering protein in favor of fat. It works well but it's far more common to lower fat in favor of protein. You are now seeing the advantages of making that less popular choice...
I suggest that the food you're eating now is likely to get dull from the
extra fat. Care needs to be taken to keep the food from seeming
greasy.


I saw one study that concluded the minimum protein requirement is
between 0.4 and 1 g/kg. I am hoping to add more protein later, once
some inflammatory symptoms subside.

The body burns carbs entirely for fuel ...


Thanks for the detailed explanation of carb, fat and protein
metabolism.

But you're at 50 grams of carb. As you are you have the option of going down to 20 grams of carb in exchange for some more protein ending up with leaner cuts that are easier to find. A cycle of alternating weeks at 50 and 20 grams of carb, protein grams to match the same total calories, the same fat grams - That would be a cycle that rocks for how it effects the hormone released in response to diet.


I'll try exhanging the legumes for some meat and see how it feels.

I do a short, medium-intensity workout infrequently. It seems I get a
mild headache later in the day and into the next morning. Can I add
some carbs before of after the workout to avoid this? Does the body
resort to cortisol if carb reserves are too low? Do you adust your
carbs based on physical activity?
  #16  
Old February 25th, 2010, 11:09 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Doug Freyburger
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Posts: 1,866
Default Does Fat interfere with Protein Digestion?

jay wrote:

Fairly few folks take the route of lowering protein in favor of fat..


I saw one study that concluded the minimum protein requirement is
between 0.4 and 1 g/kg.


That's half a gram per pound of ideal weight. Plenty of folks go for a
gram per pound of goal weight. I think that's a reaction against low
protein pressure while low fatting. Virtually everyone gets more than
enough protein.

I am hoping to add more protein later, once
some inflammatory symptoms subside.


Inflamation and eating legumes? Hmmm.

I'll try exhanging the legumes for some meat and see how it feels.


There may be little or no apparent change, but some folks get
inflamation symptoms from legumes. Going a couple of weeks legume free
and then adding legumes back in is a good plan. Maybe try that in month
2 or 3. No hurry. Being suspicious of legumes is a low percentage shot
but being thorough is good.

I do a short, medium-intensity workout infrequently. It seems I get a
mild headache later in the day and into the next morning. Can I add
some carbs before of after the workout to avoid this? Does the body
resort to cortisol if carb reserves are too low? Do you adust your
carbs based on physical activity?


My answer of what I do for myself is very biased. My go for longer less
intense workouts early on then build up more. I do aerobics for 30
minutes and I target a heart rate of about 140 and being not
quite drenched with sweat near the end, and I target most days using the
treadmill or stationary bicycle. On the stationary bicycle I alternate
between fast and slow to approximate interval training. I go through
phases of doing resistance and phases of not. The Bowflex isn't idle
long enough to gather laundry but it is idle long enough to gather
dust ...
 




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