Points plan vs eating disorder?

Hey Carol,
I think the issue with a lot of people is that they turn to food for
comfort. While Weight Watchers may help with "behavior modification"
I think the "lifelong changes" promoting healthy eating can also haunt
you in a way. I think we are so obsessed with thinness and looking
good that overeating just a little bit can be scary. Considering you
are on the WW plan still, how do you react to a "bad" day where you
eat too many points?
Natalie



"Carol in NC" wrote in message m...
Hi Nathalie,

That is an interesting thought. It probably is, but I figure that I'd
rather have this disorder (which will allow me to stay slim when I get
there) than the one I had before (compulsive overeating/medicating myself
with food) which kept me obese for most of my life.

Carol

--
.................................................. ..........
318/254.6/169
63.4 lost since December 2002
I am a slim person in process.
.................................................. ............
"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Do you ever think that keeping track of points causes some kind of
eating disorder? I've been off of the Weight Watchers plan for a year
now and every food item I look at still automatically registers as a
point value, and even though I know it is ok on the points plan to eat
certain foods in moderation, I look at an item with "too many points"
and will not eat it at all. I feel like an anorexic might, counting
calories in salad. I am interested in doing some research on this and
am wondering if anyone else is feeling the same way?
Thanks,
Natalie

Joyce-
I am interested in what you have to say about OCD being part of the
point-counting process? I totally agree with you and this seems like
a good way to describe it. .. almost my question entirely ... so are
you on the WW plan? or do you count the points in your head for the
food items you think about consuming? How would this work?
Natalie
.................................................. .........
318/254.6/169
63.4 lost since December 2002
I am a slim person in process.
.................................................. ............
"Joyce" wrote in message
...
Trust me Carol, you would not rather have an eating disorder (been there,
done
that). Anorexia does not allow you to stay slim, not within healthy
limits. You
are totally unable to maintain a heathy weight, due to the inability to
eat
anything (and I do mean anything). Thinness is more of what I would call
a side
effect of the disease. Along with it, comes tons of other health problems
(physical as well as psychological) - none of which are fun to deal with.
The
problem with the thinness is that you never really see it, you have such a
distorted view of yourself. At one point in my life I had dropped to 100
pounds,
yet I did not consider myself thin (I am 5' 6"). I never realized I had
a
problem until forced to seek medical help for other reasons. My friends
and
family referred to me as a walking ghost.

Now ... I'd rather deal with the possibility of OCD (obsessive compulsive
disorder) and continously count my points. Definitely not anorexia though
...
don't even want to think about it.

Joyce
WW starting weight: 228.8 - 2/5/02
current weight: 133.3
Lifetime: 4/4/03



On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 21:11:25 GMT, "Carol in NC" wrote:

Hi Nathalie,

That is an interesting thought. It probably is, but I figure that I'd
rather have this disorder (which will allow me to stay slim when I get
there) than the one I had before (compulsive overeating/medicating myself
with food) which kept me obese for most of my life.

Carol

Debbie-
do you think that in the lifestyle-changing process I will ever be
able to "get over" the points counting in my head? Do you think it is
OCD or is it something I will always be consciously aware of because I
was once overweight? Granted, I will always watch what I eat because
of the fear of gaining weight , but I have not been able to sit down
and enjoy a piece of cheesecake or a cheeseburger without thinking of
how I can balance my points throughout the day/week. In reality, I
probably wouldn't gain weight if i ate those items sporadically, but I
have been so busy counting points of the food that I do enjoy on a
regular basis that I do not find room in my "budget" to incorporate
these foods. This, I assume, is not healthy.
Natalie

"Deb in Northern California" wrote in message ...
That is living the lifestyle change that you have learned and will continue
to loss to maintain your weight loss. If you are still losing and are
underweight, then it is a problem, otherwise you are living the way you
should so that you make good choices.

Debbie

"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Do you ever think that keeping track of points causes some kind of
eating disorder? I've been off of the Weight Watchers plan for a year
now and every food item I look at still automatically registers as a
point value, and even though I know it is ok on the points plan to eat
certain foods in moderation, I look at an item with "too many points"
and will not eat it at all. I feel like an anorexic might, counting
calories in salad. I am interested in doing some research on this and
am wondering if anyone else is feeling the same way?
Thanks,
Natalie

Brenda-
How can you convice yourself that assigning a point value is not a bad
thing, and how do you know that you are not obsessive? Even if you
eat these foods in moderation, how do you keep yourself from eating as
much "healthy" food as you want the rest of the day because they add
up points as well?
Natalie

"Brenda Hammond" wrote in message ...
I find myself automatically assigning a point value to everything I eat or
see, but I don't think it's a bad thing. I'm not obsessive about what I eat
as I still do eat food with high point values. I'm just more aware of how
healthy/unhealthy those foods are and eat them in moderation if they are
unhealthy.
--
Brenda
209/175/150
SWWC goal 165

"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Do you ever think that keeping track of points causes some kind of
eating disorder? I've been off of the Weight Watchers plan for a year
now and every food item I look at still automatically registers as a
point value, and even though I know it is ok on the points plan to eat
certain foods in moderation, I look at an item with "too many points"
and will not eat it at all. I feel like an anorexic might, counting
calories in salad. I am interested in doing some research on this and
am wondering if anyone else is feeling the same way?
Thanks,
Natalie

Hi Nathalie,

Well, I don't want to sound like I'm bragging, but I haven't yet had one bad
day since March 11. I lost some weight before I started WW, and then
promptly gained 1/2 of it back. My new years resolution, this year, was to
tackle everything in my life with moderation...from work, to eating, to
playing, to relationships, etc. (I'm a classic overachiever and I wanted to
try to just settle my life down.) I did a lot of inner work on myself
between January and March, and it was just the right time for me to start
when I did.

I've been totally relaxed about the program (except when I had a few
maintains, or when my weight loss started really slowing down.) Then, I
wasn't eating enough. (the overachiever in me again) I slowed down...took
a look at the plan and how I was doing it, and just decided to relax. Yoga
and exercise helps to keep me in a good frame of mind.

The biggest thing that I've done to help me stay on track with my eating is
dealing with emotional issues as they arise, instead of using food to
medicate myself from the feelings. It is a work in progress, but I've made
a lot of progress in this area, because I know how much it has hurt my self
esteem in the past not to deal with hurtful things.

I have days, now, where I eat a lot in a day, but it's still always within
my point target, or adding exercise points of Flex points. I never feel
guilty about anything I eat now...and I think the reason is because I'm not
denying myself anything...I just fit what I want to eat into the plan and
eat it in moderation. Before, I always denied myself the things I loved,
and I never lasted long on any program.

A VERY long answer to your question, and sidestepping it a bit, since I
didn't have a direct response...but I think that really looking at WHY I eat
has been my biggest help.

I do agree that I am obsessed with staying on the plan, but it really isn't
to look good, so much as to feel good. I've hurt for so many years because
of my weight (back, knees, neck, ankles, etc). Not having that pain in my
joints is a very strong motivation to keep eating well, and exercising a
lot.

Best of luck to you,
Carol

--
.................................................. ...........
318/254.6/169
63.4 lost since December 2002
I am a slim person in process.
.................................................. .............
"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Hey Carol,
I think the issue with a lot of people is that they turn to food for
comfort. While Weight Watchers may help with "behavior modification"
I think the "lifelong changes" promoting healthy eating can also haunt
you in a way. I think we are so obsessed with thinness and looking
good that overeating just a little bit can be scary. Considering you
are on the WW plan still, how do you react to a "bad" day where you
eat too many points?
Natalie



"Carol in NC" wrote in message
m...
Hi Nathalie,

That is an interesting thought. It probably is, but I figure that I'd
rather have this disorder (which will allow me to stay slim when I get
there) than the one I had before (compulsive overeating/medicating
myself
with food) which kept me obese for most of my life.

Carol

--
.................................................. ..........
318/254.6/169
63.4 lost since December 2002
I am a slim person in process.
.................................................. ............
"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Do you ever think that keeping track of points causes some kind of
eating disorder? I've been off of the Weight Watchers plan for a year
now and every food item I look at still automatically registers as a
point value, and even though I know it is ok on the points plan to eat
certain foods in moderation, I look at an item with "too many points"
and will not eat it at all. I feel like an anorexic might, counting
calories in salad. I am interested in doing some research on this and
am wondering if anyone else is feeling the same way?
Thanks,
Natalie

"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Debbie-
do you think that in the lifestyle-changing process I will ever be
able to "get over" the points counting in my head? Do you think it is
OCD or is it something I will always be consciously aware of because I
was once overweight? Granted, I will always watch what I eat because
of the fear of gaining weight , but I have not been able to sit down
and enjoy a piece of cheesecake or a cheeseburger without thinking of
how I can balance my points throughout the day/week. In reality, I
probably wouldn't gain weight if i ate those items sporadically, but I
have been so busy counting points of the food that I do enjoy on a
regular basis that I do not find room in my "budget" to incorporate
these foods. This, I assume, is not healthy.

Not Debbie, but I'll chime in here anyway. Why is doing the balancing in
your head not healthy? I balance out over a week rather than a day, so I'll
have the cheesecake one day and lower my points the next. I figure this is
how thin people do it, even if it is unconcious. Where you get into trouble
is when you stop balancing out the good with the not-so-good. Pre-WW I
would have chocolate cake (or slice, or a bar, or whatever - you get the
idea), and a Coke almost every day. There's no balance and no "making up
for it" in that plan, and obviously I gained weight. With WW, I can have
the cake and Coke *one* day in the week, so long as I balance the points so
I end up on budget by the end of the week.

I think this is a perfectly healthy way to eat. I get to have what I want,
and so long as I budget the points out over the week I know I won't gain
weight. We know that we can't eat whatever we like and still lose weight,
so this way is the best compromise for me!

--
Julie.
93.5/73.2/72 kg
205.7/161.0/158 lb

Why would assigning a point value to food be a bad thing. As I see it, I am
still trying to lose weight and in order to do that I need to count points
and assign a value to the foods I choose to eat. If I don't count those
points and stay within my range, then I'm not following the WW program, am
I? Right now I choose to follow it, so that's what I'm doing. It doesn't
make me obsessive, but it does make me aware of what I'm putting into my
body and allows me to make better choices if I choose to.

Are you still maintaining a year after being off WW?

--
Brenda
209/174/150
SWWC goal 165


"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Brenda-
How can you convice yourself that assigning a point value is not a bad
thing, and how do you know that you are not obsessive? Even if you
eat these foods in moderation, how do you keep yourself from eating as
much "healthy" food as you want the rest of the day because they add
up points as well?
Natalie

"Brenda Hammond" wrote in message
...
I find myself automatically assigning a point value to everything I eat
or
see, but I don't think it's a bad thing. I'm not obsessive about what I
eat
as I still do eat food with high point values. I'm just more aware of
how
healthy/unhealthy those foods are and eat them in moderation if they are
unhealthy.
--
Brenda
209/175/150
SWWC goal 165

"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Do you ever think that keeping track of points causes some kind of
eating disorder? I've been off of the Weight Watchers plan for a year
now and every food item I look at still automatically registers as a
point value, and even though I know it is ok on the points plan to eat
certain foods in moderation, I look at an item with "too many points"
and will not eat it at all. I feel like an anorexic might, counting
calories in salad. I am interested in doing some research on this and
am wondering if anyone else is feeling the same way?
Thanks,
Natalie

I didn't miss the point of your previous disorder, but also didn't pick up that
you'd rather have a *point counting* disorder ... I thought you meant you'd rather
be anorexic. My mistake, I apologize! I'd also much rather suffer from counting
points obsessively than deal again with an eating disorder. g

Joyce
WW starting weight: 228.8 - 2/5/02
current weight: 133.3
Lifetime: 4/4/03

On Sun, 21 Sep 2003 14:49:26 GMT, "Carol in NC" wrote:

I think you missed my point, Joyce. I DID have an eating disorder...I was a
compulsive overeater who used food as a medication to keep me from dealing
with the problems in my life. My point was, if counting points is a
disorder, I'd rather have THAT one than the one I actually did have.

Carol

--
................................................. ...........
318/254.6/169
63.4 lost since December 2002
I am a slim person in process.
................................................. .............
"Joyce" wrote in message
.. .
Trust me Carol, you would not rather have an eating disorder (been there,
done
that). Anorexia does not allow you to stay slim, not within healthy
limits. You
are totally unable to maintain a heathy weight, due to the inability to
eat
anything (and I do mean anything). Thinness is more of what I would call
a side
effect of the disease. Along with it, comes tons of other health problems
(physical as well as psychological) - none of which are fun to deal with.
The
problem with the thinness is that you never really see it, you have such a
distorted view of yourself. At one point in my life I had dropped to 100
pounds,
yet I did not consider myself thin (I am 5' 6"). I never realized I had
a
problem until forced to seek medical help for other reasons. My friends
and
family referred to me as a walking ghost.

Now ... I'd rather deal with the possibility of OCD (obsessive compulsive
disorder) and continously count my points. Definitely not anorexia though
...
don't even want to think about it.

Joyce
WW starting weight: 228.8 - 2/5/02
current weight: 133.3
Lifetime: 4/4/03



On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 21:11:25 GMT, "Carol in NC" wrote:

Hi Nathalie,

That is an interesting thought. It probably is, but I figure that I'd
rather have this disorder (which will allow me to stay slim when I get
there) than the one I had before (compulsive overeating/medicating myself
with food) which kept me obese for most of my life.

Carol

Yup, I am on the ww plan and will be on it for the rest of my life. I don't think
OCD is a part of the point counting process. I was saying that I think if someone
is totally obsessing over what they can and can't eat, then they may be suffering
from OCD. I believe in your original post you had said you would count points
over and over, refusing to eat certain items because they contained too many
points. To me this seems to be a bit obsessive/compulsive - something that maybe
you don't have a lot of control over, something that you feel you NEED to do even
though you have already done it 6 times in the past few hours. g

I do count points in my head, I also journal. I almost always do figure out the
point content of an item before I eat it, it helps me to decide if I really want
to have it ... or where I can fit it into my current lifestyle. What I don't do
is tell myself that I can never have a particular item because it's too high in
points. If I want that 25 point hot fudge sundae, then I'm going to have it. I
can exercise, I can shave points another day, I can deal with it. It's all about
choices.

I am obsessive to a point, ask anyone in my family .... they swear I can tell them
the caloric count of any item in the grocery store. g I know when I eat
breakfast how many points I have consumed, or will consume. I count 'em up in my
head as I'm preparing. The same routine with lunch, the same routine as I decide
what to fix for dinner. When I get around to journaling in the evening, I am
usually within 2 points of what I have in my head. To answer your question ...
yes, point values are always in my thoughts - making me think about the choices
that I make.

If you feel you are out of control with this though, feel that it is ruling your
life - then you may want to talk to your physician about getting some help. I
don't think that this process should totally take over your entire being. I do
think it is a good thing to be concious of those choices we make, and to be able
to get back on track if we make a bad choice. But I do think the ability to let
loose and make a bad choice on occassion is ok too.

Joyce
WW starting weight: 228.8 - 2/5/02
current weight: 133.3
Lifetime: 4/4/03

On 25 Sep 2003 08:25:03 -0700, (Natalie) wrote:

Joyce-
I am interested in what you have to say about OCD being part of the
point-counting process? I totally agree with you and this seems like
a good way to describe it. .. almost my question entirely ... so are
you on the WW plan? or do you count the points in your head for the
food items you think about consuming? How would this work?
Natalie
.................................................. .........
318/254.6/169
63.4 lost since December 2002
I am a slim person in process.
.................................................. ............
"Joyce" wrote in message
...
Trust me Carol, you would not rather have an eating disorder (been there,
done
that). Anorexia does not allow you to stay slim, not within healthy
limits. You
are totally unable to maintain a heathy weight, due to the inability to
eat
anything (and I do mean anything). Thinness is more of what I would call
a side
effect of the disease. Along with it, comes tons of other health problems
(physical as well as psychological) - none of which are fun to deal with.
The
problem with the thinness is that you never really see it, you have such a
distorted view of yourself. At one point in my life I had dropped to 100
pounds,
yet I did not consider myself thin (I am 5' 6"). I never realized I had
a
problem until forced to seek medical help for other reasons. My friends
and
family referred to me as a walking ghost.

Now ... I'd rather deal with the possibility of OCD (obsessive compulsive
disorder) and continously count my points. Definitely not anorexia though
...
don't even want to think about it.

Joyce
WW starting weight: 228.8 - 2/5/02
current weight: 133.3
Lifetime: 4/4/03



On Sat, 20 Sep 2003 21:11:25 GMT, "Carol in NC" wrote:

Hi Nathalie,

That is an interesting thought. It probably is, but I figure that I'd
rather have this disorder (which will allow me to stay slim when I get
there) than the one I had before (compulsive overeating/medicating myself
with food) which kept me obese for most of my life.

Carol

Natalie, only a Dr. will be able to diagnosis OCD ... actually, probably only a
therapist who specializes in this. Counting the points in your head is not a bad
thing in itself. What's wrong with wanting to stay in control of the choices you
make when eating?

There is nothing wrong at all with eating that cheeseburger and then trying to
figure out where you can compensate later. I'd be willing to bet that this is
exactly what everyone who is successful at keeping their weight in check does.
Maybe you need to loosen up your *budget* a bit so you can occassionally enjoy
that piece of cheesecake or whatever. Look at your budget as a weekly or biweekly
thing, instead of a daily number. It's much harder to find an extra 10 points in
one day, than it is to figure out where you can get 10 extra points in a week
(heck, a bit of exercise and you'll earn much more than 10 points in a week).

On a different note ... do you have problems with focus like this in other areas
of your life? Such as ... rechecking to see if doors are locked, having to have
an area of your home in a particular state (such as constantly having a clean desk
or whatever)? If this is the only area you seem to be overly controlling in, then
I don't think I would worry too much. Most people function extremely well with
OCD behaviors, they just learn how to deal with them.

Joyce
WW starting weight: 228.8 - 2/5/02
current weight: 133.3
Lifetime: 4/4/03

On 25 Sep 2003 08:28:56 -0700, (Natalie) wrote:

Debbie-
do you think that in the lifestyle-changing process I will ever be
able to "get over" the points counting in my head? Do you think it is
OCD or is it something I will always be consciously aware of because I
was once overweight? Granted, I will always watch what I eat because
of the fear of gaining weight , but I have not been able to sit down
and enjoy a piece of cheesecake or a cheeseburger without thinking of
how I can balance my points throughout the day/week. In reality, I
probably wouldn't gain weight if i ate those items sporadically, but I
have been so busy counting points of the food that I do enjoy on a
regular basis that I do not find room in my "budget" to incorporate
these foods. This, I assume, is not healthy.
Natalie

"Deb in Northern California" wrote in message ...
That is living the lifestyle change that you have learned and will continue
to loss to maintain your weight loss. If you are still losing and are
underweight, then it is a problem, otherwise you are living the way you
should so that you make good choices.

Debbie

"Natalie" wrote in message
om...
Do you ever think that keeping track of points causes some kind of
eating disorder? I've been off of the Weight Watchers plan for a year
now and every food item I look at still automatically registers as a
point value, and even though I know it is ok on the points plan to eat
certain foods in moderation, I look at an item with "too many points"
and will not eat it at all. I feel like an anorexic might, counting
calories in salad. I am interested in doing some research on this and
am wondering if anyone else is feeling the same way?
Thanks,
Natalie