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#81
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"DJ Delorie" wrote in message
... Elevated ASP can also activate insulin release from the pancreas. http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...ead.php?t=2689 Good thread, thanks. This answers a question I posted for Doug Freyburger yesterday. It looks like fat intake does stimulate insulin release to some extent, via ASP. Although ASP is also influenced by insulin. I wonder how much these factors are influenced by diet macronutrient composition and/or hypocaloric vs. hypercaloric intake. Anyway, I liked the simple (simplistic but not necessarily untrue) answer: fat makes fat... lol. Good forum, I wasn't aware of it and will have to check in there again. HG |
#82
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Can a low-carb diet fail if you take in too many calories?
"Ignoramus14701" wrote
I am amazed just how much we can discuss without actually bringing in evidence (like science articles from medline). I think that the question is excellent and the answer is far from obvious and needs to be ascertained via a study. It seems fairly clear that low carbers can get away with eating more calories than low fatters. Just how far this goes is not clear. Well, in this case each person is going to be different. YMMV holds. While many studies seem to have demonstrated that people eating a low carb diet can get away with eating more calories to lose weight than can the people eating the lowish-fat higher carbohydrate diets, there are still a looooooot of variables to sort out in those studies. Which means that I don't recall seeing much of anything that appeared to give the definitive answer to this question. Obviously it's possible to eat too many calories to allow weight loss on LC, regardless of macronutrient proportions. Too much anecdotal evidence, and also almost everyone, especially women, needs to pay attention to calories in the latter part of their weight loss, as they get closer to goal. My take on this is that if you're low-carbing and generally understanding and following the instructions, not eating a bunch of processed low-carb crap foods, and you're not losing weight over a period of several weeks, you're probably going to have to count and limit calories and/or exercise more. HG |
#83
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"Ignoramus14701" wrote
I am amazed just how much we can discuss without actually bringing in evidence (like science articles from medline). I think that the question is excellent and the answer is far from obvious and needs to be ascertained via a study. It seems fairly clear that low carbers can get away with eating more calories than low fatters. Just how far this goes is not clear. Well, in this case each person is going to be different. YMMV holds. While many studies seem to have demonstrated that people eating a low carb diet can get away with eating more calories to lose weight than can the people eating the lowish-fat higher carbohydrate diets, there are still a looooooot of variables to sort out in those studies. Which means that I don't recall seeing much of anything that appeared to give the definitive answer to this question. Obviously it's possible to eat too many calories to allow weight loss on LC, regardless of macronutrient proportions. Too much anecdotal evidence, and also almost everyone, especially women, needs to pay attention to calories in the latter part of their weight loss, as they get closer to goal. My take on this is that if you're low-carbing and generally understanding and following the instructions, not eating a bunch of processed low-carb crap foods, and you're not losing weight over a period of several weeks, you're probably going to have to count and limit calories and/or exercise more. HG |
#84
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Can a low-carb diet fail if you take in too many calories?
"jamie" wrote
In persons capable of producing insulin (not Type I diabetics), there are feedback mechanisms to prevent blood ketone levels going too high and causing ketoacidosis. The body slows or stops metabolizing fats, and releases insulin to use glucose (if not from carb, then from gluconeogenesis breakdown of proteins). Thanks, Jamie. I think in the context of the thread what Doug may also have been getting at was the role of Acylation stimulation protein (ASP). DJ provided a link to: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...ead.php?t=2689 which I found pretty interesting. I guess either or both could apply, depending on the usual other variables. HG |
#85
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"jamie" wrote
In persons capable of producing insulin (not Type I diabetics), there are feedback mechanisms to prevent blood ketone levels going too high and causing ketoacidosis. The body slows or stops metabolizing fats, and releases insulin to use glucose (if not from carb, then from gluconeogenesis breakdown of proteins). Thanks, Jamie. I think in the context of the thread what Doug may also have been getting at was the role of Acylation stimulation protein (ASP). DJ provided a link to: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...ead.php?t=2689 which I found pretty interesting. I guess either or both could apply, depending on the usual other variables. HG |
#86
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Can a low-carb diet fail if you take in too many calories?
"Hannah Gruen" writes: Anyway, I liked the simple (simplistic but not necessarily untrue) answer: fat makes fat... lol. I like to say "fat can store itself just fine thankyouverymuch." Good forum, I wasn't aware of it and will have to check in there again. Set your skin to maximum thickness first ;-) |
#87
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"Hannah Gruen" writes: Anyway, I liked the simple (simplistic but not necessarily untrue) answer: fat makes fat... lol. I like to say "fat can store itself just fine thankyouverymuch." Good forum, I wasn't aware of it and will have to check in there again. Set your skin to maximum thickness first ;-) |
#88
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Can a low-carb diet fail if you take in too many calories?
jamie wrote:
Hannah Gruen wrote: And the body's releasing insulin takes you out of ketosis.... how? Could you provide some kind of backup on this please? Ketosis is driven by the hormone glucagon. More glucagon in the blood, more fat withdrawn from storage. Glucagon is released in indirect response to dietary fat through a feedback loop using changing levels of adreniline in the blood. Ketosis is indirectly suppressed by the hormone insulin. Insulin in the blood suppresses glucagon release. More insulin in the blood, less glucagon in the blood, less fat withdrawn from storage. In persons capable of producing insulin (not Type I diabetics), there are feedback mechanisms to prevent blood ketone levels going too high and causing ketoacidosis. The body slows or stops metabolizing fats, and releases insulin to use glucose (if not from carb, then from gluconeogenesis breakdown of proteins). That's the key. Dietary carbs directly trigger insulin release. A large excess of dietary fat will also trigger insulin release. Switch from eating little fat to eating plenty and you are likely to have more glucagon in your blood and withdraw more fat from storage. Go too fat and over eat getting far too much fat and you will release insulin and stop the withdrawal of stored fat. Have you noticed folks worrying about eating enough dietary fat to burn that instead of stored fat? It happens, just at higher fat intake levels than most expect. That's along the transition to massive over eating of fat that knocks you out of ketosis. |
#89
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jamie wrote:
Hannah Gruen wrote: And the body's releasing insulin takes you out of ketosis.... how? Could you provide some kind of backup on this please? Ketosis is driven by the hormone glucagon. More glucagon in the blood, more fat withdrawn from storage. Glucagon is released in indirect response to dietary fat through a feedback loop using changing levels of adreniline in the blood. Ketosis is indirectly suppressed by the hormone insulin. Insulin in the blood suppresses glucagon release. More insulin in the blood, less glucagon in the blood, less fat withdrawn from storage. In persons capable of producing insulin (not Type I diabetics), there are feedback mechanisms to prevent blood ketone levels going too high and causing ketoacidosis. The body slows or stops metabolizing fats, and releases insulin to use glucose (if not from carb, then from gluconeogenesis breakdown of proteins). That's the key. Dietary carbs directly trigger insulin release. A large excess of dietary fat will also trigger insulin release. Switch from eating little fat to eating plenty and you are likely to have more glucagon in your blood and withdraw more fat from storage. Go too fat and over eat getting far too much fat and you will release insulin and stop the withdrawal of stored fat. Have you noticed folks worrying about eating enough dietary fat to burn that instead of stored fat? It happens, just at higher fat intake levels than most expect. That's along the transition to massive over eating of fat that knocks you out of ketosis. |
#90
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"marengo" wrote in message ...
The Voice of Reason wrote: snip A high | protein intake and resistance exercise is crucial to any plan to lose | fat. Sorry, but you are incorrect. This is your own theory and should not be presented as fact. I have a disability and get very little exercise. I do not eat high amounts of protein; only about the same amount as before low. carb. I've lost 60 pounds so far, mostly fat as evidenced by my pictures. My own weight loss is proof that you're wrong. Peter 270/213/180 Before/Current Pix: http://users.thelink.net/marengo/wei...htlosspix.html looks to me like you can make that statement after you are 35 pounds lighter. I'm guessing you'll stall pretty quick using the all-you-can-eat diet plan. |
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