Hi-fat/protein, Lo-carb recipe

PJx wrote:

On Sat, 14 Aug 2004 10:32:39 GMT, "Jeri"
wrote:


J. David Anderson wrote:
snip

1 Tbs Apple Cider Vinegar

5.5 carbs. Apple Cider vinegar is sweet and carb loaded, nearly as bad
as sushi vinegar. Even ordinary malt vinegar has a gram of carb per
tablespoon.

Are you sure you aren't thinking of balsamic vinegar? The USDA website lists
cider vinegar at 0.89 g carbs per Tbsp.



Right.
I guess David Anderson is a TROLL.

Why?

Fitday is based on the USDA database. What is "troll-like" about
accepting that data as accurate?

A tablespoon is 15 gms. Fitday, based on US figures, lists parsley at
..9 gms carb for 15gms, less .5 fibre. So using Fitday, 2 tablespoons
totals .8 gms, not .1 as claimed by the op.

Once again, to use Fitday, 10 medium black olives list as 2.4 grams of
carb, not 1.4 as claimed by the op.

As for Apple Cider Vinegar, I have three different brands in the
pantry, and based on their nutritional labels, they have approximately
37-39 grams of carb per 100gms of product. This works out to 5.5 carbs
for the quoted quantity, very similar, as I said, to Sushi vinegar.
Both types are distilled vinegars and contain sugar (fructose) and
fruit salts.

I think that many people who are having inexplicable problems with
weight loss are not being accurate enough with their assessment of
their total carb and calorie counts. Accepting errors like this in
calculation of meal/food ingredients is going to make a very big
difference in true daily consumption; many people may well be eating
more than double the values they are assuming to be correct.

Regards

David

PJx wrote:

On Sat, 14 Aug 2004 10:32:39 GMT, "Jeri"
wrote:


J. David Anderson wrote:
snip

1 Tbs Apple Cider Vinegar

5.5 carbs. Apple Cider vinegar is sweet and carb loaded, nearly as bad
as sushi vinegar. Even ordinary malt vinegar has a gram of carb per
tablespoon.

Are you sure you aren't thinking of balsamic vinegar? The USDA website lists
cider vinegar at 0.89 g carbs per Tbsp.



Right.
I guess David Anderson is a TROLL.

Why?

Fitday is based on the USDA database. What is "troll-like" about
accepting that data as accurate?

A tablespoon is 15 gms. Fitday, based on US figures, lists parsley at
..9 gms carb for 15gms, less .5 fibre. So using Fitday, 2 tablespoons
totals .8 gms, not .1 as claimed by the op.

Once again, to use Fitday, 10 medium black olives list as 2.4 grams of
carb, not 1.4 as claimed by the op.

As for Apple Cider Vinegar, I have three different brands in the
pantry, and based on their nutritional labels, they have approximately
37-39 grams of carb per 100gms of product. This works out to 5.5 carbs
for the quoted quantity, very similar, as I said, to Sushi vinegar.
Both types are distilled vinegars and contain sugar (fructose) and
fruit salts.

I think that many people who are having inexplicable problems with
weight loss are not being accurate enough with their assessment of
their total carb and calorie counts. Accepting errors like this in
calculation of meal/food ingredients is going to make a very big
difference in true daily consumption; many people may well be eating
more than double the values they are assuming to be correct.

Regards

David

Tablespoons are a volume measurement, grams are a weight measurement, you
must know the density of the item being measured to compare them. You state
that a tablespoon of parsley equals 15 grams with .9 grams of carb. FitDay
also says that 1 cup of parsley has 4 grams carb (less 2 fiber). Using your
figures a cup would have 16 (tablespoons per cup) times .9 = 14.4 grams carb
less .5 times 16 = 8 g fiber.

As for your vinegar figure, since it is a liquid it is close to 15 grams per
tablespoon. Faye used one tablespoon in her recipe. The USDA database says
..9 grams carb for cider vinegar. I don't have a bottle handy but I do have
a bottle of balsamic vinegar, which is generally higher in carbs than cider
vinegar, and it only has 2 carbs per tablespoon. I think you must be
reading your labels wrong or you have some very strange vinegar. And isn't
distilled vinegar white vinegar? Distillation removes all the lovely
particles floating around that give various vinegars their flavor.

Maybe if you say pretty please JC will give you a math lesson.


,
J. David Anderson stated
||
|| Right.
|| I guess David Anderson is a TROLL.
|
| Why?
|
| Fitday is based on the USDA database. What is "troll-like" about
| accepting that data as accurate?
|
| A tablespoon is 15 gms. Fitday, based on US figures, lists parsley at
| .9 gms carb for 15gms, less .5 fibre. So using Fitday, 2 tablespoons
| totals .8 gms, not .1 as claimed by the op.
|
| Once again, to use Fitday, 10 medium black olives list as 2.4 grams of
| carb, not 1.4 as claimed by the op.
|
| As for Apple Cider Vinegar, I have three different brands in the
| pantry, and based on their nutritional labels, they have approximately
| 37-39 grams of carb per 100gms of product. This works out to 5.5 carbs
| for the quoted quantity, very similar, as I said, to Sushi vinegar.
| Both types are distilled vinegars and contain sugar (fructose) and
| fruit salts.
|
| I think that many people who are having inexplicable problems with
| weight loss are not being accurate enough with their assessment of
| their total carb and calorie counts. Accepting errors like this in
| calculation of meal/food ingredients is going to make a very big
| difference in true daily consumption; many people may well be eating
| more than double the values they are assuming to be correct.
|
| Regards
|
| David

J. David Anderson wrote:
Why?

Fitday is based on the USDA database. What is "troll-like" about
accepting that data as accurate?

A tablespoon is 15 gms. Fitday, based on US figures, lists parsley at
.9 gms carb for 15gms, less .5 fibre. So using Fitday, 2 tablespoons
totals .8 gms, not .1 as claimed by the op.

A tbsp of parsley does not weigh 15 grams. Tablespoon is a measure of volume
not weight so it's going to weigh differently depending on what you're
measuring.

According to the USDA database a tablespoon of dried parsley weighs 1.3
grams and contains 0.67g carbs (0.4g of which are fiber).
A tablespoon of fresh parsley weighs 3.8 grams and contains 0.24g carbs
(0.1g of which is fiber). The difference is the water that the fresh parsley
contains.

Fitday has the same numbers for dried. It doesn't have a listing at all for
fresh.

Once again, to use Fitday, 10 medium black olives list as 2.4 grams of
carb, not 1.4 as claimed by the op.

You forgot to subtract the fiber of 1.2g which would bring it down to 1.2g
carbs.

As for Apple Cider Vinegar, I have three different brands in the
pantry, and based on their nutritional labels, they have approximately
37-39 grams of carb per 100gms of product. This works out to 5.5 carbs
for the quoted quantity, very similar, as I said, to Sushi vinegar.
Both types are distilled vinegars and contain sugar (fructose) and
fruit salts.

Then you have very odd vinegar. Does Australia not have just plain pure
cider vinegar? I checked 3 brands at the supermarket tonight and none of
them contained added sugar. All were less than 1g carb per tablespoon.
Both Fitday and the USDA database state that 1 tablespoon of cider vinegar
contains 0.885g and 0.89g of carbs respectively.

I think that many people who are having inexplicable problems with
weight loss are not being accurate enough with their assessment of
their total carb and calorie counts. Accepting errors like this in
calculation of meal/food ingredients is going to make a very big
difference in true daily consumption; many people may well be eating
more than double the values they are assuming to be correct.

Just because you buy vinegar with sugar in it doesn't make the original
poster wrong or the rest of us accepting of large errors.

J. David Anderson wrote:
Why?

Fitday is based on the USDA database. What is "troll-like" about
accepting that data as accurate?

A tablespoon is 15 gms. Fitday, based on US figures, lists parsley at
.9 gms carb for 15gms, less .5 fibre. So using Fitday, 2 tablespoons
totals .8 gms, not .1 as claimed by the op.

A tbsp of parsley does not weigh 15 grams. Tablespoon is a measure of volume
not weight so it's going to weigh differently depending on what you're
measuring.

According to the USDA database a tablespoon of dried parsley weighs 1.3
grams and contains 0.67g carbs (0.4g of which are fiber).
A tablespoon of fresh parsley weighs 3.8 grams and contains 0.24g carbs
(0.1g of which is fiber). The difference is the water that the fresh parsley
contains.

Fitday has the same numbers for dried. It doesn't have a listing at all for
fresh.

Once again, to use Fitday, 10 medium black olives list as 2.4 grams of
carb, not 1.4 as claimed by the op.

You forgot to subtract the fiber of 1.2g which would bring it down to 1.2g
carbs.

As for Apple Cider Vinegar, I have three different brands in the
pantry, and based on their nutritional labels, they have approximately
37-39 grams of carb per 100gms of product. This works out to 5.5 carbs
for the quoted quantity, very similar, as I said, to Sushi vinegar.
Both types are distilled vinegars and contain sugar (fructose) and
fruit salts.

Then you have very odd vinegar. Does Australia not have just plain pure
cider vinegar? I checked 3 brands at the supermarket tonight and none of
them contained added sugar. All were less than 1g carb per tablespoon.
Both Fitday and the USDA database state that 1 tablespoon of cider vinegar
contains 0.885g and 0.89g of carbs respectively.

I think that many people who are having inexplicable problems with
weight loss are not being accurate enough with their assessment of
their total carb and calorie counts. Accepting errors like this in
calculation of meal/food ingredients is going to make a very big
difference in true daily consumption; many people may well be eating
more than double the values they are assuming to be correct.

Just because you buy vinegar with sugar in it doesn't make the original
poster wrong or the rest of us accepting of large errors.

Jeri wrote:
J. David Anderson wrote:

Why?

Fitday is based on the USDA database. What is "troll-like" about
accepting that data as accurate?

A tablespoon is 15 gms. Fitday, based on US figures, lists parsley at
.9 gms carb for 15gms, less .5 fibre. So using Fitday, 2 tablespoons
totals .8 gms, not .1 as claimed by the op.


A tbsp of parsley does not weigh 15 grams. Tablespoon is a measure of volume
not weight so it's going to weigh differently depending on what you're
measuring.

You are correct. A tablespoon of freshly picked and crushed parsley
weighs 13 grams; a level tablespoon that is. As most people cooking use
at least slightly heaped measure, it would probably be closer to make it
16 or seventeen grams.

Unless of course, you are talking about dried herbs. I do not use dried
herbs, nor do any *good* cooks that I know. I have my own herb garden,
my own mortar & pestle, and I pick and crush what ever herbs are
required as needed.


According to the USDA database a tablespoon of dried parsley weighs 1.3
grams and contains 0.67g carbs (0.4g of which are fiber).
A tablespoon of fresh parsley weighs 3.8 grams and contains 0.24g carbs
(0.1g of which is fiber). The difference is the water that the fresh parsley
contains.

Fitday has the same numbers for dried. It doesn't have a listing at all for
fresh.


Once again, to use Fitday, 10 medium black olives list as 2.4 grams of
carb, not 1.4 as claimed by the op.


You forgot to subtract the fiber of 1.2g which would bring it down to 1.2g
carbs.

I *DID* subtract the fibre in the original post, I was responding to a
claim regarding the whole, not the net value. Check the thread.


As for Apple Cider Vinegar, I have three different brands in the
pantry, and based on their nutritional labels, they have approximately
37-39 grams of carb per 100gms of product. This works out to 5.5 carbs
for the quoted quantity, very similar, as I said, to Sushi vinegar.
Both types are distilled vinegars and contain sugar (fructose) and
fruit salts.


Then you have very odd vinegar. Does Australia not have just plain pure
cider vinegar?

I imagine that it does have a great many vinegars, the stock I have on
hand is leftover from an in law who used apple cider vinegar and Honey
on a daily basis. I don't use it myself.


I checked 3 brands at the supermarket tonight and none of
them contained added sugar. All were less than 1g carb per tablespoon.
Both Fitday and the USDA database state that 1 tablespoon of cider vinegar
contains 0.885g and 0.89g of carbs respectively.

Fitday doesn't have a reference for apple cider vinegar which is why I
checked labels. I am using, according to their website, the latest version.



I think that many people who are having inexplicable problems with
weight loss are not being accurate enough with their assessment of
their total carb and calorie counts. Accepting errors like this in
calculation of meal/food ingredients is going to make a very big
difference in true daily consumption; many people may well be eating
more than double the values they are assuming to be correct.


Just because you buy vinegar with sugar in it doesn't make the original
poster wrong or the rest of us accepting of large errors.

I see large errors on an almost daily basis. Add a few of them up and
you have a problem if you take things that are posted here as valid. You
need to carefully check everything before accepting them.

Regards

David

FOB wrote:

Tablespoons are a volume measurement, grams are a weight measurement, you
must know the density of the item being measured to compare them.

I will try to remember to switch to full pedant mode if I have occasion
to respond to you in the future. g

Yes, freshly crushed herbs are less dense than water, but the difference
isn't all that great. A tablespoon of freshly crushed parsley weighs 11
grams, not 15. It is still much higher than quoted.

You state
that a tablespoon of parsley equals 15 grams with .9 grams of carb. FitDay
also says that 1 cup of parsley has 4 grams carb (less 2 fiber). Using your
figures a cup would have 16 (tablespoons per cup) times .9 = 14.4 grams carb
less .5 times 16 = 8 g fiber.

As for your vinegar figure, since it is a liquid it is close to 15 grams per
tablespoon. Faye used one tablespoon in her recipe. The USDA database says
..9 grams carb for cider vinegar. I don't have a bottle handy but I do have
a bottle of balsamic vinegar, which is generally higher in carbs than cider
vinegar, and it only has 2 carbs per tablespoon. I think you must be
reading your labels wrong or you have some very strange vinegar.

I agree, apple cider vinegar is strange vinegar. It was a fad quite a
few years ago, I see no benefit in it. I don't like the taste, and if it
wasn't left here by a relative who drinks apple cider vinegar and honey
every day when she visits, I wouldn't own the stuff.

And isn't
distilled vinegar white vinegar? Distillation removes all the lovely
particles floating around that give various vinegars their flavor.

Distillation of vinegar is a process, not a result. Many vinegars are
distilled with, (like alcoholic beverages) a great deal added to them
after the distilling process. The apple cider vinegar that I have is
designed for *drinking*, in fact aside from those people who drink it
for various supposed health benefits, I see no use for it. It doesn't
taste pleasant, too sweet, and is too carb laden to be healthy.


Maybe if you say pretty please JC will give you a math lesson.

Then again, maybe I don't need a math lesson.


Regards

David

FOB wrote:

Tablespoons are a volume measurement, grams are a weight measurement, you
must know the density of the item being measured to compare them.

I will try to remember to switch to full pedant mode if I have occasion
to respond to you in the future. g

Yes, freshly crushed herbs are less dense than water, but the difference
isn't all that great. A tablespoon of freshly crushed parsley weighs 11
grams, not 15. It is still much higher than quoted.

You state
that a tablespoon of parsley equals 15 grams with .9 grams of carb. FitDay
also says that 1 cup of parsley has 4 grams carb (less 2 fiber). Using your
figures a cup would have 16 (tablespoons per cup) times .9 = 14.4 grams carb
less .5 times 16 = 8 g fiber.

As for your vinegar figure, since it is a liquid it is close to 15 grams per
tablespoon. Faye used one tablespoon in her recipe. The USDA database says
..9 grams carb for cider vinegar. I don't have a bottle handy but I do have
a bottle of balsamic vinegar, which is generally higher in carbs than cider
vinegar, and it only has 2 carbs per tablespoon. I think you must be
reading your labels wrong or you have some very strange vinegar.

I agree, apple cider vinegar is strange vinegar. It was a fad quite a
few years ago, I see no benefit in it. I don't like the taste, and if it
wasn't left here by a relative who drinks apple cider vinegar and honey
every day when she visits, I wouldn't own the stuff.

And isn't
distilled vinegar white vinegar? Distillation removes all the lovely
particles floating around that give various vinegars their flavor.

Distillation of vinegar is a process, not a result. Many vinegars are
distilled with, (like alcoholic beverages) a great deal added to them
after the distilling process. The apple cider vinegar that I have is
designed for *drinking*, in fact aside from those people who drink it
for various supposed health benefits, I see no use for it. It doesn't
taste pleasant, too sweet, and is too carb laden to be healthy.


Maybe if you say pretty please JC will give you a math lesson.

Then again, maybe I don't need a math lesson.


Regards

David

J. David Anderson wrote:
Jeri wrote:

You are correct. A tablespoon of freshly picked and crushed parsley
weighs 13 grams; a level tablespoon that is. As most people cooking use
at least slightly heaped measure, it would probably be closer to make it
16 or seventeen grams.

USDA says a tablespoon of parsley (Parsley, raw) weighs 3.8 grams.
It lists a tablespoon of dried parsley (Spices, parsley, dried)
as weighing 1.3 grams. Where in the world are you getting 13 grams?



--
jamie )

"There's a seeker born every minute."

"jamie" wrote in message
...
J. David Anderson wrote:
Jeri wrote:

You are correct. A tablespoon of freshly picked and crushed
parsley
weighs 13 grams; a level tablespoon that is. As most people
cooking use
at least slightly heaped measure, it would probably be closer to
make it
16 or seventeen grams.

USDA says a tablespoon of parsley (Parsley, raw) weighs 3.8 grams.
It lists a tablespoon of dried parsley (Spices, parsley, dried)
as weighing 1.3 grams. Where in the world are you getting 13 grams?


Somebody dropped a decimal point.

revek