hiking, & Backpacker article

Today I read in Backpacker magazine a small article on low-carb eating and
hiking. It quotes Dr. Agatston of South Beach and a Dr. Liz Applegate (a
sports nutritionist), gives a sample menu for a day of hiking, and has two
meals you can prepare on the trail. The article assumes 2,800 calories needed
for every 6 hours of backpacking and recommends eating 30 carbs for every hour
of hiking. I think that's not too far off from what the distance bikers here
have been doing. It also recommends protein with every meal, and whole grain
foods instead of refined carbs (duh). The recipes were for a tomato couscous
salad and black beans with wild rice. The menu suggested oatmeal for breakfast
and snacks of apples with peanut butter, and energy bars or trail mix.

I read this the day after a strenuous hike, but that's okay. We had planned a
6-mile hike yesterday that was described as "quite difficult" in this book I
have. Since going low-carb, I've not had sufficient energy on our hikes, so I
decided that for the 2 days beforehand I would eat on the high end of my carb
range. I'm more or less at maintenance level, which has been 80-100 carbs/day,
so I had about 100-110 carbs on Friday and Saturday, had a hearty breakfast,
and took a 42-net-carb Clif bar along for the hike.

This was the first hike since going low-carb where I had enough energy. It was
indeed quite difficult, with some very long and steep uphill sections, and I
felt aerobically stressed a couple of times, but it was still much more
manageable than the previous two hikes, which had been the same length but
without the hills. I am really pleased with the outcome -- it was exactly what
I was looking for. So now I know: before a big hike, I should eat at the
upper end of my carb range, but there's no need to go much past it.

There was a strawberry festival going on nearby, so of course we visited that.
I now have a t-shirt that reads "Eat More Strawberries" g. It was a good
opportunity for lunch, too -- I inhaled a chicken caesar wrap. This morning, I
was a pound over my posted weight, which is normal considering that I have a
3-pound weight fluctuation.

This was a milestone in that the disconnect I was feeling between my WOE and my
love of hiking wasn't there yesterday. We've made reservations to go to
Phantom Ranch, at the bottom of the Grand Canyon, next year. That will be 9.5
miles down, a day of rest, and 9.5 miles back up. So I needed to work out my
food issues well in advance. And now I have.


Daria
166/140.5/140
sugar-free since 2/1/04
low-carb since 2/17/04

In article , DG511 wrote:

...
I read this the day after a strenuous hike, but that's okay. We had planned a
6-mile hike yesterday that was described as "quite difficult" in this book I
have. Since going low-carb, I've not had sufficient energy on our hikes, so I
decided that for the 2 days beforehand I would eat on the high end of my carb
range. I'm more or less at maintenance level, which has been 80-100 carbs/day,
so I had about 100-110 carbs on Friday and Saturday, had a hearty breakfast,
and took a 42-net-carb Clif bar along for the hike.

This was the first hike since going low-carb where I had enough energy. It was
indeed quite difficult, with some very long and steep uphill sections, and I
felt aerobically stressed a couple of times, but it was still much more
manageable than the previous two hikes, which had been the same length but
without the hills. I am really pleased with the outcome -- it was exactly what
I was looking for. So now I know: before a big hike, I should eat at the
upper end of my carb range, but there's no need to go much past it.
...
This was a milestone in that the disconnect I was feeling between my WOE and my
love of hiking wasn't there yesterday. We've made reservations to go to
Phantom Ranch, at the bottom of the Grand Canyon, next year. That will be 9.5
miles down, a day of rest, and 9.5 miles back up. So I needed to work out my
food issues well in advance. And now I have.

Daria


Hi Daria and all!

I'm a low-carber and an endurance hiker/climber -- my personal best is
21 miles of nasty terrain, 8,400 vertical feet up, and 8,400 vertical
feet down in a single 26.5 hour climb.

Everybody's different, but what works for me is the following:

o No particular change in diet the days before.

o Large eggs-and-meat breakfast before starting up.
Denny's Triple Play is my friend.

o Hike slow. That keeps your energy demands in
line with what your digestive system can deliver.
(There are lots of other reasons why you should
hike slow -- cardio is best done in controlled
environments where the risk of injury is way
lower and, anyway, it's nice to *look* at the
wilderness while you hike through it ... )

o Eat a reasonable amount *every* hour. I carry
homemade mixed nuts, Babybel wax-encased cheese,
summer sausage, hard salomi, and pouches of
seafood and meat.

o Drink a *lot*. Most people don't understand how
critical hydration is to strength. Water you
consume is always worth its weight in your pack.
I've carried more than 7 quarts on some large
climbs.

o Before high-intensity parts of the hike, cheat
with a limited amount of easily-digested carbs
like Gatorade or PowerGel (double-caffeinated
Tangerine is my personal rocket fuel).

o After a hike, eat as large and diverse of a
meal as possible. Steakhouses with all-you-can-
eat salad bars rock.

Everyone's different, but slowing down the pace and eating and
drinking frequently works for virtually all the endurance hikers I
know.

BTW, it's not diet, but check out trekking poles if you aren't
already using them. Most people find poles let them travel
further with fewer falls and a *lot* less joint pain.

Also BTW, congratulations on finding what's gotta be the greatest
fitness activity on Earth. Hiking's cheap, anyone can do it, it's
great exercise, it's the perfect solitary activity, it's the perfect
group activity, and few things are as satisfying as finishing a
challenging hike.

Cheers, Wolf.


--
Dr. Brian Leverich ("Wolf" on trail)
List Finisher, Hundred Peaks Section of the Sierra Club
http://angeles.sierraclub.org/hps/

"Dr. Brian Leverich"

writes:

I'm a low-carber and an endurance hiker/climber -- my personal best is
21 miles of nasty terrain, 8,400 vertical feet up, and 8,400 vertical
feet down in a single 26.5 hour climb.

Wow! I'm impressed. My most challenging hike was 14 miles in 1 day, with an
elevation gain of about 4,000 feet through one very steep section. We've got
plans to go to Phantom Ranch in the Grand Canyon (1 mile elevation change over
6 miles, with 3.5 flat miles each way), but we're going down one day, staying a
day to recover (and eat), and going back up the third day. We're also talking
about doing the Appalachian Trail in segments. We're not temperamentally
suited to backpacking 1,200 miles all at once, but we could definitely do it
spread out over several years.

Everybody's different, but what works for me is the following:

o No particular change in diet the days before.

o Large eggs-and-meat breakfast before starting up.
Denny's Triple Play is my friend.

My standard pre-hike breakfast has been smoked salmon benedict (2 poached eggs,
hollandaise, smoked salmon) with 1/2 an English muffin instead of a whole one,
and a side of fruit. It's filling, which seems important.

o Hike slow. That keeps your energy demands in
line with what your digestive system can deliver.
(There are lots of other reasons why you should
hike slow -- cardio is best done in controlled
environments where the risk of injury is way
lower and, anyway, it's nice to *look* at the
wilderness while you hike through it ... )

Right -- I never understood the notion of racing, unless there's a problem with
limited remaining sunlight. And now I have a headlamp, although I'm still not
into hiking at night.

o Eat a reasonable amount *every* hour. I carry
homemade mixed nuts, Babybel wax-encased cheese,
summer sausage, hard salomi, and pouches of
seafood and meat.

Great suggestions.

o Drink a *lot*. Most people don't understand how
critical hydration is to strength. Water you
consume is always worth its weight in your pack.
I've carried more than 7 quarts on some large
climbs.

o Before high-intensity parts of the hike, cheat
with a limited amount of easily-digested carbs
like Gatorade or PowerGel (double-caffeinated
Tangerine is my personal rocket fuel).

I have limited experience with the gels, but it's something I might experiment
with. Up to this point, I've taken a large bag of raisins on most hikes, and
that seems to work.

o After a hike, eat as large and diverse of a
meal as possible. Steakhouses with all-you-can-
eat salad bars rock.

I'm very good at that part g. Even before I gained the weight that I
ultimately had to lose, I would scarf down a huge steak after a hike. With
veggies of course, and bread, which isn't normally something I crave.

Everyone's different, but slowing down the pace and eating and
drinking frequently works for virtually all the endurance hikers I
know.

BTW, it's not diet, but check out trekking poles if you aren't
already using them. Most people find poles let them travel
further with fewer falls and a *lot* less joint pain.

I've been using trekking poles for about a year and a half now, and I love
them! I feel a lot more secure, and they're great for steadying. Last time we
were in the Grand Canyon, we talked to people with poles who used them to pull
themselves up on the really steep parts. It seems that the poes take strain
off of the joints because they reduce the need to contort the knees and ankles.

Also BTW, congratulations on finding what's gotta be the greatest
fitness activity on Earth. Hiking's cheap, anyone can do it, it's
great exercise, it's the perfect solitary activity, it's the perfect
group activity, and few things are as satisfying as finishing a
challenging hike.

All true -- I've been hiking in the desert, in mountain snow, and in all other
kinds of conditions, and it's very fulfilling.

Thanks for your input!

Daria
166/140.5/140
sugar-free since 2/1/04
low-carb since 2/17/04

Them was some great tips on hiking. Thank you. I did just a 5 mile hike, and
with a bunch of kids on Saturday, while camping. One of the kids found me a
large stick to walk the last couple miles with. So that pole thing sounds good.
I have the joint pain easily with Fibro. Working my way up slowly, who knows
what I will be up to by the end of summer. I am considering this summer a
healing summer. In many ways. Emotionally, physically. I connect with the
outdoors. Again, thanks for the tips!

Everybody's different, but what works for me is the following:

o No particular change in diet the days before.

o Large eggs-and-meat breakfast before starting up.
Denny's Triple Play is my friend.

o Hike slow. That keeps your energy demands in
line with what your digestive system can deliver.
(There are lots of other reasons why you should
hike slow -- cardio is best done in controlled
environments where the risk of injury is way
lower and, anyway, it's nice to *look* at the
wilderness while you hike through it ... )

o Eat a reasonable amount *every* hour. I carry
homemade mixed nuts, Babybel wax-encased cheese,
summer sausage, hard salomi, and pouches of
seafood and meat.

o Drink a *lot*. Most people don't understand how
critical hydration is to strength. Water you
consume is always worth its weight in your pack.
I've carried more than 7 quarts on some large
climbs.

o Before high-intensity parts of the hike, cheat
with a limited amount of easily-digested carbs
like Gatorade or PowerGel (double-caffeinated
Tangerine is my personal rocket fuel).

o After a hike, eat as large and diverse of a
meal as possible. Steakhouses with all-you-can-
eat salad bars rock.

Everyone's different, but slowing down the pace and eating and
drinking frequently works for virtually all the endurance hikers I
know.

BTW, it's not diet, but check out trekking poles if you aren't
already using them. Most people find poles let them travel
further with fewer falls and a *lot* less joint pain.

Also BTW, congratulations on finding what's gotta be the greatest
fitness activity on Earth. Hiking's cheap, anyone can do it, it's
great exercise, it's the perfect solitary activity, it's the perfect
group activity, and few things are as satisfying as finishing a
challenging hike.

Cheers, Wolf.

Daria, great suggestions also! Thanks for sharing them. I think the breakfast
you mentioned sounds awesome and filling. Should be easy to fix at a campsite
right?

Got to look into one of them poles thats being talked about. Where would I get
one?

My standard pre-hike breakfast has been smoked salmon benedict (2 poached
eggs,
hollandaise, smoked salmon) with 1/2 an English muffin instead of a whole
one,
and a side of fruit. It's filling, which seems important.


============
-Peace of mind comes from accepting what we cannot control and taking
responsibility for what we can.-
Atkins since 1/17/04
267/214/135
CCLL-40
============

(Sunshyne)

writes:

Got to look into one of them poles thats being talked about. Where would I
get
one?

Any outdoor supply company should have them, and I guess they'd be available at
department stores that had a good range of outdoor goods. We got ours at REI
because we each have a membership there.


Daria
166/140.5/140
sugar-free since 2/1/04
low-carb since 2/17/04

DG511 wrote:

(Sunshyne)

writes:

Got to look into one of them poles thats being talked about. Where would I
get
one?

Any outdoor supply company should have them, and I guess they'd be
available at department stores that had a good range of outdoor goods. We
got ours at REI because we each have a membership there.

sierra trading post has them, and their prices are pretty good.

http://www.sierratradingpost.com

search for "poles"

In article ,
The Queen of Cans and Jars wrote:

DG511 wrote:

(Sunshyne)

writes:

Got to look into one of them poles thats being talked about. Where would I
get
one?

Any outdoor supply company should have them, and I guess they'd be
available at department stores that had a good range of outdoor goods. We
got ours at REI because we each have a membership there.

sierra trading post has them, and their prices are pretty good.

http://www.sierratradingpost.com

search for "poles"


More free advice (somebody pick up a rock and shush him!):

Think about buying Leki poles. If you're small and graceful it
doesn't much matter, but big clumsy folk like me have a tendency to
break poles with depressing frequency.

Except Lekis. I haven't managed to break one yet. In fact, my
current and only pair survived when I drove my Jeep right over them.

You can also get replacement parts for Lekis. When you wear down the
tips, you don't have to throw the poles away.

OH, IMPORTANT: it's poles plural. Folks often think of hiking with
a single staff, but a pair of poles will give you much better stability
and take much more weight and impact off your knees.

Also, if you're one of those folks who worry about appearances, poles
will definitely not make you look like a geek or a newbie. The people
who do really interesting things use poles. (:

#####

ANOTHER CRUCIAL HIKING TIP:

Your feet matter. More than anything. Here are some things to try if
you blister:

(1) Put foot powder, baby powder, or *antiperspirant*
on them.

(2) Wear thin wicking liner socks next to your skin.
Coolmax works for me.

(3) Then wear expedition weight wool socks (even in
summer!), one size *too* *small*. Good thick wool
socks will stretch to fit, and small socks won't
bunch up and give you blisters.

(4) Hike slow.

(5) Stop every few hours (or more often if necessary)
and take your shoes and socks off. All the way.
Then put them back on again.

I'm personally fond of light, low trailrunners even when I'm doing
desert peaks and have 25 pounds of water *plus* all my usual gear on
my back. BUT. Low shoes are dangerous. I busted one of my long
bones right above the ankle the first time I tried them. I think it
probably takes a year or two of steady use to really safely use
low-cut shoes on trail. Be way careful when you're starting out with
the things.

#####

SHAMELESS SALES PITCH:

About twice a week I lead peak hikes for the Sierra Club in the area
around Los Angeles. Most of the hikes appear in the outings listings
at:

http://angeles.sierraclub.org/hps/

Some of the hikes are extremely challenging, but many of them are
satisfactory for folks just starting out. If you'd like to get into
hiking and camping, think about joining us on a hike. Drop me a note
if you can't figure out which hikes are right for you to begin with.

BTW, if you're up in Washington State, check out:

http://www.mountaineers.org/

They also sponsor a large number of outings.

Cheers, Wolf.


--
Dr. Brian Leverich, aka "Wolf" on trail
List Finisher, Hundred Peaks Section of the Sierra Club

In article , Sunshyne wrote:
Them was some great tips on hiking. Thank you. I did just a 5 mile hike, and
with a bunch of kids on Saturday, while camping. One of the kids found me a
large stick to walk the last couple miles with. So that pole thing sounds good.
I have the joint pain easily with Fibro. Working my way up slowly, who knows
what I will be up to by the end of summer. I am considering this summer a
healing summer. In many ways. Emotionally, physically. I connect with the
outdoors. Again, thanks for the tips!


Yipes, I'm talkative tonight. Some trail wisdom on joint pain:

Definitely try poles. They work and reduce pain for almost everyone.

Slow down. Even if you think you're already slow, slow down more.
This also works for almost everyone.

Try Superfeet insoles. They can change the way you walk, and they
help some people with joint as well as foot pain.

RICE is the standard litany for swelling. That's Rest, Ice,
Compression, and Elevation. Massage also feels way good on sore
muscles, especially if you can talk your S.O. into participating. (:

Check with your doctor, but glucosamine seems to help some folks.
Expect to take it for several months before you really see benefits.

Check with your doctor, but research and experience in the last few
years indicates taking any of the nonsteroidal anti-inflamatory drugs
(aspirin, advil, tylenol, ... ) may be a bad idea for hikers. The
stuff is generally bad for your kidneys (which are stressed by waste
and dehydration during hiking) and the recent research indicates that
NSAIDs may suppress muscle and connective tissue regeneration after
hiking. The effects seem to vary widely between individuals.

(I'm sensitive to the NSAIDs problem because I almost sent myself into
renal failure with the darn things, but I'm one of the poor *******s
who is particularly sensitive to NSAIDs.)

Anyway, my subject-to-doctor's-approval general advice is that hikers
should stay away from NSAIDs. They cause more pain in the long run
than they save in the short run.

I find water and food makes a big difference in how I feel the day
after. Drinking a lot and eating during the hike, then having a
dinner with a wide variety of food (eating lots of colors at a salad
bar ... ) makes me feel better the next day.

Cheers, Wolf.


--
Dr. Brian Leverich, aka "Wolf" on trail
List Finisher, Hundred Peaks Section of the Sierra Club
http://angeles.sierraclub.org/hps/

From: "Dr. Brian Leverich"
Yipes, I'm talkative tonight. Some trail wisdom on joint pain:


I am in a talkative mood too. So no problem.

Definitely try poles. They work and reduce pain for almost everyone.

Slow down. Even if you think you're already slow, slow down more.
This also works for almost everyone.


OK, will slow down.

Try Superfeet insoles. They can change the way you walk, and they
help some people with joint as well as foot pain.


Never heard of them. Will look into it.

RICE is the standard litany for swelling. That's Rest, Ice,
Compression, and Elevation. Massage also feels way good on sore
muscles, especially if you can talk your S.O. into participating. (:

Yes, have been doing this. Its been helpful. Forget the S.O. helping in any
way. But thats OK.

Check with your doctor, but glucosamine seems to help some folks.
Expect to take it for several months before you really see benefits.

Never heard of this glucosamine. Will search it. Ask the doc about it.

Check with your doctor, but research and experience in the last few
years indicates taking any of the nonsteroidal anti-inflamatory drugs
(aspirin, advil, tylenol, ... ) may be a bad idea for hikers. The
stuff is generally bad for your kidneys (which are stressed by waste
and dehydration during hiking) and the recent research indicates that
NSAIDs may suppress muscle and connective tissue regeneration after
hiking. The effects seem to vary widely between individuals.

I don't take the NSAID's either. I have in the past. Like Celebrex and Vioxx.
Neither really helped. Naproxen felt like it made holes in the stomach.
Rheumatologists usually do prescribe the NSAID's right off for Fibro patients.
That irks me.

(I'm sensitive to the NSAIDs problem because I almost sent myself into
renal failure with the darn things, but I'm one of the poor *******s
who is particularly sensitive to NSAIDs.)


Thats wild. I stopped taking them when I came down with a severe kidney
infection. It about sent me into renal failure. I do take oxycontin. For pain
with the Fibromyalgia. Flexeril, and Wellbutrin also. Got tired of not finding
a good doctor. Had to educate myself on all of this. I am also seeing a
neurosurgeon. Whiplash and lower back issues. I am in pain most of the time.
Kinda getting used to it. I have strong muslces, yet painful ones. My legs is
most affected. I am also starting the conservative treatment for the back and
neck. Starting steriod injections, traction, and PT. If that don't work, onto
the next treatment.

Anyway, my subject-to-doctor's-approval general advice is that hikers
should stay away from NSAIDs. They cause more pain in the long run
than they save in the short run.

I find water and food makes a big difference in how I feel the day
after. Drinking a lot and eating during the hike, then having a
dinner with a wide variety of food (eating lots of colors at a salad
bar ... ) makes me feel better the next day.

Cheers, Wolf.


Since I began the low carbing diet. I have seen improvements in my health. I
eat differently now than I used to. No junk food, sugar is limited. After
starting the Atkins, I discovered I have allergies to dairy, wheat, and
fermented foods. I love my vegetables. I drink lots and lots of water. I have
so far lost 50 pounds.


Friends and others think and say to me, how can you be doing this exerise,
hiking, biking, camping.. With the health problems you have, the pain. My
reply.. I gave up for a few years. Finally said enough of feeling sorry for
myself. Started trying different things out on my own. I have given up on
doctors to even help me. I got a heart of a 37 year old, body feeling like a
100 year old. I am sick and tired of feeling sick and tired. I have three
teenage sons to raise. And want to be a good example. I hurt, I am in pain 90
percent of the time.. I will most likely be in pain for the rest of my life. Oh
well, still going to enjoy what life has to offer. Do the best I can do with
what I got. Pray for some sort of relief or a cure for myself and other
Fibromyalgia patients.

So, you are a doctor?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
-Enlightenment is the quiet acceptance of what is.-
Atkins since 1/17/04
267/214/135
CCLL-40
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~