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#12
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
What exactly were you eating that you thought you were on the Atkins
diet? Can you give us an idea of what you were eating on a typical day? Gee, I "thought" I was on Atkins! Breakfast, eggs, bacon, slice of low carb toast (5 effective grams) with butter, coffee with Splenda and cream (decaf, one cup) Lunch, antipasto (cheese, salami, olives, lettuce, tomato (1 slice), Italian "rag soup" (chicken broth with egg/parmesan "noodles"), Diet Rite soda (made with Splenda) Snack, mozzarella cheese stick (string cheese), about 12-15 almonds, Dinner, small steak or chicken breast, small salad with oil and vinegar dressing, low carb veggie (usually green beans, asparagus, fried cabbage "noodles", cauliflower, broccoli) Snack, low carb ice cream (Breyers, about 5-10 grams carb) or sf jello with whipped cream, flavored (Atkins or DaVinci syrups) decaf coffee with cream. Extra yummies or planned "cheats" are berries with cream, cream cheese stuffed celery, fiber rye Wasa toast with cheese. My carb intake usually runs (ran) about 20-25 for induction (2 weeks) and 35-45 afterwards depending upon keto sticks, trace ketosis showing was good. Are you suggesting that the Atkins diet brought on these seizures. How did your shoulder get broken? What do you mean your "system just quit on you"? Never said anything of the sort! Mild ketosis did not prevent me from having seizures as it does for some children. Apparently my body believed itself to be in severe starvation mode and seizures may have been brought on by that factor and dehydration. Since this happened shortly after waking and before food or liquid was consumed, I had been without food or drink for too long. Who sips water or nibbles while sleeping? My body quit responding to a sense of being alert. I passed out. I had seizures. Many people that suffer grand mal seizures break or dislocate a shoulder, bite their tongues, etc. It's very painful but very common. Understand a bit better? I don't know how else to put it. Some people of which I am apparently one, have a lower threshold for seizure activity You are diabetic and you chose to go low-carb. You then went with the lowest carb diet without considering less restrictive low-carb diets such as the Zone. Is that correct? FTR, I have had hospital training (diabetes educators) in carb counting to keep my diabetes in control. If you check the American Diabetes Association at http://diabetes.about.com/cs/carbcen...bohydrates.htm you can better understand the impact of carbohydrates on blood sugar. I have tried the Zone and also Sugar Busters, both of which I found rather confusing as well as restrictive. While Atkins is a low carb diet but it is NOT a NO CARB diet as many uneducated people assume. My doctor approved of my diet and it seemed to be working well for weight loss AND to keep my diabetes under control. I was able to go from 3-5 shots of insulin per day to ONE! My hemoglobin A1c went from 10.5 down to 6.1 in 6 months. Blood pressure was lower and cholesterol went from 167 to 145 while enjoying eggs and cream in my coffee. Atkins does work. I am completely in support of the low-carb way of life. Having said that, if I were diabetic and trying a new and controversial way of eating to lose weight and regain control of by diabetes, I would go slow and methodically research the various low-carb options. I would make less extreme changes to my diet, monitoring the results carefully. I would do it with the supervision and help of a progressive and supportive doctor. And I wouldn't aim to lose 50 or 60 lbs in only three months. Read: Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution by Richard K. Bernstein (Author http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...31267?v=glance As I said before, in other words, Atkins WOE did help control my diabetes and other health problems. Maintaining a low carb lifestyle ala Atkins is hardly "controversial" anymore except to certain individuals that have sold fewer books, LOL. I still like Atkins. I just am staying out of ketosis, keeping hydrated and added some additional carbs to my diet to where I am maintaining my weight loss. Apparently I needed more carbs than I was getting and my body rebelled. My observances were of my own health situation. It is always a good idea to look at a problem with the intention of finding out what works and what doesn't. We are individuals and one way of eating doesn't work for everbody all the time. For instance, many believe that Bernstien is a quack but he has many loyal followers as well as does Atkins. This particular post was geared at talking about a ketogenic diet (Atkins is that) preventing seizures in children. My reply was meant to tell readers that it may not work the same way in adults because it did not keep me from having seizures. Since it is recent and personal history it may be informative. I was on Atkins longer than 3 months, more like 6, but went off for a couple weeks (flu) and back on again. You are on the right track, just do it slow and easy. You will get there without having to take extreme measures. Also read The Zone by Barry Sears, his diet is easier to adhere to and less carb restrictive than Atkins. TC Thanks, I have been on every weight loss plan know to humanity except surgical procedures. Since I am only about 6-7 pounds from my goal weight, I'm not really concerned about learning a new diet. I am still staying away from white stuff, rice, potatoes, fluffy carby food, but I do enjoy eating and I will have a honey baked ham for Christmas as well as a cookie here and there. Since I am not gaining while eating pretty much what I want (small slice of pumpkin pie today) I have decided not to worry about it. What really is amazing is that I am more relaxed about food and eating than I have been in years. I had beef and noodles last week, home made, heavy on the beef, light on the noodles and it is working for me. I do not find myself overeating (tummy shrunk!) and I continue to drink lots of water. I'm over 50 and my skin is smooth as a baby's butt, combination of Italian genetics and water I believe IMHO, low carb diets are very good and Atkins is one of the best. It was not responsible for my seizures but it did not, as it does for some children, prevent me from having seizures! Nancy J |
#13
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
tcomeau wrote:
:: "Nancy Huffines" wrote in message :: om... ::: After being on Atkins for 3 months, I had seizures around the first ::: week in ::: November. My right shoulder is broken and I am now on anti-seizure ::: meds. ::: There was no clinical reason for the seizures and the only finding ::: for cause ::: may have been dehydration. FTR, I always drink plenty of water but ::: apparently upon just waking up after a nights sleep and not having ::: food in ::: my system for many hours, my system just quit on me. I am diabetic ::: and found ::: my sugar was much lower, maybe too low with the meds I was taking ::: which have ::: also been adjusted. I am not low carbing now but also have not gone ::: "hog ::: wild" and use about 100-150 grams carb per day. Feeling good and ::: maintaining ::: my 58 pound weight loss ::: ::: Nancy J ::: :: :: What exactly were you eating that you thought you were on the Atkins :: diet? Can you give us an idea of what you were eating on a typical :: day? :: :: Are you suggesting that the Atkins diet brought on these seizures. :: How :: did your shoulder get broken? :: :: What do you mean your "system just quit on you"? :: :: You are diabetic and you chose to go low-carb. You then went with the :: lowest carb diet without considering less restrictive low-carb diets :: such as the Zone. Is that correct? What makes you say that Atkins is the lowest-carb diet? After induction (if you even do induction) one is free to adjust carb levels to whatever provided the weight loss continues. :: :: I am completely in support of the low-carb way of life. Having said :: that, if I were diabetic and trying a new and controversial way of :: eating to lose weight and regain control of by diabetes, I would go :: slow and methodically research the various low-carb options. I would :: make less extreme changes to my diet, monitoring the results :: carefully. I would do it with the supervision and help of a :: progressive and supportive doctor. And I wouldn't aim to lose 50 or :: 60 :: lbs in only three months. I disagree with your assumption/implication that Atkins is extreme. I think Atkins was the best thing I could have done for myself. You are correct that someone who is diabetic must be careful because medications/insulin that a diabetic may be taking can end up being too much once the carbs are removed. I know that I had low BG problems once I started LCing and exercising a lot. I, as a T2, was able to recognize the signs of low BG levels, and then use my meter to confirm. However, diabetics, assuming they have been educated, should know to regularly check BG levels with a meter. I also agree with your statement about trying to lose 50 to 60 lbs in 3 months. Not advised. However, I don't think the OP said she was trying to lose that much, just that she did, even though it is now December so some of that may have come after November. Nancy: are you sure what you had was really a seizure? I've found that when by BG level gets really low, weakness results. Perhaps you just had a really bad spell of weakness and fell? Have you had anymore of these seizures? If the problem was related to dehydration, it would seem that being over 100 g per day -- enough to keep you out of ketosis, would prevent that (I personally don't believe that being in ketosis makes one dehydrated). Once when I was on meds I awoke in the middle of the night with low BG. Not fun. Oh...the use of the ketogentic diet was never for adults. For some reason, it was only useful in young kids. |
#14
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
"Nancy Huffines" wrote in message ...
What exactly were you eating that you thought you were on the Atkins diet? Can you give us an idea of what you were eating on a typical day? Gee, I "thought" I was on Atkins! Breakfast, eggs, bacon, slice of low carb toast (5 effective grams) with butter, coffee with Splenda and cream (decaf, one cup) Lunch, antipasto (cheese, salami, olives, lettuce, tomato (1 slice), Italian "rag soup" (chicken broth with egg/parmesan "noodles"), Diet Rite soda (made with Splenda) Snack, mozzarella cheese stick (string cheese), about 12-15 almonds, Dinner, small steak or chicken breast, small salad with oil and vinegar dressing, low carb veggie (usually green beans, asparagus, fried cabbage "noodles", cauliflower, broccoli) Snack, low carb ice cream (Breyers, about 5-10 grams carb) or sf jello with whipped cream, flavored (Atkins or DaVinci syrups) decaf coffee with cream. Extra yummies or planned "cheats" are berries with cream, cream cheese stuffed celery, fiber rye Wasa toast with cheese. My carb intake usually runs (ran) about 20-25 for induction (2 weeks) and 35-45 afterwards depending upon keto sticks, trace ketosis showing was good. A lot of people overload on meat and fat thinking that they are on the Atkins diet. I was trying to get an idea of what and how much you were eating at each meal. Your reply did not clear this up at all. Are you suggesting that the Atkins diet brought on these seizures. How did your shoulder get broken? What do you mean your "system just quit on you"? Never said anything of the sort! Mild ketosis did not prevent me from having seizures as it does for some children. Apparently my body believed itself to be in severe starvation mode and seizures may have been brought on by that factor and dehydration. Since this happened shortly after waking and before food or liquid was consumed, I had been without food or drink for too long. Who sips water or nibbles while sleeping? My body quit responding to a sense of being alert. I passed out. I had seizures. Many people that suffer grand mal seizures break or dislocate a shoulder, bite their tongues, etc. It's very painful but very common. Understand a bit better? I don't know how else to put it. Some people of which I am apparently one, have a lower threshold for seizure activity This clarifies your previous statement. thanks. You are diabetic and you chose to go low-carb. You then went with the lowest carb diet without considering less restrictive low-carb diets such as the Zone. Is that correct? FTR, I have had hospital training (diabetes educators) in carb counting to keep my diabetes in control. If you check the American Diabetes Association at http://diabetes.about.com/cs/carbcen...bohydrates.htm you can better understand the impact of carbohydrates on blood sugar. I have no interest in what the American Diabetes Association has to say or recomend. Their diets are loaded with complex carbs. They are also heavily sponsored (and owned, IMO) by the pharma and food industries. Check out their corporate sponsor page. Sends a shiver down my spine every time I think about the influence they have on doctors, gov'ts and gov't agencies and th ose who suffer from diabetes. I have tried the Zone and also Sugar Busters, both of which I found rather confusing as well as restrictive. While Atkins is a low carb diet but it is NOT a NO CARB diet as many uneducated people assume. My doctor approved of my diet and it seemed to be working well for weight loss AND to keep my diabetes under control. I was able to go from 3-5 shots of insulin per day to ONE! My hemoglobin A1c went from 10.5 down to 6.1 in 6 months. Blood pressure was lower and cholesterol went from 167 to 145 while enjoying eggs and cream in my coffee. Atkins does work. The Zone requires a lot of math, but after a couple of months it becomes easy to eyeball a properly balanced meal. I am completely in support of the low-carb way of life. Having said that, if I were diabetic and trying a new and controversial way of eating to lose weight and regain control of by diabetes, I would go slow and methodically research the various low-carb options. I would make less extreme changes to my diet, monitoring the results carefully. I would do it with the supervision and help of a progressive and supportive doctor. And I wouldn't aim to lose 50 or 60 lbs in only three months. Read: Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution by Richard K. Bernstein (Author http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...31267?v=glance As I said before, in other words, Atkins WOE did help control my diabetes and other health problems. Maintaining a low carb lifestyle ala Atkins is hardly "controversial" anymore except to certain individuals that have sold fewer books, LOL. I still like Atkins. I just am staying out of ketosis, keeping hydrated and added some additional carbs to my diet to where I am maintaining my weight loss. Apparently I needed more carbs than I was getting and my body rebelled. My observances were of my own health situation. It is always a good idea to look at a problem with the intention of finding out what works and what doesn't. We are individuals and one way of eating doesn't work for everbody all the time. For instance, many believe that Bernstien is a quack but he has many loyal followers as well as does Atkins. This particular post was geared at talking about a ketogenic diet (Atkins is that) preventing seizures in children. My reply was meant to tell readers that it may not work the same way in adults because it did not keep me from having seizures. Since it is recent and personal history it may be informative. I was on Atkins longer than 3 months, more like 6, but went off for a couple weeks (flu) and back on again. I fully agree with your assessment of low-carb diets. Dr. Bernstein's book supports low-carbing for diabetics. Very good info for everyone in his book. You are on the right track, just do it slow and easy. You will get there without having to take extreme measures. Also read The Zone by Barry Sears, his diet is easier to adhere to and less carb restrictive than Atkins. TC Thanks, I have been on every weight loss plan know to humanity except surgical procedures. Since I am only about 6-7 pounds from my goal weight, I'm not really concerned about learning a new diet. I am still staying away from white stuff, rice, potatoes, fluffy carby food, but I do enjoy eating and I will have a honey baked ham for Christmas as well as a cookie here and there. Since I am not gaining while eating pretty much what I want (small slice of pumpkin pie today) I have decided not to worry about it. What really is amazing is that I am more relaxed about food and eating than I have been in years. I had beef and noodles last week, home made, heavy on the beef, light on the noodles and it is working for me. I do not find myself overeating (tummy shrunk!) and I continue to drink lots of water. I'm over 50 and my skin is smooth as a baby's butt, combination of Italian genetics and water I believe IMHO, low carb diets are very good and Atkins is one of the best. It was not responsible for my seizures but it did not, as it does for some children, prevent me from having seizures! Nancy J Congrats on your weight loss. Good luck with your seizures. Take Care. TC |
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
"tcomeau" A lot of people overload on meat and fat thinking that they are on the Atkins diet. I was trying to get an idea of what and how much you were eating at each meal. Your reply did not clear this up at all. standard servings. 4-5 ounces of lean meat for dinner, I don't like fatty stuff anyway. Serving sizes of vegetables, anywhere from 1/2 cup to a full cup. Eggs, 2 at breakfast, bacon, about 4 slices crisp or a couple link sausages. I was pretty clear about the fact cream was used in my 1-2 cups of decaf coffee a day although I haven't had much coffee lately. Unlike some folks, I believe portion size is important and seldom if ever overeat unless it's crunchy veggies. Is that better? |
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
Do you think this could work for dogs? I have a dog with epilepsy.
Roxan "Lee B." wrote in message ... Yeah, but ketogenic diets for kids with epilepsy has generally been considered on the "fringe" (kinda like low carb diets for weight lossG). Now that low carb is getting mainstream recognition, it's probably a good time for JHH to get this information back out to the public as well as the medical community in hopes that people will look at it with less skepticism. At least if they have a new study out there, it will turn up in new literature searches. Lee - an RN who actually learned about ketogenic diets in school! PS - if anyone hasn't seen it and can find a copy, watch the movie "First Do No Harm". http://epilepsyontario.org/client/EO/EOWeb.nsf/web/First+Do+No+Harm+(Movie) Roger Zoul wrote: Damn...talk about reinventing the wheel! You'd think these folks would find better things to spend research dollars on. They could start by doing a literature study.... |
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
As I understand it, the ketogenic diets typically used for epileptic children who don't respond to epilepsy medications are stricter than Atkins' Induction, with higher fat, lower protein, very few grams carb, and monitored restriction of liquid. I'm not a bit surprised that your much more liberal list of your diet (including lowcarb breads, sugarfree ice cream) going up to 45g/day didn't prevent seizures. (Possibly it might have, if you had stayed at induction levels.) Nancy Huffines wrote: Never said anything of the sort! Mild ketosis did not prevent me from having seizures as it does for some children. Apparently my body believed itself to be in severe starvation mode and seizures may have been brought on by that factor and dehydration. Since this happened shortly after waking and before food or liquid was consumed, I had been without food or drink for too long. Who sips water or nibbles while sleeping? My body quit responding to a sense of being alert. I passed out. I had seizures. Many people that suffer grand mal seizures break or dislocate a shoulder, bite their tongues, etc. It's very painful but very common. Understand a bit better? I don't know how else to put it. Some people of which I am apparently one, have a lower threshold for seizure activity -- jamie ) "There's a seeker born every minute." |
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
"Roger Zoul" Nancy: are you sure what you had was really a seizure? I've found that when by BG level gets really low, weakness results. Perhaps you just had a really bad spell of weakness and fell? Have you had anymore of these seizures? If the problem was related to dehydration, it would seem that being over 100 g per day -- enough to keep you out of ketosis, would prevent that (I personally don't believe that being in ketosis makes one dehydrated). Once when I was on meds I awoke in the middle of the night with low BG. Not fun. Oh...the use of the ketogentic diet was never for adults. For some reason, it was only useful in young kids. Unfortunately I had a seizure witnessed at home by my husband, was rushed to the hospital by emergency 911 folks and had another seizure in the ER. The only findings that the doctors said may have contributed was low bs and dehydration. I need to eat more often, even when I'm not hungry, much to my dismay. I like being in control of my appetite and am not happy with having to eat but I will control this body as much as possible within my limits. I do check my numbers about 3-5 times a day but had gotten a little lax prior to the seizures because I had been so well controlled...uh, well, that's what I thought, enyhoo. You are right about ketogenic diets being useful in children, not adults. That was the point that I was trying to make but apparently it went over some folk's heads. What is it with the less popular low carb diets that want to discredit Atkins? I am still on a low carb diet, just not as low as I was on. Today had a blue-cheese burger wrap at Ruby Tuesdays. WOW! Wish I had room for desert but it was fabulous and filling. Thanks for being such a sweetie and for your concern. Fortunately I have not had anymore seizures, doc said it may never happen again, who knows! I am on a busload of meds, tired and still sore but I am going to be just fine. When I fell, I hit the floor on my back. I am so grateful that I didn't break more than my little toe and my shoulder...it could have been much worse. Nancy J |
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
I was talking to a ketogenic diet researcher recently and asked if there is
a dog model of the diet. I know it's been tried but this person said that dogs don't go into ketosis in the same way that humans do and that their brain would preferentially use lactate over ketones anyway. He didn't believe it would work in dogs. There are several labs looking at the ketogenic diet in animals in order to determine its mechanism. Rats are often used but I know there is a controversy as to whether there is really an effect in rats or if it's an artefact of the data processing. "roxan" wrote in message ... Do you think this could work for dogs? I have a dog with epilepsy. Roxan "Lee B." wrote in message ... Yeah, but ketogenic diets for kids with epilepsy has generally been considered on the "fringe" (kinda like low carb diets for weight lossG). Now that low carb is getting mainstream recognition, it's probably a good time for JHH to get this information back out to the public as well as the medical community in hopes that people will look at it with less skepticism. At least if they have a new study out there, it will turn up in new literature searches. Lee - an RN who actually learned about ketogenic diets in school! PS - if anyone hasn't seen it and can find a copy, watch the movie "First Do No Harm". http://epilepsyontario.org/client/EO/EOWeb.nsf/web/First+Do+No+Harm+(Movie) Roger Zoul wrote: Damn...talk about reinventing the wheel! You'd think these folks would find better things to spend research dollars on. They could start by doing a literature study.... |
#20
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Atkins diet may reduce seizures in children with epilepsy
I've heard a neurologist say that even a small break from the ketogenic diet
can break its anticonvulsant effects. Something like a kid sneaking a cookie could break the effect. I don't know if this is just from some anecdotal reports or if this is something that's well known. "jamie" wrote in message ... As I understand it, the ketogenic diets typically used for epileptic children who don't respond to epilepsy medications are stricter than Atkins' Induction, with higher fat, lower protein, very few grams carb, and monitored restriction of liquid. I'm not a bit surprised that your much more liberal list of your diet (including lowcarb breads, sugarfree ice cream) going up to 45g/day didn't prevent seizures. (Possibly it might have, if you had stayed at induction levels.) Nancy Huffines wrote: Never said anything of the sort! Mild ketosis did not prevent me from having seizures as it does for some children. Apparently my body believed itself to be in severe starvation mode and seizures may have been brought on by that factor and dehydration. Since this happened shortly after waking and before food or liquid was consumed, I had been without food or drink for too long. Who sips water or nibbles while sleeping? My body quit responding to a sense of being alert. I passed out. I had seizures. Many people that suffer grand mal seizures break or dislocate a shoulder, bite their tongues, etc. It's very painful but very common. Understand a bit better? I don't know how else to put it. Some people of which I am apparently one, have a lower threshold for seizure activity -- jamie ) "There's a seeker born every minute." |
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