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Discover The 110 Amazing Fat Fighting Foods-Guaranteed To MeltStubborn Body Fat!
On Mar 11, 12:38*pm, Doug Freyburger wrote:
wrote: Susan wrote: Doug Freyburger wrote: Danger of stall yes, danger of illness no. All weight loss comes with the danger of stalls; that's the role of the endocrine feedback loop. *In this case, ketosis or very low cal are both signs of potential famine. How then do you explain Dr. Atkins use of a fat fast, with 0 carbs, as a way to break a stall? That question works best in a more complete context - Depending on the suspected stall Dr A recommended either repeating Induction or the reversal diet which was very low fat and high carb but low glycemic load. Which one to consider depended on what the supected cause was. Folks love to drop that particular context. I didn't drop any context. What I stated is right out of his last book, Dr Atking New Diet Revolution, 2002. There is no mention at all of a reversal diet. From what I can gleam about the reversal diet from googling, it appears it was in at least one of his books from the 90s and had some serious drawbacks. When describing it, Atkins said it sometimes backfired. That's probably why he no longer put it in his last book. One reason for a stall is carb drift combined with total calorie drift. If you stop counting carb grams and/or you accept every claim about net carbs and if you combine that with not counting total calories it is easy to drift out of the ranges that cause loss. *For this Dr A recommended restarting Induction not the fat fast, though. *He only recommended the fat fast for folks who don't get into ketosis (technically ketonuria but he was bad at technical writing) at the 20 level. * It's folks since Dr A that have suggested the fat fast as a stall buster; he cautioned against doing that. *He think his status as a medical professional led him to be more cautious in his medical advice than amateurs on the network need to be. *The fat fast is extreme but it is not dangerous as long as his limitations are observed - One week maximum, effort to increase variety and nutrition within its limits. But read about the reversal diet in the 1993/1999 edition and it describes people who stayed on Induction too long and dropped out of ketosis even at 20. *Noting that the fat fast is really for folks who do not go in ketosis at 20 the sequence is as simple and as unpopular as taking in all of the context. Out of ketosis - Retry Induction expecting that your carb gram count is off. Still out of ketosis - Try two week pattern of one week of fat fast and one week of Induction expecting that your CCLL moved down to 15. Still out of ketosis on the fat fast - Try the reversal diet expectign that you need a leptin reset. Even before Dr A died there was discussion of the "leptin reset". *It explains why the reverse diet works in the sequence I listed. *Because Dr A never mentioned leptin resets I have concluded that he stopped tracking the science in his final years. *At least he stayed behind the times on the science of low carb. *There are advantages to staying off the cutting edge so saying he was conservative about the science in his final years is just as likely as my conclusion. *There's no why to tell the two stances apart without access to his private notes and private data. *His private tabular data was never published and may no longer exist. The simple point I raised was this. Susan claimed that at low carb and/or calorie levels, effects kick in within days that cause the body to stop losing weight. I used the example of a fat fast, which Atkins recommended for people that were metabollically resistant and couldn't lose weight, as a counter example. The point being that if low carbs/calories caused issues within days, then how could a fat fast work? I was supporting what you had posted. And I don't see any of the above being relevant. Also, if ketosis is some kind of warning sign for the body of famine, it's rather strange that it results in a big loss of appetite. *If the body were trying to save itself, one would think that it would be sending a strong signal to find food. Yet exactly the opposite happens. I suggest you read more about folks on complete fasts. *The carb craving based hunger stops in the first week or two. *That's something that nearly all of us who have tried ketotic plans have experienced for ourselves. Bingo. Exactly my point. *Then the energy level seems to have some correlation with fat intake. *There's a lot of disagreement about this point over the years but different folks do report different energy levels once they are part Induction and different folks do also report different fat gram intakes after Induction. *I don't know of any statistically valid studies of it but it's a trend that I think is worth further study to move anecdotal evidence to statistical evidence. *Then as the amount of stored fat gets low the appetite comes back. If I read these trends correctly there's a trade-off by the body between increased energy to go out to get food and decreased energy to outlast the famine, plus hunger when there's no other choice no matter the energy reserves. My more extreme and less confirmed reading of these trends says that increased fat intake is correlated with increased energy during the entire time span. I think that has to do with hunting versus gathering and seasonal cycles experienced by or stone age ancestors. Again, none of that has anything to do with my point. |
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