Coming out of the closet

"Chris Braun" wrote in message
...

That's also kind of why I never post a goal weight. I'll see where
this way of eating takes me, and where I feel right about stopping. I
think it won't be too much less than where I am now, but we shall see.
I don't want to pick some arbitrary weight and then find I have to eat
less than feels right to me in order to get there.

This is a good point that gets overlooked when people focus too much on
scale numbers. My initial goal weight was set by my doctor. I thought it
was too high because I focused on the BMI chart and wanted to go 10 pounds
lower. I didn't even care that I was a 37 year old woman who had been
morbidly obese for her entire adult life (and most of her teen years). I
wanted to see a specific number on that scale.

Once I reached that point, I wanted to lose 10 more pounds...not because it
felt right but because I got focused on the numbers. When I lost *that* 10
pounds, I wanted to lose 10 more. I'm sure that if DH and my doctor hadn't
intervened, I'd have probably lost that and wanted to lose 10 more and so
on. I ended up at a weight that was not healthy for me and my body fought
back.

Now I get to take things slowly until this adrenal thing is settled. I'm in
the weight range my physician wants me to be in for now. I'm just working
on the bf% and it seems to be going well...saw a decrease this week in bf%
even though the weight stayed the same. I woke up all puffy and full o'
water this morning and it got worse as the day went on in spite of a 5K run
and 2 hours of XC skiing. If I was focused on pounds right now I'd just be
completely insane instead of the hormonal moody roller coaster because
there's no way I could be gaining weight this quickly (as the day goes on)
with the my level of exercise and food intake - except that I know I have
this water problem now.

In a way, I don't see maintenance as much different than what I'm
doing now. For now I don't foresee stopping the food logging and
calorie counting; it's kind of become a way of life. You never know,
though. And I don't guarantee I won't just go off the wagon at some
point and gain all the weight back, but it seems unlikely to me at
this point.

I still can't imagine how someone could gain back a large amount of weight
without some serious crisis. One would have to completely and totally stop
giving a crap. It's not like it would happen quickly. A woman at work lost
90 lbs on HMR and gained all of it back in less than 6 months. I feel bad
for her.

Jenn

Hi Janice,

Great job on the 49 pounds you've lost. It appears your doing well. Try
to stop the yoyo though, it doesn't hurt to treat yourself once in awhile,
but try to reach small goals, then treat yourself. I like to have pizza
every couple of weeks as a little treat, yet not stuff myself like I use to.

I hope you continue losing the weight girl,

Paul
300/225/175

"janice" wrote in message
...
Well, I haven't posted my numbers here for a good while. The main
reason for this is that I've been yo-yoing to such an extent that it
would start to look a bit silly. It doesn't mean I haven't been
weighing myself and keeping track of my weight.

Suddenly, in mid January, I was hit by the motivation that told me I
was ready for the longer journey again. When this happens, the
motivation can be so strong it can last for months on end, so here's
hoping.

Since 14th January I have stuck to my WOE with very little effort and
this morning have been rewarded with a 9 lb loss in 2 1/2 weeks.
So now I've decided to post my numbers. I suppose I should be happy
that I've still held on to 49 of the lost pounds, but 50 would have
been a nicer number to post!

Just for the record, brief recent history (snipping the previous 38
years of yo-yo history) is that I recommitted to my WOE in March 2002
at 233 lbs, and by around October 2002 was down to 164. Then, as
always happens eventually, I lost my way, went off my WOE, and since
then I've only been able to stay on track for shorter periods, which
means during that time I've regained the last 20+ pounds and lost
them again twice over, not to mention the other smaller losses and
gains in between.

The good side is that I'm not starting from square one, and haven't
quite grown out of all my "smaller" clothes, spring is coming, and I
feel full of determination.

janice
233/184/133

Hi Gloria,

Keep strong girl! You can do it and if you fall just pick yourself up by
your boot straps. We'll be here to cheer you on. Oh and by the way if you
get hungry....EAT eat veggies...they are good for you. I hope the Dr. gives
you hope and strength like it did me.

Take care,

Paul
300/225/175


"Gloria" wrote in message
...
GOOD THREAD!!! This is a very hard day for me and I didn't do well. This
thread is a great help to me and AGAIN I'm getting myself back to this
WOL/WOE that feels better than a bad way of eating. I can't figure why
I've been off of my better way after I came here to tell everyone how
good life is for me !! But this day sucks!
I'm reading here plus reading my Dr Phil book plus my journal . I guess
I was trying too hard. It is like someone said in this thread, that we
shouldn't be in a hurry. I THINK I've been in a hurry and it
'back-fires' every time with me! I get too hungry and
than......................
Well, I'm getting back to this AGAIN!

glo

Way to go Chris,

I couldn't have said it better. You are a role model I'd follow anywhere.

Keep up the good work,

Paul

"Chris Braun" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 20:32:29 +0000, (janice) wrote:

Chris, I often think what a lot I could learn from you about patience
and perseverance.

I remember a time a few months back when I was looking over my
shoulder because you were catching up with me in terms of your
numbers. 1lb a week wasn't enough for me, so instead I did it my way
and put 20 back on while you continued to lose. How daft is that?

I know which one of us my money would be on when it comes to
maintenance

One thing, though, is I'm never going to give up trying.

janice 233/184/133

Hi Janice,

One of the things that's important to keep in mind -- and I need to
remind myself of this sometimes too -- is that it isn't about speed.
It doesn't really matter how long it takes, since it's not like you
get to ever really stop eating this way. It has taken me 19 months to
lose 97 lbs, but I only know that because I can calculate back to when
I started, not because it has been an unpleasant or difficult 19
months in any way. Rather, that was when I started my new way of
eating, and I will continue it always. So what does it matter how
fast or slowly I lose, really?

That's also kind of why I never post a goal weight. I'll see where
this way of eating takes me, and where I feel right about stopping. I
think it won't be too much less than where I am now, but we shall see.
I don't want to pick some arbitrary weight and then find I have to eat
less than feels right to me in order to get there.

In a way, I don't see maintenance as much different than what I'm
doing now. For now I don't foresee stopping the food logging and
calorie counting; it's kind of become a way of life. You never know,
though. And I don't guarantee I won't just go off the wagon at some
point and gain all the weight back, but it seems unlikely to me at
this point.

Anyway, just resolve that you're going to change for always, and take
it a day at a time. If you aren't losing at all, then, sure, you need
to cut back your calories some, but you don't need to hurry things.

Chris
262/165/???

On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 15:50:52 -0500, Dally wrote:

janice wrote:

Just for the record, brief recent history (snipping the previous 38
years of yo-yo history) is that I recommitted to my WOE in March 2002
at 233 lbs, and by around October 2002 was down to 164. Then, as
always happens eventually, I lost my way, went off my WOE

So in 7 months you lost nearly 70 pounds? That seems like it must have
taken extraordinary effort, i.e., you didn't change to a sustainable
lifestyle (and hence, didn't sustain it.)

How are you doing things differently now?

I'm really curious about what you meant by "lost my way, went off my
WOE". To me it sounds like, "got brain damage and forgot everything I
ever learned." Or maybe, "felt suicidal and decided to eat myself to
death". What did it mean to you?

Dally

Dally
I guess "I lost my way" was a kind of euphemism for "I went into binge
mode". I find this hard to describe, and perhaps you need to have
experienced serious binge eating to really know what I'm trying to
say. This is a behaviour that I've never been able to cure myself of
since it first started when I was 16. When I have long stretches
sticking to my WOE (which for me means keeping to around 1500
calories) I'm always aware that my binge problem is only in remission,
not cured.

When the motivation comes, sticking to my WOE takes almost no
conscious effort, and it's been like this for the last 2 1/2 weeks.
If you asked me now, I'd say I could quite happily eat this way for
ever. I seldom feel hungry and if anything have trouble getting up to
1500 some days. The trouble is, I've been here many times before and
binge eating when it strikes has almost nothing to do with being
hungry. Nor does it have anything to do with having a ton knowledge
and experience about how to eat healthily and how to lose weight.

I've never managed to sustain the motivation for as long as it would
take to get to goal, which is why this time I'm so pleased I didn't
regain it all before I felt able to seriously get back on the wagon.

I've lost 50, 60, 70 pounds several times during my adult life, but
always regained it all. This isn't a method I'd recommend to anyone,
and I'm going to have to find a very good strategy if I get to my
goal, in order to maintain.

Reading this, I'm not sure if anyone will understand what I'm trying
to say, but I've tried to explain anyway

janice
233/184/133

Thanks Paul. The support of others who are doing really well means a
lot to me I can cope with a treat every so often if I plan it and
don't eat it because I feel I've "caved in". When I used to go to a
slimming club I would have a chocolate bar or some other treat, or
even go out for a restaurant meal, after my evening weigh in. This
didn't stop me getting straight back on track next day, and didn't
seem to make any difference to my regular weight loss.
j
janice
233/184/133


On Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:51:04 -0600, "Paul" wrote:

Hi Janice,

Great job on the 49 pounds you've lost. It appears your doing well. Try
to stop the yoyo though, it doesn't hurt to treat yourself once in awhile,
but try to reach small goals, then treat yourself. I like to have pizza
every couple of weeks as a little treat, yet not stuff myself like I use to.

I hope you continue losing the weight girl,

Paul
300/225/175

On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 22:27:46 GMT, Chris Braun
wrote:

Hi Janice,

One of the things that's important to keep in mind -- and I need to
remind myself of this sometimes too -- is that it isn't about speed.
It doesn't really matter how long it takes, since it's not like you
get to ever really stop eating this way. It has taken me 19 months to
lose 97 lbs, but I only know that because I can calculate back to when
I started, not because it has been an unpleasant or difficult 19
months in any way. Rather, that was when I started my new way of
eating, and I will continue it always. So what does it matter how
fast or slowly I lose, really?

Of course this makes perfect sense, and I've asked myself this so
often. Part of the "hurry" is the feeling that if I'm putting in
effort then I deserve to see results, and I guess most of us feel a
bit of this if we're honest. At the start of the journey, it's also
about an impatience to become more "normal" as opposed to obese.

That's also kind of why I never post a goal weight. I'll see where
this way of eating takes me, and where I feel right about stopping. I
think it won't be too much less than where I am now, but we shall see.
I don't want to pick some arbitrary weight and then find I have to eat
less than feels right to me in order to get there.

My goal weight is only something distant to aspire to. That number
holds no special magic for me. I've always known that I may well
change it (either up or down) as it gets closer.

In a way, I don't see maintenance as much different than what I'm
doing now. For now I don't foresee stopping the food logging and
calorie counting; it's kind of become a way of life. You never know,
though. And I don't guarantee I won't just go off the wagon at some
point and gain all the weight back, but it seems unlikely to me at
this point.

I think it's probably more unlikely that you'll regain the weight,
because of the way you have approached losing it. Of course I know I
have to eat pretty much like this for ever if I have any hope of
maintaining, but perhaps a small part of me refuses to accept this
I hate food logging, although I am using an on-line food log at the
moment. I couldn't bear to think of carrying it on in maintenance,
although I would expect to weigh myself more than once a month when
this time comes to avoid things getting out of hand. I like to dwell
on my log as little as possible, but just use it to keep me in check.
It's amazing. though, how I find I keep within 1500 calories without
even trying because I've acquired so much knowledge about how to eat
to lose weight.

Thanks for your response, Chris.

janice
233/184/133

Paul, thanks much for your cheers! I'll try the veggies when I need food
but sometimes I just don't really care what I eat. I mean that I grab DH
cookies and the SF ice cream which is not a good thing as one bowl seems
never enough.
BTW , your numbers are really good!!

glo

Janice, I understand EXACTLY what you are saying about the binge eating
plus the way you will do well and than zap it is over and the eating
begins again. I guess that you and I are vey much alike and I always
have seen that since meeting you here. When YOU learn how to fix it
please tell me!!!

glo

janice wrote:

On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 15:50:52 -0500, Dally wrote:

I'm really curious about what you meant by "lost my way, went off my
WOE". To me it sounds like, "got brain damage and forgot everything I
ever learned." Or maybe, "felt suicidal and decided to eat myself to
death". What did it mean to you?

I guess "I lost my way" was a kind of euphemism for "I went into binge
mode". I find this hard to describe, and perhaps you need to have
experienced serious binge eating to really know what I'm trying to
say.

Thank you for an honest attempt at answering a fundamentally rude
question. It was an honest question, though, with shades of fear
because I don't understand what pitfall might be awaiting me making me
regain everything.

Your story of binge eating just doesn't ring any bells in me. I
certainly can be an unrestrained eater, i.e., pig out for a week on
vacation, but it's a conscious decision to "feast" with the awareness
always there that feasting is for special occasions, not everyday. When
the special occasion ends there might be a day or two or three where I
continue over-eating, but, well, I stop. All of my over-eating had to
do with lack of awareness about how I OUGHT to eat, rather than
inability to eat that way.

This is a behaviour that I've never been able to cure myself of
since it first started when I was 16. When I have long stretches
sticking to my WOE (which for me means keeping to around 1500
calories) I'm always aware that my binge problem is only in remission,
not cured.

That sounds like a scenario where meds might be useful. I've had
problems with my own OCD issues in the past and always knew I could take
meds if I wished, I just was willing to take the good with the bad
because being a bit OCD can be *useful* when you're a bean-counter!

When the motivation comes, sticking to my WOE takes almost no
conscious effort, and it's been like this for the last 2 1/2 weeks.
If you asked me now, I'd say I could quite happily eat this way for
ever. I seldom feel hungry and if anything have trouble getting up to
1500 some days. The trouble is, I've been here many times before and
binge eating when it strikes has almost nothing to do with being
hungry. Nor does it have anything to do with having a ton knowledge
and experience about how to eat healthily and how to lose weight.

I don't recall what your exercise regimen is: would getting a more
active lifestyle help to re-enforce the dietary changes? I think the
exercise is a lot more addictive than clean eating is. And I never have
a big urge to eat crap after I've been honoring my body with exercise.
The two elements really re-enforce each other for me. Just a thought.
I guess if I were you I'd spend a lot of time tackling the triggers that
make you binge and the mindset you've got that makes binging seem
reasonable.

I guess I'm left just wondering what makes a person binge. Sorry it's
so astoundingly unhelpful!

Just a question about definitions: when you say binge do you mean you
ate crappy when you meant to eat sparse and clean so you got 2400
calories instead of 1500 by pigging out on chinese food on Thursday (but
the other days of the week were reasonable?) (I call that a refeed or
just living my life.)

Or by binge do you mean you meant to have one apple slice and a rye
crisp cracker and you had the WHOLE apple THEN a bag of popcorn and got
1800 calories instead of 1500? (I call that picking too low of a
calorie target so it isn't attainable and you break out of your plan but
it's more because the plan is bad than you are bad.)

Or by binge do you mean that you meant to eat 1500 calories and every
single day you eat 1800-2400 calories even though you didn't mean to?
(I call that not having flipped the mental switch where you decide to
change your behavior, or maybe it's just a sign that you haven't figured
out (yet) how to be sated at a low calorie level.)

Or by binge do you mean you ate your 1500 calories for the day and
aren't hungry but find that you have to have a gallon of ice cream, a
whole pizza, some dry spaghetti and a can of sardines that you mashed
into your mouth as you hid behind counters on the floor in the kitchen?
(That's what I think of when someone says they binge.)

Dally