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#11
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Very discouraged; please help
"Edna Pearl" wrote in message ... Well Jesus Christ, that's real encouraging. I don't think I've ever received a message that unpleasant and discouraging in a support group from anybody -- except of course trolls. Fortunately, the message is so totally loaded with fallacies I can't take it very seriously. It focusses entirely on calorie-counting while failing to point out a single solitary thing I might change except suggesting I count calories. No, that is not true. I said you need to find out what your current caloric intake is so you can figure out what you are maintaining at, because obviously you are maintaining, which means you do not have a caloric deficit. I also said you need to get your heart rate up to burn more calories. Lifting weight doesn't do that and neither does yoga type stretching. I also suggested starting with a 30 minute walk every day. So as far as not pointing out "a single solitary thing I might change", maybe you need to reread my post. Plenty of people, in fact, MOST people lose weight without counting calories. Including people you purport to admire, like Krista, who knows considerably more about fitness and nutrition than you do. I do admire Krista. She has a tremendous amount of info on her website. However, ymmv. If Krista's information is working out for you, then by all means, keep doing what you are doing. Trying to find a "baseline" and then work around it is voodoo dieting that fails to take account of how much a person's bodily processes and metabolism changes -- it's a waste of time unless the person takes some motivation from the counting process itself, and I don't. If you don't know what your average calorie intake is, how can you know what you need to change? Furthermore, my reference to "weather permitting" simply means, for example, that I don't swim outdoors in winter (we just had an entire thread here about people who don't bicycle in cold weather, which, in fact, I DO) -- and your assumption that it means something else says a lot more about you than it does me. NO, what you said was "I kayak, bicycle, hike, and swim when weather and my energy evels permit". YOu can hike and bicycle in almost any weather, so your blanket statement sounds more like a copout than anything. Oh, and thanks for telling me I need to stop feeling sorry for myself about my mom dying. Aren't you a special person. YOu know, I was not referring to your mother dying. I am sorry for your loss, but I am referring to your "poor me" attitude about weight loss - you have a plethora of reasons (excuses) why you are fat, and why you cannot lose weight. There are many people here with super busy lifestyles, health problems, etc, that have managed to lose plenty of weight. I could go on and on, but **** that, I have a life. If nobody in this ng can come up with anything better than that, I guess I know all I need to know about this "support group." I guess Edna what you really need right now is a hug. Well, here you go HUGS. I guess you didn't come here for honest opinions and advice, but for atta boys and warm fuzzy encouragement. Sorry, I don't do that. But maybe someone else here will. Oh, and Betsy, **** you. "You might not like hearing that," but it's considerably nicer than and just as productive as what you've said to me. How's this for advice: You need learn at least learn some manners, if you can't manage to grow any compassion. Manners? I guess I could take some lessons from you, huh? ep "determined" wrote in message ... "Edna Pearl" wrote in message ... Can you help? My progress just feels too slow, and I am discouraged. Number one, I don't weigh myself, and I'm not going to. I don't count calories, and I'm not going to. I'm 49yo, and I've been through that ****, and it wasn't productive when I was younger, and it's not going to be productive now that I'm older, perimenopausal, with all sorts of orthopedic problems. I don't count things in any aspect of my life. I'm 5'4", American , I have weighed in the 130s most of my life, size 8-10. I topped out around 230, size 22, while I was ill and my mother was dying last year. I weigh around 200 right now and am a size 16-18. I went through a couple of kinds of hell last year. When my mother finally died in March and I quit drinking my way through my pain in May, the first 30 pounds dropped off immediately. (I know this because I was going to the doctor and hospital frequently and was weighed there. Again, I don't weigh myself.) I write for a living and have an sedentary, academic, artistic lifestyle, except for the fact that I ride my bike to do my errands a couple of times a week, and I have large gardens (flower and vegetable) that my SO maintains and that I help in and walk around in every day. Add to that, I try to lift a couple of times a week (heavy, complex). I kayak, bicycle, hike, and swim when weather and my energy levels permit -- so I do one of these about once a week. I start my days with stretching, including yoga postures. I sleep 10-12 hours per day. Weird, I know, but I've always needed a lot of sleep to function at my best. I believe I have a metabolism that is toward the slow end of the spectrum. I also have some physical injuries (atrophied right rhomboid, chronic plantar fasciitis (sp?) in left foot, chronic subluxation of left hip, and, at the moment, tendonitis in my left shoulder and elbow that has been there for MONTHS and just WON'T get better). I am in fairly constant pain, which interrupts my sleep. Okay, so I quit drinking in May and started my current way of eating in mid-October. I keep a checklist of food portions on my fridge and check off what I eat, as follows: 2-3 dairy 3-4 fruit 4 veggies 6 meat/protein 8 whole grains/carbs The portions are as follows: Dairy: a cup of milk or yogurt, or 1-1/2 ounces of nonfat or lowfat cheese Fruit: a medium apple, banana, or orange; 1/2 cup of chopped cooked or canned fruit; or 3/4 cup of fruit juice Vegetables: a cup of raw, leafy vegetables; 1/2 cup of other vegetables (cooked or chopped raw); or 3/4 cup of vegetable juice Meat/protein: one ounce cooked lean meat, poultry, or fish; one egg; 1/2 cup of cooked legumes; three ounces of tofu; or two tablespoons of peanut butter Grains/carbs: one-half bagel, one slice of bread, 3/4 cup of ready-to-eat cereal, 1/2 cup of cooked cereal or pasta, or 3 cups of popcorn I add flax seed oil to my diet and take calcium and a good multivitamin daily. I take extra iron when I have a big blood loss, which occasionally happens during this phase of the Joys Of Middle-Aged Womanhood. I have adhered to this WOE pretty closely since mid-October. My butt shrank a little, immediately. My waist has not budged. Not BUDGED. My next goal is to get into a pair of size 14 technical pants I have hanging in my closet, and I am NO CLOSER than I was at the end of October. Before I quit drinking, started watching my diet, and developed a better exercise routine, I was bedridden for months at a time, slept even more than I do now, drank heavily, ate whatever the hell I wanted (including fast food, restaurant portions four times a decent portion size and swimming in butter, cookie binges, whatever). It seems to me that I should be seeing more results than I am. I'm still tired and fat, and I still have low energy. Are my expectations unrealistic? Is my thinking wrong? How can I see results? ep Are your expectations unrealistic? Maybe. You want something that for most of us requires sacrifice, hard work, and diligence. You don't seem willing to do what it will take to reach the goal you want. Is your thinking wrong? That is very subjective, but imo, yes. You have a very close minded attitude towards counting calories. You seem to be unwilling to change, and ****ed off that you can't lose weight with your current WOL. Change happens when we become willing to take the necessary steps to make it happen. The question is, how bad do you want it? How can you see results? Stop feeling sorry for yourself and get with the program! You need to figure out where you stand with your current caloric intake to find out what you "maintain" on. You need to get your heart rate up and burn some extra calories to create a better deficit. Yoga stretches don't count. Doing exercise "when weather and energy permit" is a copout attitude. You need to make more of an effort if you want to see results. Walking for 30 minutes per day would be a good start. Sleeping for 10-12 hrs per day sounds to me like serious depression or some other medical problem that needs addressing. Have you had all your levels checked? Had a recent panel done? Ruled out any hormone issues? You're either going to have to accept your body the way it is now, or become willing to pay the price to reach your goals. You might not like hearing that, but that's the way it is. Losing weight doesn't occur through osmosis ;-) |
#12
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Very discouraged; please help
"Edna Pearl" wrote in message Like, somebody in this thread says "walk thirty minutes a day" and I think, "What? Am I supposed to do this *instead of* kayaking? That would be sad. Or *in addition to* climbing mountains, swimming, bicycling? That makes no sense." OH, how you like to twist words. You said that you do that "weather permitting", and that you do some exercise about "once a week". Once a week is not going to cut it as far as creating a deficit that will yield any significant weight loss, unless each time you exercise is for several hours. I have a hrm, and when I am out hiking, I burn about 5 calories per hour. That is not all that significant. During kayaking, my heart rate doesn't go up that high either, and I burn also around 5 calories per hour. Swimming is marginally better. Even during mountain biking, where I am doing a ton of hills on rough surfaces I only average 5 calories per hour. You are probably not burning as many calories as you think you are. Gardening doesn't burn many calories either. My suggestion to do 30 minutes of walking every day was intended as "in addition to" the one other day of exercise that you say that you get. I think I'm just having trouble thinking this through. But the radical change/shock to the routine does seem to be called for. And it seems to me that something more structured could be productive. An idea: I wrecked a racing bike a while back. If I bought a new one I be motivated to "play with it," i.e., ride it every day for a few weeks in addition to whatever else I do. Sure, I might not hike as much, but that's fine. How does a forty-five minute bike sprint five days a week sound? (How many days a week do you run, Sue? Distances?) If you like biking enough to do it every day, that is even better than walking for the 30 min I suggested. It was merely a suggestion. The bottom line is, you need to do something that ELEVATES YOUR HEART RATE every day. |
#13
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Very discouraged; please help
"Edna Pearl" wrote in message ... wrote in message ups.com... I know some people don't count calories and manage to lose weight, but since weight loss and gain is a mathematical equation, it is best to keep track of calories consumed and your dietary needs. I don't actually agree with that, but I'm not trying to argue, here. I'm responding to see if maybe we can communicate constructively. If neither you nor I get anything useful out of it because we're just on such different pages, then maybe somebody reading this will. Knowing calories in foods also helps you make good choices. I do, in fact, have a good idea of the calories in foods from having learned to count them earlier in life, as I said. I can pretty much look at a plate of food and count a hundred calories here, 65 there, etc., but I'm not going to bother to add them up. The PORTIONS I describe in my post do that for me. Counting portions (or checking them off a list, like I do) has the same import and result as counting calories. There is no relevant difference IF you know, as I do, that this vegetable or fruit has more calories than that vegetable or fruit, where the empty calories are and how to avoid them, etc. As far as exercise, you simply must get some to stay healthy and it helps with losing weight a little too. Walking is great exercise. So are kayaking, bicycling, swimming, hiking, climbing, weight-lifting, gardening -- all of which I do, as I said in my post. Walking is decent exercise, sure, but it's not my favorite because the repetitive, identical steps bother my bad foot if I repeat the same step/movement for any period of time. Many people weigh once a week or so, but you have to weigh yourself to check your progress. Not weighing yourself otherwise becomes denial. I don't agree with this. There are plenty of more meaningful ways to check progress than the number on a scale, unless you only count the numbers on the scale as progress, by definition, so to speak. Clothing size, the amount of weight you can lift, the distance you can swim, etc., are meaningful, functional measures of progress. A number on a scale is just an annoying social construct, to me. People who are serious dieters are fanatical at keeping track of their weight usually. I have no desire to be a serious dieter :-) I'm not trying to be snarky -- but do you see my point? I want to be healthy, I want to comfortable, I want to look good. I do not want to be a serious "dieter." In fact, once someone with a weight problem stops weighing themselves, it is almost always because deep down, they know they are gaining weight and don't want to face it. Oh, they face it eventually when they are 100 pounds overweight. That's sad. I feel pretty confident that I don't have much talent for denial of this type. Sometimes I wish I did, in healthy doses. A little denial is a good thing, believe it or not. :-) I wish there were an easy way to lose weight, but there isn't. It's calories, calories, calories. After that comes a moderate amount of exercise. Well, yeah, kind of, but this is really oversimplified. You burn more calories if your metabolism is higher. Muscle burns more calories than fat. Etc., etc. The mix of carbs, fat, protein might effect your health, but it doesn't make any difference as far as your weight goes, IMO. Well, no research I've ever read supports your opinion. There are ways of living, eating, and exercising that maximize fitness and fat-loss above (while also minimizing hunger) beyond the simple counting of calories in disregard of whether those calories are empty or nutritious or part of a balanced diet. I really don't think there's any debate about that in the scientific literature. You can take the simple attitude you describe and make a certain amount of progress with it, but that doesn't make it the last word on the subject. If you aren't interested in learning more about health and nutrition, that's fine, great, live long and prosper. By the same token, I'm not interested in counting up calorie estimates and pretending like the counts are telling me something I want to know. Again, I'm not trying to be snarky, I'm just saying what I have to say, and maybe somebody else can get something out of what I'm saying, or maybe you'd like to discuss it further, too. In any event, thanks for taking the time to respond and good luck with your fitness goals. I've somehow lost the part of your post that says that losing weight is not easy, or something to that effect. I hope you're not assuming that I think it's supposed to be; and I doubt anything in my post suggested that it should be. In my experience, change is challenging. It sure beats the alternative, though. ep If you are not losing weight then you need to eat less and/or exercise more. It is relatively easy to eat enough to not lose while getting any reasonable amount of exercise, including army basic training or week long wilderness canoe trips . At least it is for me. Like, walk for an hour. Eat a sandwich. have a glass of milk. pretty much even. Paddle a canoe 20 miles. Have a couple of drinks and a couple handfulls of peanuts. pretty much even. Sympathy from strangers isn't going to make you lose weight. And weighing at least weekly is, in my opinion, important because that is the objective you are trying to achieve. If you don't measure how you are doing how would you know if what you are doing is working? Dealing with your anger might be helpful as well. Sometimes life isn't fair and downright sucks. Medicating with food and alcohol doesn't change that, as I believe you know. It is hard to let go of it though. I could go on. But I figure you don't want to hear it. so good luck del |
#14
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Very discouraged; please help
Let me share just a bit of my experience. I, too, had "blossomed" to 230
plus pounds. On May 12, 2006, it became imperative for health reasons to lose weight. The first 30 pounds came off quickly for me, too. But I hit a stall at 195, even though I was careful about what I ate, and had no junk of any kind in my diet. I was frustrated for a while, but I realized that nothing was going to change unless I changed what I was doing. So, as much as it pained me, I did start to count calories. I did become picky about portion sizes instead of just guessing. I didn't set a limit for how many calories per day I would eat--just kept track. I found out that I was eating more than I thought I was. And the weight started coming off again--40+ more pounds so far. I think that my problem with calorie counting in the past was that it set me up to fail--because I set an artificial limit, then beat myself up if I didn't keep to that limit. Now, my relationship with calories is just informational. If I hit a plateau, I can look to see if it could possibly be my food intake. I have the information to make adjustments if I need to. One thing I am very careful about is breakfast. I eat it every day, no matter what. I have found that if I eat a decent breakfast, I am not starving and in need of munchies when I come home from work in the afternoon. Another thing I monitor closely is any after-dinner snacking. I don't eat within a couple of hours of going to bed. I try to keep my activity level high. I like to walk--fast. I go to Curves 3 times a week. In the summer, I swam 4 days a week. I have a recumbent exercise cycle that I use when I just can't get outside to exercise. Other than that, I am patient with myself. That has not always been the case. I wish you well, Edna, and hope you find your solution. I know you will if you keep looking for it. "Edna Pearl" wrote in message ... Well Jesus Christ, that's real encouraging. I don't think I've ever received a message that unpleasant and discouraging in a support group from anybody -- except of course trolls. Fortunately, the message is so totally loaded with fallacies I can't take it very seriously. It focusses entirely on calorie-counting while failing to point out a single solitary thing I might change except suggesting I count calories. Plenty of people, in fact, MOST people lose weight without counting calories. Including people you purport to admire, like Krista, who knows considerably more about fitness and nutrition than you do. Trying to find a "baseline" and then work around it is voodoo dieting that fails to take account of how much a person's bodily processes and metabolism changes -- it's a waste of time unless the person takes some motivation from the counting process itself, and I don't. Furthermore, my reference to "weather permitting" simply means, for example, that I don't swim outdoors in winter (we just had an entire thread here about people who don't bicycle in cold weather, which, in fact, I DO) -- and your assumption that it means something else says a lot more about you than it does me. Oh, and thanks for telling me I need to stop feeling sorry for myself about my mom dying. Aren't you a special person. I could go on and on, but **** that, I have a life. If nobody in this ng can come up with anything better than that, I guess I know all I need to know about this "support group." Oh, and Betsy, **** you. "You might not like hearing that," but it's considerably nicer than and just as productive as what you've said to me. How's this for advice: You need learn at least learn some manners, if you can't manage to grow any compassion. ep "determined" wrote in message ... "Edna Pearl" wrote in message ... Can you help? My progress just feels too slow, and I am discouraged. Number one, I don't weigh myself, and I'm not going to. I don't count calories, and I'm not going to. I'm 49yo, and I've been through that ****, and it wasn't productive when I was younger, and it's not going to be productive now that I'm older, perimenopausal, with all sorts of orthopedic problems. I don't count things in any aspect of my life. I'm 5'4", American , I have weighed in the 130s most of my life, size 8-10. I topped out around 230, size 22, while I was ill and my mother was dying last year. I weigh around 200 right now and am a size 16-18. I went through a couple of kinds of hell last year. When my mother finally died in March and I quit drinking my way through my pain in May, the first 30 pounds dropped off immediately. (I know this because I was going to the doctor and hospital frequently and was weighed there. Again, I don't weigh myself.) I write for a living and have an sedentary, academic, artistic lifestyle, except for the fact that I ride my bike to do my errands a couple of times a week, and I have large gardens (flower and vegetable) that my SO maintains and that I help in and walk around in every day. Add to that, I try to lift a couple of times a week (heavy, complex). I kayak, bicycle, hike, and swim when weather and my energy levels permit -- so I do one of these about once a week. I start my days with stretching, including yoga postures. I sleep 10-12 hours per day. Weird, I know, but I've always needed a lot of sleep to function at my best. I believe I have a metabolism that is toward the slow end of the spectrum. I also have some physical injuries (atrophied right rhomboid, chronic plantar fasciitis (sp?) in left foot, chronic subluxation of left hip, and, at the moment, tendonitis in my left shoulder and elbow that has been there for MONTHS and just WON'T get better). I am in fairly constant pain, which interrupts my sleep. Okay, so I quit drinking in May and started my current way of eating in mid-October. I keep a checklist of food portions on my fridge and check off what I eat, as follows: 2-3 dairy 3-4 fruit 4 veggies 6 meat/protein 8 whole grains/carbs The portions are as follows: Dairy: a cup of milk or yogurt, or 1-1/2 ounces of nonfat or lowfat cheese Fruit: a medium apple, banana, or orange; 1/2 cup of chopped cooked or canned fruit; or 3/4 cup of fruit juice Vegetables: a cup of raw, leafy vegetables; 1/2 cup of other vegetables (cooked or chopped raw); or 3/4 cup of vegetable juice Meat/protein: one ounce cooked lean meat, poultry, or fish; one egg; 1/2 cup of cooked legumes; three ounces of tofu; or two tablespoons of peanut butter Grains/carbs: one-half bagel, one slice of bread, 3/4 cup of ready-to-eat cereal, 1/2 cup of cooked cereal or pasta, or 3 cups of popcorn I add flax seed oil to my diet and take calcium and a good multivitamin daily. I take extra iron when I have a big blood loss, which occasionally happens during this phase of the Joys Of Middle-Aged Womanhood. I have adhered to this WOE pretty closely since mid-October. My butt shrank a little, immediately. My waist has not budged. Not BUDGED. My next goal is to get into a pair of size 14 technical pants I have hanging in my closet, and I am NO CLOSER than I was at the end of October. Before I quit drinking, started watching my diet, and developed a better exercise routine, I was bedridden for months at a time, slept even more than I do now, drank heavily, ate whatever the hell I wanted (including fast food, restaurant portions four times a decent portion size and swimming in butter, cookie binges, whatever). It seems to me that I should be seeing more results than I am. I'm still tired and fat, and I still have low energy. Are my expectations unrealistic? Is my thinking wrong? How can I see results? ep Are your expectations unrealistic? Maybe. You want something that for most of us requires sacrifice, hard work, and diligence. You don't seem willing to do what it will take to reach the goal you want. Is your thinking wrong? That is very subjective, but imo, yes. You have a very close minded attitude towards counting calories. You seem to be unwilling to change, and ****ed off that you can't lose weight with your current WOL. Change happens when we become willing to take the necessary steps to make it happen. The question is, how bad do you want it? How can you see results? Stop feeling sorry for yourself and get with the program! You need to figure out where you stand with your current caloric intake to find out what you "maintain" on. You need to get your heart rate up and burn some extra calories to create a better deficit. Yoga stretches don't count. Doing exercise "when weather and energy permit" is a copout attitude. You need to make more of an effort if you want to see results. Walking for 30 minutes per day would be a good start. Sleeping for 10-12 hrs per day sounds to me like serious depression or some other medical problem that needs addressing. Have you had all your levels checked? Had a recent panel done? Ruled out any hormone issues? You're either going to have to accept your body the way it is now, or become willing to pay the price to reach your goals. You might not like hearing that, but that's the way it is. Losing weight doesn't occur through osmosis ;-) |
#15
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Very discouraged; please help
"determined" wrote in message
... I said you need to find out what your current caloric intake is so you can figure out what you are maintaining at, because obviously you are maintaining, which means you do not have a caloric deficit. Knowing the calorie-intake level I am currently consuming wouldn't tell me anything useful that I don't already know. Think about it. As I've explained elsewhere in this thread, I "count" (actually, use a checklist of) portions. This has the same result and import as counting calories. No relevant difference at all. Okay, so I know how much I'm eating. So what? A person will maintain the same weight at different calorie levels depending on exercise, metabolism, hormone levels, etc. -- a literally immeasurable number of factors. If you enjoy trying to estimate all these factors in numeric terms, fine. Enjoy. I don't enjoy it. But I do have a general idea of where I am in terms of input and output, and it's probably no less accurate than your own estimates. I also said you need to get your heart rate up to burn more calories. I am (obviously) aware of the general impact of cardio on calorie-burning. I am doing regular cardio. I said so in my post. As I said, I use a bicycle on my errands. Biking is great cardio. I bike 20-40 minutes a day at least three days a week. I also do some heavy cardio, like kayaking, distance biking, hiking, etc., etc., etc., at least once a week. If you have any actual experience with the efficacy of various timings and duration of cardio work-outs, great, maybe I can learn something! Let's talk. But it's just not really helpful to tell me to do cardio when I've already said I'm doing it. Lifting weight doesn't do that and neither does yoga type stretching. I mentioned the yoga because it is relevant to my injuries. I never suggested that it burns calores. That would be silly. I am also aware of the difference between strength-training and cardio. Thank you. As you are aware, strength-training enhances calorie-use and fat-reduction. I also suggested starting with a 30 minute walk every day. Am I supposed to do this *instead of* kayaking for a couple of hours? That would be sad. Or am I supposed to do it *in addition to* hiking up mountains? And what good would this do that my bicycling on errands does not do? This didn't make any sense to me when you suggested it, so I just assumed you had not read my post. (And incidentally, lots of research indicates that it's a good idea to refrain from exercise at least day per week.) As I also mentioned in technical and (probably misspelled) terms, I am, simply put, lame in one foot. Repetitive, identical steps are not a good choice for regular cardio, for me. Again, if you have any meaningful information about how to optimize my cardio, I'd be delighted to hear it. Like, some people swear by doing it in the morning, and that really worked for me at one point in my life -- is that a total myth? Or is it worth trying? Would it be likely to do something for me that my current routine is not doing, or would it just be a meaningless change? So as far as not pointing out "a single solitary thing I might change", maybe you need to reread my post. Or again, maybe not. Maybe you should have read mine in the first place :-) I do admire Krista. She has a tremendous amount of info on her website. However, ymmv. If Krista's information is working out for you, then by all means, keep doing what you are doing. Krista's information does work for me, as far as it goes. But I'm not sure what I'm doing is working as well as it could. Hence my post including all the relevant factors I could think of, including health problems, hormonal changes, and emotional issues. If you don't know what your average calorie intake is, how can you know what you need to change? I do know my average calorie intake, as I've said. You can determine it yourself by adding up the average calories in my daily checklist of food portions, since you're the one who likes numbers. What do you think this is supposed to tell me about what I need to change? Seriously. I'm asking. I don't think it tells me a dang thing about what I need to change, but maybe you know something I don't. F'rinstance, I don't think knowing my calorie intake, in isolation, tells me anything about whether I need to eat fewer or more calories today, tomorrow, on a daily basis, or whenever or how often. Furthermore, my reference to "weather permitting" simply means, for example, that I don't swim outdoors in winter (we just had an entire thread here about people who don't bicycle in cold weather, which, in fact, I DO) -- and your assumption that it means something else says a lot more about you than it does me. NO, what you said was "I kayak, bicycle, hike, and swim when weather and my energy evels permit". You're apparently seeing a difference in meaning that escapes me. YOu can hike and bicycle in almost any weather, so your blanket statement sounds more like a copout than anything. Hmm. It sounds to me like you jumped to an unwarranted and unflattering conclusion. But that's just me. Oh, and thanks for telling me I need to stop feeling sorry for myself about my mom dying. Aren't you a special person. YOu know, I was not referring to your mother dying. I knew no such thing. I am sorry for your loss, but I am referring to your "poor me" attitude about weight loss - If asking for help and support is a "poor me" attitude, then I'm it. But I thought that's what support groups were for. you have a plethora of reasons (excuses) why you are fat, and why you cannot lose weight. WTF are you talking about?!?!?!?!?! I included every factor I thought might be relevant -- perimenopausal hormones, recent illness and emotional trauma, minor disabilities, the radical extent to which I've change my lifestyle in the past couple of months -- so that anybody could respond to any particular factor they had experience with or information about or insight into or sympathy for or whatever. If you choose to see that as a "plethora" of "excuses," that's *you*. You didn't get it from *me*. There are many people here with super busy lifestyles, health problems, etc, that have managed to lose plenty of weight. Gee whiz, do ya think so? That's why I posted, for cryin' out loud. I hoped somebody might like to share something helpful or supportive. I guess Edna what you really need right now is a hug. No thanks. Well, here you go HUGS. I guess you didn't come here for honest opinions and advice, but for atta boys and warm fuzzy encouragement. Sorry, I don't do that. But maybe someone else here will. You need learn at least learn some manners, if you can't manage to grow any compassion. Manners? I guess I could take some lessons from you, huh? You probably could, if I were offering them. ep |
#16
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Very discouraged; please help
"determined" wrote in message
. .. OH, how you like to twist words. You said that you do that "weather permitting", and that you do some exercise about "once a week". WTF? Who's twisting words? Here's what I said, and I quote: ------------ "I write for a living and have an sedentary, academic, artistic lifestyle, except for the fact that I ride my bike to do my errands a couple of times a week, and I have large gardens (flower and vegetable) that my SO maintains and that I help in and walk around in every day. Add to that, I try to lift a couple of times a week (heavy, complex). I kayak, bicycle, hike, and swim when weather and my energy levels permit -- so I do one of these about once a week. I start my days with stretching, including yoga postures." ------------- I was attempting to give an overall picture of my physical activities, while you took one phrase out of context. My activity totals a MINIMUM of two days weight-training and three days cardio, at least one day of which is heavy cardio. I actually understated the number of days I'm using my bike for errands, I now realize. And maybe you don't realize that kayaking involves lifting and carrying a fifty pound boat and paddling it one thousand strokes per mile. That's just for example. I was trying to sound self-effacing instead of sounding like some kind of braggart JOCK, for crying out loud. Once a week is not going to cut it as far as creating a deficit that will yield any significant weight loss, unless each time you exercise is for several hours. I have a hrm, and when I am out hiking, I burn about 5 calories per hour. That is not all that significant. During kayaking, my heart rate doesn't go up that high either, and I burn also around 5 calories per hour. Swimming is marginally better. Even during mountain biking, where I am doing a ton of hills on rough surfaces I only average 5 calories per hour. You are probably not burning as many calories as you think you are. Gardening doesn't burn many calories either. Well, like I said, I don't count calories. But if you're not getting your heartrate up when you paddle or bike or hike, then you're not me, apparently. For one thing, you're doubtless in much better physical condition than I am at the moment, so your resting heartrate is probably lower and your endurance is probably better, so maybe it takes quite a bit of cardio to get your heart rate up. Fine, whatever. Personally, I get my heart rate up when I do cardio, and I do as much as I'm able. I don't do it wearing gym clothes on a machine that counts my calories for me, but I do it. Incidentally, the number of calories you burn per unit of time is just another meaningless number. The biggest benefit cardio adds to the weight-loss process is that it increases the body's calorie consumption for an extended time period *after* the cardio is actually completed. If you have any tips on how to optimize my cardio besides counting it, great. My suggestion to do 30 minutes of walking every day was intended as "in addition to" the one other day of exercise that you say that you get. You think I should walk 30 minutes in addition to . . . . oh never mind. ep |
#17
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Very discouraged; please help
"Del Cecchi" wrote in message
... If you are not losing weight then you need to eat less and/or exercise more. I am getting the impression that everybody who believes that all you have to do to get fit is (1) eat less, (2) exercise more, (3) count what you eat, and (4) weigh yourself, also has a practice of (5) insulting the intentions, motivations, intelligence, and mental health of anyone who contradicts them with, like, actual facts. Sympathy from strangers isn't going to make you lose weight. Who suggested it would? Why are you telling me this? And weighing at least weekly is, in my opinion, important because that is the objective you are trying to achieve. My objective is to weigh myself? I think you mean to say that my objective is to lose weight? My objectives are actually to be fit, strong, healthy, comfortable, etc. What it says on the scale is just one way of measuring just one aspect of what is actually a very complex lifestyle issue. And I have no intention of subjecting myself to that particular measure on a weekly basis. Heck, I can gain ten pounds during a single menstrual period. And a conventional scale does not reflect how much muscle I'm building versus how much fat I'm losing. If you don't measure how you are doing how would you know if what you are doing is working? It really does surprise me that so many people here are asking this question, or making this point, or whatever. It really does surprise me. How about if I *feel* better? I look better? I can lift more weight? I can swim further? If my clothing size drops? If i jiggle less? There are lots of non-weight measures of success are in the FAQs for this group, by the way. Does anybody here every read or post the FAQs any more? Dealing with your anger might be helpful as well. Ah! Usenet psychotherapy! Always a treat. Sometimes life isn't fair and downright sucks. And Usenet philosophy, too! Medicating with food and alcohol doesn't change that, as I believe you know. It is hard to let go of it though. No harder than changing any other unhealthy behavior. Change and growth are, indeed, challenging. If you'll actually read my original post, I think you'll see that I have made quite a few difficult and healthy changes in the past few months! Wow! And to think nobody here even seems to have noticed that so far! I could go on. But I figure you don't want to hear it. so Is there some reason why I *should* want to hear more of this? I mean, really. Look at your post. good luck Thanks. So far, one person here has given me some helpful ideas in a friendly manner. (Thanks again, Sue.) There seems to be a preponderance of people who are just here to criticize people. That can make a newsgroup really unpleasant, you know. I think I'm starting to realize why so few people post in this ng. It did strike me as odd that there was so little meaningful traffic here. Does anybody reading this know of a better forum? ep |
#18
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Very discouraged; please help
"teachrmama" wrote in message
... Let me share just a bit of my experience. I, too, had "blossomed" to 230 plus pounds. On May 12, 2006, it became imperative for health reasons to lose weight. The first 30 pounds came off quickly for me, too. We seem to share some magic numbers, here :-) But I hit a stall at 195, even though I was careful about what I ate, and had no junk of any kind in my diet. I was frustrated for a while, Do you happen to recall how long this plateau lasted? but I realized that nothing was going to change unless I changed what I was doing. So, as much as it pained me, I did start to count calories. I did become picky about portion sizes instead of just guessing. I didn't set a limit for how many calories per day I would eat--just kept track. I found out that I was eating more than I thought I was. And the weight started coming off again--40+ more pounds so far. Congratulations! I don't guess my portion sizes. Some things are easy because I eat them regularly and can just judge the portion in relation to the size of my hand or my plate or whatever, but, when in doubt, I measure with a scale or a measuring cup, as appropriate. I appear to have confused a lot of people here by saying I don't count calories. As you can see from my post, I do "count" portions (I actually check them off on a list on the fridge), and given a basic awareness of how many calories are in what and even resort to a calorie book if I've eaten a novel food, it would be easy to add up the calories at the end of the day. It's just that doesn't tell me anything I don't already know. So I'm not in a position to compare calorie counts with you. If somebody wanted to compare calorie counts with me, it would be a very simple matter to get an average from the portion list I already posted. Sure, I'll get more calories from a given portion of vegetables if I eat a carrot rather than a stick of celery, but I know that, and it's simple to make a mental adjustment to eat my next meal accordingly. This is exactly what Weight Watchers used to do (prolly still does, I dunno), and a lot of other diet programs, too, that rely on "points," "exchanges," "portions," whatever. Does *everybody* on this ng count calories only? Surely there is somebody else here who "counts" portions? FWIW, I've done the math enough times in my life to know that I'm eating between 1100 and 1600 calories a day when I eat on this routine of portions, and I deliberately vary that amount within that range. (Do we need to get into *why* I vary the amount? Surely somebody else here can explain that better than I can. :-) I think that my problem with calorie counting in the past was that it set me up to fail--because I set an artificial limit, then beat myself up if I didn't keep to that limit. Now, my relationship with calories is just informational. If I hit a plateau, I can look to see if it could possibly be my food intake. I have the information to make adjustments if I need to. That's really good insight: "informational." That's how I look at my checklist of portions, as information. I have a tendency to put the first priority on making sure I get enough fruits and veggies. I also tend to try to get extra protein from vegetable, fruits, and grains, before I even think about the meat category. Then the dairy and the meat categories tend to fall into place by themselves. One thing I am very careful about is breakfast. I eat it every day, no matter what. I have found that if I eat a decent breakfast, I am not starving and in need of munchies when I come home from work in the afternoon. It really does seem to help me stay less hungry during the day if I eat a lot of protein in my breakfast. By the same token, it does *not* work for me to try to "save up" calories so I can splurge on dinner. Another thing I monitor closely is any after-dinner snacking. I don't eat within a couple of hours of going to bed. Okay, dirty little secret here :-) I do, in fact, have a couple of cups of Lipton Cream of Chicken Cup-A-Soup before I go to bed, for a total of two carb portions, 120 calories. It seems to settle my stomach and help me sleep better -- probably just because it's a relaxing bedtime ritual. I find it hard to imagine that I am sabotaging myself by saving a couple of carb portions for these empty calories before bed. Can it be? I try to keep my activity level high. I like to walk--fast. I go to Curves 3 times a week. In the summer, I swam 4 days a week. I have a recumbent exercise cycle that I use when I just can't get outside to exercise. I am wondering whether I am physically able to do this much. I doubt it. I have to rest my shoulder for days between swims, for example. I've been trying to build up my endurance since I was sick, but it's slow going. Please note that I have really only been trying to stay on a regimen for about six weeks now. I *have* made good strength gains with lifting. I'm pretty knowledgeable about lifting, having done it since I was a ballet student decades ago. (I used to be the only chick in the gym, back in the day. :-) So I have no complaints so far with how I'm maximizing my results with muscle-building and strength training. I could do better if I didn't have to work around my (minor) injuries, but couldn't we all do "better"? :-) I'm not complaining. Other than that, I am patient with myself. That has not always been the case. Amen. I hear you. I wish you well, Edna, and hope you find your solution. I know you will if you keep looking for it. Thanks, Teach. :-) And congratulations again on your weight loss. I'll bet you're feeling pretty good at this point, or you wouldn't have such a beautiful work-out schedule. Success is its own reward, right? ep |
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Very discouraged; please help
"Edna Pearl" wrote in message FWIW, I've done the math enough times in my life to know that I'm eating between 1100 and 1600 calories a day when I eat on this routine of portions, and I deliberately vary that amount within that range. (Do we need to get into *why* I vary the amount? Surely somebody else here can explain that better than I can. :-) I am 5'3", 127lbs, and I maintain my weight at 1600 calories per day, with NO exercise. Yes, you are older, apparently have a slower metabolism, and are perimenopausal, but also, you are carrying around alot more weight than I am, so should be able to lose at 1600 calories per day with no problem. I just find it very hard to believe that you are eating as low as you think you are. |
#20
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Very discouraged; please help
"Edna Pearl" wrote in message .. . "determined" wrote in message . .. OH, how you like to twist words. You said that you do that "weather permitting", and that you do some exercise about "once a week". WTF? Who's twisting words? Here's what I said, and I quote: ------------ "I write for a living and have an sedentary, academic, artistic lifestyle, except for the fact that I ride my bike to do my errands a couple of times a week, and I have large gardens (flower and vegetable) that my SO maintains and that I help in and walk around in every day. Add to that, I try to lift a couple of times a week (heavy, complex). I kayak, bicycle, hike, and swim when weather and my energy levels permit -- so I do one of these about once a week. I start my days with stretching, including yoga postures." ------------- I was attempting to give an overall picture of my physical activities, while you took one phrase out of context. My activity totals a MINIMUM of two days weight-training and three days cardio, at least one day of which is heavy cardio. I actually understated the number of days I'm using my bike for errands, I now realize. And maybe you don't realize that kayaking involves lifting and carrying a fifty pound boat and paddling it one thousand strokes per mile. That's just for example. You have a heavy kayak. Mine only weighs around 35lbs, and I don't carry it all that far - I generally drop my kayak off at the ramp with my pick up. And yes, I know how many strokes I paddle, but it is more of a resistance exercise than a cardio exercise, for me anyways - my heart rate doesn't come anywhere close to what it does during cardio. Perhaps you could invest in a heart rate monitor. It will give you a better idea what your heart rate is during these exercises, and a better estimate of how many calories you are burning. I was trying to sound self-effacing instead of sounding like some kind of braggart JOCK, for crying out loud. I didn't think you were sounding like a jock or a braggart. Not sure where that comment came from... Once a week is not going to cut it as far as creating a deficit that will yield any significant weight loss, unless each time you exercise is for several hours. I have a hrm, and when I am out hiking, I burn about 5 calories per hour. That is not all that significant. During kayaking, my heart rate doesn't go up that high either, and I burn also around 5 calories per hour. Swimming is marginally better. Even during mountain biking, where I am doing a ton of hills on rough surfaces I only average 5 calories per hour. You are probably not burning as many calories as you think you are. Gardening doesn't burn many calories either. Well, like I said, I don't count calories. But if you're not getting your heartrate up when you paddle or bike or hike, I'm not saying I don't get my heart rate up during biking - it ranges from 120 on flat ground to 165 on hills, but even with that, I'm only burning an average of 5 calories per minute. You have to maintain that high heart rate to burn much more than that. Seriously, my heart rate doesn't go up much when I'm hiking unless I'm carrying a pack or the trail is steep. Paddling doesn't have a cardio effect for me at all. then you're not me, apparently. For one thing, you're doubtless in much better physical condition than I am at the moment, so your resting heartrate is probably lower and your endurance is probably better, so maybe it takes quite a bit of cardio to get your heart rate up. Fine, whatever. Personally, I get my heart rate up when I do cardio, and I do as much as I'm able. I don't do it wearing gym clothes on a machine that counts my calories for me, but I do it. Incidentally, the number of calories you burn per unit of time is just another meaningless number. The biggest benefit cardio adds to the weight-loss process is that it increases the body's calorie consumption for an extended time period *after* the cardio is actually completed. Studies have shown that cardio does NOT up the calories burned post-exercise. Weight lifting will do that, but cardio's affect on metabolism post-workout is very minimal at best. Google it. I'm not making it up. If you have any tips on how to optimize my cardio besides counting it, great. Just do something every day. Your initial post did not clearly state that you were doing cardio on a regular basis. My suggestion to do 30 minutes of walking every day was intended as "in addition to" the one other day of exercise that you say that you get. You think I should walk 30 minutes in addition to . . . . oh never mind. Ok. |
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