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#101
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On 2004-09-19, Ignoramus7876 wrote:
In article , Donovan Rebbechi wrote: On 2004-09-18, Ignoramus7876 wrote: For instance, if you want to make a statement like "running makes everyone slim", But that wasn't my statement. My statement was that runners maintain a low weight without dieting because they are active. That is not the same thing as the proposition you have above. But you tried to prove your point by mentioning members of your running club, which is subject to selection bias. Since the population I'm making claims about are competitive runners, I believe my running club to be representative. Even then, it's not much of an argument, because fat people who take up running generally drop weight pretty quickly. I always ran, and yet became fat. Running may work for most people, but, it did not work for me, although, possibly, I did not run enough, Running 6 miles a week will do almost nothing. The impression I have from reading books on exercise physiology, and talking to people who know this stuff fairly well, is that a regular exercise program does indeed bring about weight loss. Is that a sustained weight loss, or a drop of a relatively small amount of weight? Long term adherence to any weight loss program is fairly poor. I would be very interested in your references, and maybe would look up stuff myself. Any exercise physiology textbook should suffice. Why not take carb gels before and during exercise ? But why take them? Because they are known to be beneficial to performance ? Because you're less likely to have trouble with recovery if you take them ? Why put fuel in your car before you drive ? Doing so isn't going to make you food obsessed, and will not subvert what you *claim* are the goals of the diet. Is the purpose of the diet truly hunger control, or has this diet of yours become an end in itself? It is hunger control, definitely, plus I like what it did to my blood sugar. Sam has already pointed out that you don't get insulin spikes when you take in carbs during exercise. As for hunger control, I don't see how taking carbs during a race is going to make you more hungry. You can live on a low carb diet, but still take carbs during the race. Unless you're some kind of religious nutjob, that is. You see, differeent people have different goals when they run races. Some want to see what they are capable of when they build their life around achieving highest performance. Some want to simply run the distance so that they can brag about it to their friends. Nothing wrong with that. Some want to set records and win prizes (that would be Kenyans). Some want to see what they can do, given their particular lifestyle, to evaluate effect of a lifestyle rather that achieve the fastest personal result possible. No, it would be a lifestyle if you sustained yourself on that diet at all times that you weren't racing. Where it becomes a religion is the point where you stubbornly insist on abstaining from carbs the way a monk abstains from sex -- almost as though you're afraid that you'd be violating some sacred principle were you to take carbs. That would be me. Is that wrong? Do you think that we should all have the same goal? Not at all. If you want to make low carb dieting into a religion, go right ahead. You certainly wouldn't be the first to do so. Cheers, -- Donovan Rebbechi http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ |
#102
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On 2004-09-19, Ignoramus7876 wrote:
Donovan, you mentioned earlier your opinion that exercise alone creates great long term weight loss. That's not an accurate summary of my opinion. So, women did not lose weight due to exercise, and men lost measly 11 lbs, on their exercise programs. If they're not substantially overweight in the first place, 11lb weight loss is quite good. The sex differences in the results are interesting, could mean that the female subjects simply didn't burn enough calories. An exercise program that doesn't burn calories is as useless as a diet that doesn't cut them. That was quite good for them, and they did not continue gaining weight like the controls did, In other words, there was a main effect. but it was not the sort of dramatic weight loss that people achieve when they control both diet and exercise. This study doesn't compare diet + exercise to exercise only, so it doesn't address that question. However, diet + exercise does produce better results. Cheers, -- Donovan Rebbechi http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ |
#103
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"Phil M." wrote in message ...
Ignoramus26859 wrote: So, I asked a question on alt.support.diet.low-carb and rec.running on whether running a *half marathon* on LC was possible. Haven't these sort of experiments already been done? Phil M. I've run distances over 20K while on a low-carb diet which is roughly half a marathon. It's possible but I don't recommend being on low-carb if you are going for good performance. I certainly cannot run distances like I could. As a matter of fact, if I run even 10K I get that annoying overtraining effect where I cannot sleep sometimes for two days. I sometimes feel nauseated after my run and I get a little winded even at a rather slow running speed. And I've been running for 15 years. So now I run a lot less and do far more weight training which I'm able to do as well as ever. No biggie. In absolutely every other way, however, I feel much better on low-carb. My nagging health problems have all vanished. I love to be able to munch away on bacon and pork rinds and still lose weight. |
#104
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"Phil M." wrote in message ...
Ignoramus26859 wrote: So, I asked a question on alt.support.diet.low-carb and rec.running on whether running a *half marathon* on LC was possible. Haven't these sort of experiments already been done? Phil M. I've run distances over 20K while on a low-carb diet which is roughly half a marathon. It's possible but I don't recommend being on low-carb if you are going for good performance. I certainly cannot run distances like I could. As a matter of fact, if I run even 10K I get that annoying overtraining effect where I cannot sleep sometimes for two days. I sometimes feel nauseated after my run and I get a little winded even at a rather slow running speed. And I've been running for 15 years. So now I run a lot less and do far more weight training which I'm able to do as well as ever. No biggie. In absolutely every other way, however, I feel much better on low-carb. My nagging health problems have all vanished. I love to be able to munch away on bacon and pork rinds and still lose weight. |
#105
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Sorry, but I do not look at marathon runners with any kind of reverence. In
fact, it's quite the opposite. I feel that this type of activity is quite unhealthy as it's clear that long distance, steady-state aerobics of any kind burns muscle. Ever see a sprinter? Built like a bull with outstanding mucsle development. Compare that person to a LD runner who conversely, looks like a starved bird. Ask a bodybuilder what kind of aerobics he does and he'll probably answer: 15 minutes of "HIIT" training, which stands for High Intensity Interval Training. An example of HIIT would be, running at top speed for 30 seconds then running low speed for 30 seconds, repeating the cycle for the duration workout. What this does is force the body to *not* get used to a training regimen and to see a constant dynamic which has been found to accelerate muscle development and burn fat while enhancing the cardiovascular system. Why just 15 minutes? Anything more will burn muscle and just isn't necessary. If you want to learn more, just do a Google search on HIIT. Comments welcome. In article , lid says... In article , Doug Freese wrote: My real annoyance comes from ignoramus(his name, not mine) trying to do endurance running on a LC diet. It's like trying to add water to your gas tank of your car to get more miles per tank of gas. Any eating regimin that the exercising body rejects for insufficient fuel tells me it is not healthy. Doug, what I am trying to demonstrate is that my body does not reject LC as "insufficient fuel". To do it in a measurable way, I am considering running a half marathon, all the while without deviating from my "paleo diet". In fact, you guys got me so worked up that I will very likely go to the half marathon next week. Maybe one day I will run a full marathon, like one poster to alt.support.diet.low-carb did: http://tinyurl.com/4f7fb i |
#106
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Sorry, but I do not look at marathon runners with any kind of reverence. In
fact, it's quite the opposite. I feel that this type of activity is quite unhealthy as it's clear that long distance, steady-state aerobics of any kind burns muscle. Ever see a sprinter? Built like a bull with outstanding mucsle development. Compare that person to a LD runner who conversely, looks like a starved bird. Ask a bodybuilder what kind of aerobics he does and he'll probably answer: 15 minutes of "HIIT" training, which stands for High Intensity Interval Training. An example of HIIT would be, running at top speed for 30 seconds then running low speed for 30 seconds, repeating the cycle for the duration workout. What this does is force the body to *not* get used to a training regimen and to see a constant dynamic which has been found to accelerate muscle development and burn fat while enhancing the cardiovascular system. Why just 15 minutes? Anything more will burn muscle and just isn't necessary. If you want to learn more, just do a Google search on HIIT. Comments welcome. In article , lid says... In article , Doug Freese wrote: My real annoyance comes from ignoramus(his name, not mine) trying to do endurance running on a LC diet. It's like trying to add water to your gas tank of your car to get more miles per tank of gas. Any eating regimin that the exercising body rejects for insufficient fuel tells me it is not healthy. Doug, what I am trying to demonstrate is that my body does not reject LC as "insufficient fuel". To do it in a measurable way, I am considering running a half marathon, all the while without deviating from my "paleo diet". In fact, you guys got me so worked up that I will very likely go to the half marathon next week. Maybe one day I will run a full marathon, like one poster to alt.support.diet.low-carb did: http://tinyurl.com/4f7fb i |
#107
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#108
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#110
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In article ,
says... On 19 Sep 2004 11:43:04 GMT, (Armand) wrote: Sorry, but I do not look at marathon runners with any kind of reverence. In fact, it's quite the opposite. I feel that this type of activity is quite unhe althy as it's clear that long distance, steady-state aerobics of any kind burns muscle. Yep, marathon running does tend to be catabolic. Ever see a sprinter? Built like a bull with outstanding mucsle development. Compare that person to a LD runner who conversely, looks like a starved bird. Ask a bodybuilder what kind of aerobics he does and he'll probably answer: 15 minutes of "HIIT" training, which stands for High Intensity Interval Training. An example of HIIT would be, running at top speed for 30 seconds then running low speed for 30 seconds, repeating the cycle for the duration workout. What this does is force the body to *not* get used to a training regimen and to see a constant dynamic which has been found to accelerate muscle development and burn fat while enhancing the cardiovascular system. Why just 15 minutes? Anything more will burn muscle and just isn't necessary. Again, we're in agreement, and I understand where you are coming from. I'm more of the HIIT/weight training type myself. And I also generally do lowish carb/moderate to moderate-high protein diet. But your comments and advice have little to do with the original post -- which has to do with soliciting advice and comments about doing *endurance* training on a low carb eating regimen. (snip) Granted, but I just wanted to share my experiences about both endurance type training and HIIT and how surprised I was at the difference relative to the outcome (read gains). |
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