Just low-carb is obviously not working, so back tolow-cal/low-carb?

What I've been doing lately is obviously not working. Weight is beginning to
creep up again even as I keep carbs low enough for ketostix to turn purple!

My caloric intake is just too high to lose weight. When I limit only carbs
what happens is I start adding back more and more calories or I get hungrier
and hungrier.

On 4/11 I was down to 111.5 kg. Since then I have hovered about there, once
actually getting down to 110, just to see my weight creep up again to 111.5
kg this morning.

I don't care whether this is officially termed a "stall" by some people or
not - in my book it is definitely a stall. I am the same weight I was at 26
days ago. This is just not working.

From my low-cal-only diet experience from 1998 to 2000 I know that at my
weight there should be no stalls on a week-to-week basis. I lost weight like
clockwork on that diet, until I was well under 200 lb.

The problem was just that after 700 days I ended up losing will power.

I do see that a large part of that problem was carb-creep. At the beginning
of the diet, even without thinking of low-carb per se, I would order bento
without rice, etc., just thinking they were "wasted calories".

But near the end of my low-cal diet I would sometimes eat nothing but bagels
all day! I was obviously getting into a carb-hunger craving spiral, even
though I didn't recognize it as such.

This March also, when I tried low-cal/low-carb I limited my calories
absolutely but just "kept judicious watch" of my carbs. The first few weeks
were ok, but then carb-creep crept in and I started gobbling bananas and got
hunger spikes again.

This time I will try to watch that problem and back off when the carbs start
causing hunger spirals, and back down to a lower level of carbs.

One depressing fact is that I am six years older than I was when I did my
low-cal diet starting in 1998. Since I am older, my metabolism has naturally
slowed down. I think to lose weight at a decent pace (about 2 lb per week) I
need to really have no more than 1500 calories per day, instead of the 1800
calories per day I used to diet at. I'll try to do that, with "exercise
bonuses" when and if I work out.

The metabolic advantage I first calculated with Atkins largely disappeared
after I chopped the first week off when recalculating and has since
completely vanished. So it does look like it is just calories, as far as
weight loss is concerned. At least from my own experience now I can say that
I just don't believe in any metabolic advantage. I am hoping that being
mindful of the carbs helps me stay on a low-calorie diet this time.

I'm not really optimistic about having the will-power to do this, but that
is what this support group is for, I hope! Wish me luck!

doug

Day 443
Started at 288 lb, dipped as low as 242 lb, now at 245 lb and trying to get
control of this somehow, some way...

Start lifting weights and doing cardio.

Keep carbs low enough to control appetite.

Eat less.


Doug Lerner wrote:
:: What I've been doing lately is obviously not working. Weight is
:: beginning to creep up again even as I keep carbs low enough for
:: ketostix to turn purple!
::
:: My caloric intake is just too high to lose weight. When I limit only
:: carbs what happens is I start adding back more and more calories or
:: I get hungrier and hungrier.
::
:: On 4/11 I was down to 111.5 kg. Since then I have hovered about
:: there, once actually getting down to 110, just to see my weight
:: creep up again to 111.5 kg this morning.
::
:: I don't care whether this is officially termed a "stall" by some
:: people or not - in my book it is definitely a stall. I am the same
:: weight I was at 26 days ago. This is just not working.
::
:: From my low-cal-only diet experience from 1998 to 2000 I know that
:: at my weight there should be no stalls on a week-to-week basis. I
:: lost weight like clockwork on that diet, until I was well under 200
:: lb.
::
:: The problem was just that after 700 days I ended up losing will
:: power.
::
:: I do see that a large part of that problem was carb-creep. At the
:: beginning of the diet, even without thinking of low-carb per se, I
:: would order bento without rice, etc., just thinking they were
:: "wasted calories".
::
:: But near the end of my low-cal diet I would sometimes eat nothing
:: but bagels all day! I was obviously getting into a carb-hunger
:: craving spiral, even though I didn't recognize it as such.
::
:: This March also, when I tried low-cal/low-carb I limited my calories
:: absolutely but just "kept judicious watch" of my carbs. The first
:: few weeks were ok, but then carb-creep crept in and I started
:: gobbling bananas and got hunger spikes again.
::
:: This time I will try to watch that problem and back off when the
:: carbs start causing hunger spirals, and back down to a lower level
:: of carbs.
::
:: One depressing fact is that I am six years older than I was when I
:: did my low-cal diet starting in 1998. Since I am older, my
:: metabolism has naturally slowed down. I think to lose weight at a
:: decent pace (about 2 lb per week) I need to really have no more than
:: 1500 calories per day, instead of the 1800 calories per day I used
:: to diet at. I'll try to do that, with "exercise bonuses" when and if
:: I work out.
::
:: The metabolic advantage I first calculated with Atkins largely
:: disappeared after I chopped the first week off when recalculating
:: and has since completely vanished. So it does look like it is just
:: calories, as far as weight loss is concerned. At least from my own
:: experience now I can say that I just don't believe in any metabolic
:: advantage. I am hoping that being mindful of the carbs helps me stay
:: on a low-calorie diet this time.
::
:: I'm not really optimistic about having the will-power to do this,
:: but that is what this support group is for, I hope! Wish me luck!
::
:: doug
::
:: Day 443
:: Started at 288 lb, dipped as low as 242 lb, now at 245 lb and trying
:: to get control of this somehow, some way...

Yes, of course you should give up. What were you thinking anyway? Diets are
not for you. Fat is what you are, and what you'll stay.

--
Slink on back to assorted.stupid.whiners, enema breath. -- MFW


"Doug Lerner" wrote in message
...
What I've been doing lately is obviously not working. Weight is beginning
to
creep up again even as I keep carbs low enough for ketostix to turn
purple!

My caloric intake is just too high to lose weight. When I limit only carbs
what happens is I start adding back more and more calories or I get
hungrier
and hungrier.

On 4/11 I was down to 111.5 kg. Since then I have hovered about there,
once
actually getting down to 110, just to see my weight creep up again to
111.5
kg this morning.

I don't care whether this is officially termed a "stall" by some people or
not - in my book it is definitely a stall. I am the same weight I was at
26
days ago. This is just not working.

From my low-cal-only diet experience from 1998 to 2000 I know that at my
weight there should be no stalls on a week-to-week basis. I lost weight
like
clockwork on that diet, until I was well under 200 lb.

The problem was just that after 700 days I ended up losing will power.

I do see that a large part of that problem was carb-creep. At the
beginning
of the diet, even without thinking of low-carb per se, I would order bento
without rice, etc., just thinking they were "wasted calories".

But near the end of my low-cal diet I would sometimes eat nothing but
bagels
all day! I was obviously getting into a carb-hunger craving spiral, even
though I didn't recognize it as such.

This March also, when I tried low-cal/low-carb I limited my calories
absolutely but just "kept judicious watch" of my carbs. The first few
weeks
were ok, but then carb-creep crept in and I started gobbling bananas and
got
hunger spikes again.

This time I will try to watch that problem and back off when the carbs
start
causing hunger spirals, and back down to a lower level of carbs.

One depressing fact is that I am six years older than I was when I did my
low-cal diet starting in 1998. Since I am older, my metabolism has
naturally
slowed down. I think to lose weight at a decent pace (about 2 lb per week)
I
need to really have no more than 1500 calories per day, instead of the
1800
calories per day I used to diet at. I'll try to do that, with "exercise
bonuses" when and if I work out.

The metabolic advantage I first calculated with Atkins largely disappeared
after I chopped the first week off when recalculating and has since
completely vanished. So it does look like it is just calories, as far as
weight loss is concerned. At least from my own experience now I can say
that
I just don't believe in any metabolic advantage. I am hoping that being
mindful of the carbs helps me stay on a low-calorie diet this time.

I'm not really optimistic about having the will-power to do this, but that
is what this support group is for, I hope! Wish me luck!

doug

Day 443
Started at 288 lb, dipped as low as 242 lb, now at 245 lb and trying to
get
control of this somehow, some way...

On 5/7/04 10:37 AM, in article
, "JC Der Koenig"
wrote:

Yes, of course you should give up. What were you thinking anyway? Diets are
not for you. Fat is what you are, and what you'll stay.

I'm sure it is a waste of time responding to a JC Der Koenig message, but
your comment was so out of context, and seemed to have absolutely nothing at
all to do with what I posted (for example, I never even hinted at giving up
dieting) that I must wonder - are you off your medication today?

doug

All you've done for the last several months is whine and make excuses. Give
up already. You're fat. Get over it.

--
You take stupid to a new level. -- MFW


"Doug Lerner" wrote in message
...
On 5/7/04 10:37 AM, in article
, "JC Der Koenig"
wrote:

Yes, of course you should give up. What were you thinking anyway? Diets
are
not for you. Fat is what you are, and what you'll stay.

I'm sure it is a waste of time responding to a JC Der Koenig message, but
your comment was so out of context, and seemed to have absolutely nothing
at
all to do with what I posted (for example, I never even hinted at giving
up
dieting) that I must wonder - are you off your medication today?

doug

On 5/7/04 9:04 AM, in article , "Roger
Zoul" wrote:

Start lifting weights and doing cardio.

I'm doing exercises now that are the equivalent of lifting weights. I'm
going to start doing more cardio exercises too.


Keep carbs low enough to control appetite.

Yes, that's what I wrote.


Eat less.

Eat less calories you mean. Volume probably plays a lesser role.

But the bottom line is that what I have found is that for weight loss, it's
the calories that count, not the carbs. And there is no metabolic advantage.
It's basically calories in vs energy out.

The carbs only play a secondary role in helping control hunger. That's not a
minor role. It's definitely a help. But I can't help but think at this point
that the Atkins slant on all this is mistaken.

Weight loss is just difficult. There is no way around it.

doug

Doug Lerner wrote:
:: On 5/7/04 9:04 AM, in article ,
:: "Roger Zoul" wrote:
::
::: Start lifting weights and doing cardio.
::
:: I'm doing exercises now that are the equivalent of lifting weights.

What would those be?

:: I'm going to start doing more cardio exercises too.

Good, what in particular?

On Fri, 07 May 2004 11:00:44 +0900, Doug Lerner wrote:

The carbs only play a secondary role in helping control hunger. That's not a
minor role. It's definitely a help. But I can't help but think at this point
that the Atkins slant on all this is mistaken.

Have you considered moving over to alt.support.diet, if you don't believe
that low-carb is right for you? You can get all kinds of other theories,
and one of them may just work for you.

Carol

--
"Years ago my mother used to say to me... She'd say
'In this world Elwood, you must be oh-so smart or
oh-so pleasant.' Well, for years I was smart.... I
recommend pleasant. You may quote me."

*James Stewart* in the 1950 movie, _Harvey_

On 5/7/04 12:22 PM, in article ,
"Damsel in dis Dress" wrote:

On Fri, 07 May 2004 11:00:44 +0900, Doug Lerner wrote:

The carbs only play a secondary role in helping control hunger. That's not a
minor role. It's definitely a help. But I can't help but think at this point
that the Atkins slant on all this is mistaken.

Have you considered moving over to alt.support.diet, if you don't believe
that low-carb is right for you? You can get all kinds of other theories,
and one of them may just work for you.

Carol

Am I not welcome here, Carol, if I just use low-carb to control hunger,
blood sugar and other things, but don't believe the Atkins theory is
completely correct?

I wonder how many people in this newsgroup believe you can go from extremely
obese to completely normal weight *just* by curbing carbs.

doug

On Fri, 07 May 2004 12:53:34 +0900, Doug Lerner wrote:

On 5/7/04 12:22 PM, in article ,
"Damsel in dis Dress" wrote:

On Fri, 07 May 2004 11:00:44 +0900, Doug Lerner wrote:

The carbs only play a secondary role in helping control hunger. That's not a
minor role. It's definitely a help. But I can't help but think at this point
that the Atkins slant on all this is mistaken.

Have you considered moving over to alt.support.diet, if you don't believe
that low-carb is right for you? You can get all kinds of other theories,
and one of them may just work for you.

Carol

Am I not welcome here, Carol, if I just use low-carb to control hunger,
blood sugar and other things, but don't believe the Atkins theory is
completely correct?

Who said you weren't welcome here? You just got done posting that you're
having unsatisfactory results from low-carb, even though you've been on it
for a long time. Not all plans work for all people. Maybe low-carb isn't
your thing. I was making a suggestion that might help you find something
that would make you more successful.

I wonder how many people in this newsgroup believe you can go from extremely
obese to completely normal weight *just* by curbing carbs.

Hard to say. Let's take a poll.

Carol

--
"Years ago my mother used to say to me... She'd say
'In this world Elwood, you must be oh-so smart or
oh-so pleasant.' Well, for years I was smart.... I
recommend pleasant. You may quote me."

*James Stewart* in the 1950 movie, _Harvey_