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#11
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Bill DeWitt wrote: bmcky mentioned in passing : Could Einstein or Picasso fly an F-102 ? Or best Kerry on an IQ test? I assume you are referring to Steve Sailer's pretty sad attempt to compare apples to oranges on VDARE.com. There was no IQ test. There were several IQ-ish tests, but at no point did either of them take anything reporting to be a comparable test that has been released to the public. And SAT scores are not even that highly correlated with IQ, due to the large amount of test strategy involved as well as the vocabulary/idiomatic usage questions (how much of the dictionary you HAVE memorized (SAT) is only a clue to how much of it you CAN memorize (IQ)). We KNOW that Einstein was a one-in-a-million intelligence. Even Sailer's analysis puts Bush and Kerry in the five-to-ten-in-a-hundred category. So, Einstein could definitely have beaten either of them on an IQ test. Intelligence wasn't Picasso's trade so it's hard to put an IQ number on him. I suspect that none of the above could touch Picasso in his chosen realm. In my Seminar on International Political Economy, we looked at a study that tried to ennumerate the conceptual complexity of top central bankers (Alan Greenspan, and his opposite numbers around the world) and contrast that with their bank's independance as measured another way. Being in the fall of last year, we naturally looked at the candidates, and Bush came up very far behind in Conceptual Complexity. Using a Bill DeWitt debate tactic, I will not cite any work on Conceptual Complexity, but will affirm that it's a better measure than IQ for a politician's skill. And not allow any argument of that point. -Hollywood, who beats both candidates if they are 5-to-10-in-a-hundred |
#12
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"Bill DeWitt" wrote in message ... bmcky mentioned in passing : Could Einstein or Picasso fly an F-102 ? Or best Kerry on an IQ test? Most IQ tests really only test how good the subject in question is at taking that particular IQ test. |
#13
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On 16 Sep 2005 07:21:38 -0700, Max Hollywood Harris wrote:
In my Seminar on International Political Economy, we looked at a study that tried to ennumerate the conceptual complexity of top central bankers (Alan Greenspan, and his opposite numbers around the world) and contrast that with their bank's independance as measured another way. Being in the fall of last year, we naturally looked at the candidates, and Bush came up very far behind in Conceptual Complexity. Using a Bill DeWitt debate tactic, I will not cite any work on Conceptual Complexity, but will affirm that it's a better measure than IQ for a politician's skill. And not allow any argument of that point. -Hollywood, who beats both candidates if they are 5-to-10-in-a-hundred I have got to give you this Hollywood. How can anyone argue with you when you made up the scale. :-) Pan Ohco |
#14
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On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 01:38:39 -0400, Marengo wrote:
My guess is that with equal training on both sides, both Einstein and Picasso could fly an F-102 better than George Bush could paint a picture or expound on the mathematical proof of the theory of relativity. I think I have to disagree with you on this. Einstein was all mental talent, no coordination or physical talent. And as to Picasso, I believe George Bush and anyone else could paint a better picture. But that just my dislike of Picasso. But I must admit that Picasso did have better PR the George Bush. Pan Ohco |
#15
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#16
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Pan Ohco mentioned in passing :
But I must admit that Picasso did have better PR the George Bush. True. GWB is smarter than the average, seems to out-think the Democrats coming and going, and is forthright... which is not true of many people who claim to be smarter than him. Most of the insults about his intelligence can be boiled down to either a bias against southern accents or a critisim of his dysphasia. Both hallmarks of a liberal democrat, to pick on people because of their origins or handicaps. |
#17
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Rox wrote:
Bill DeWitt wrote: bmcky mentioned in passing : Could Einstein or Picasso fly an F-102 ? Or best Kerry on an IQ test? Most IQ tests really only test how good the subject in question is at taking that particular IQ test. IQ tests are a best effort at measuring intelligence. Since intelligence is hard to define, it is even harder to measure. But step back and think about it - Once you know someone for a while you end up with a good idea how intelligent they are. Intelligence is a very real idea and it is measured by people automatically. No matter that it is hard to measure folks do so anyways. IQ tests do better than some think, and there is constant effort to improve them to get in line with the type of judgement that people make anyways. IQ tests are limited and they do make mistakes, but just try collecting 50 people who scored 140+ and see if you fail to call almost all of them smart once you get to know them. Try collecting 50 people who scored 60- and see if you find any geniuses. Do not mistake falibility with worthlessness. On folks calling Bush stupid, go right ahead. It's clear he's one of the worst public speakers ever elected to the office (apparently nearly as bad as George Washington). If you make the mistake that poor public speaking equals stupid, just try getting up in public and making a good speech some time. Doing that causes you to underestimate your opponent. He won re-election thanks to that sort of underestimate. I'm neither pro-Bush nor anti-Bush but I respect the way he parlays his weakness in public speaking into his strength in getting folks to underestimate him. |
#18
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In article ,
bmcky wrote: Could Einstein or Picasso fly an F-102 ? Neither can Bush. -- D.F. Manno | The worst government is the most moral. One composed of cynics is often very tolerant and humane. But when fanatics are on top there is no limit to oppression.--H.L. Mencken, "Minority Report" (1956) |
#19
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In article ,
"Bill DeWitt" wrote: Or best Kerry on an IQ test? When did the Shrub and Kerry ever take the same test, so their scores could be directly compared? -- D.F. Manno | The worst government is the most moral. One composed of cynics is often very tolerant and humane. But when fanatics are on top there is no limit to oppression.--H.L. Mencken, "Minority Report" (1956) |
#20
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Pan Ohco wrote: On 16 Sep 2005 07:21:38 -0700, Max Hollywood Harris wrote: In my Seminar on International Political Economy, we looked at a study that tried to ennumerate the conceptual complexity of top central bankers (Alan Greenspan, and his opposite numbers around the world) and contrast that with their bank's independance as measured another way. Being in the fall of last year, we naturally looked at the candidates, and Bush came up very far behind in Conceptual Complexity. Using a Bill DeWitt debate tactic, I will not cite any work on Conceptual Complexity, but will affirm that it's a better measure than IQ for a politician's skill. And not allow any argument of that point. -Hollywood, who beats both candidates if they are 5-to-10-in-a-hundred I have got to give you this Hollywood. How can anyone argue with you when you made up the scale. :-) You so funny. So funny I'm forgetting to laugh as I write this. I did not make up the scale. The ennumerating scale was created by a political economy/sociology professor. Conceptual Complexity is widely used in studies like psychology and sociology. Not very used in political economy, which is what made the study interesting and discussion worthy. Googling "Conceptual Complexity" (in quotes) returns "about 28,900" pages. Three were on my harddrive. The rest must be figments of my imagination. Get out, live and learn Pan. -Hollywood, who reminds that IQ is a measure of capacity, not achievement. Think Gattica. Loren Dean has the capacity to do amazing things, but Ethan Hawke is the one who actually goes into space. |
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