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How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 27th, 2003, 07:00 AM
Sarah Fox Jahn
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website

Just a FYI post, who those curious:

"How long can I stay on Induction?

The longer you consume no more than 20 grams of carbs daily, the more
body fat you will burn. Depending on how much weight you need to lose,
you can safely continue with Induction as long as the following three
conditions are met:

Your blood chemistries, lipid values, blood pressure or blood sugar
levels continue to improve or remain stable and within normal limits.

You feel well and are experiencing a high energy level, normal sleep
patterns and stable moods.

You are not bored. Boredom could lead to cheating and undermine your
efforts.

However, it is important to understand the entire Atkins Nutritional
ApproachTM. The ultimate goal of the program is to advance from the
Induction phase through Ongoing Weight Loss and Pre-Maintenance,
culminating in Lifetime Maintenance, which should become your
permanent way eating. By following these steps, you can find your
Critical Carbohydrate Level for Losing (CCLL), also known as your
carbohydrate threshold for losing, and ultimately your Critical
Carbohydrate Level for Maintenance (CCLM), also known as your
carbohydrate threshold for maintaining. Segueing from one phase to
another will help you maintain a healthful weight, feel good and
decrease your risk factors for chronic diseases such as heart disease,
hypertension and diabetes.

That being said, if you have a great deal of weight to lose, you can
certainly stay on Induction for six months or even more. When you
switch to Ongoing Weight Loss, your rate of loss will naturally
diminish. On the other hand, if you have a modest weight loss goal,
say 20 pounds, and lose the first pounds rapidly, it is important to
move through the more liberal phases so you can establish the good
eating habits that will become part of your ongoing lifestyle and end
yo-yo dieting."

From
http://atkins.com/helpatkins/newfaq/...Induction.html
  #3  
Old December 27th, 2003, 04:33 PM
Jenny
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website


Sarah Fox Jahn" wrote in message
...
Just a FYI post, who those curious: [quoting the Atkins web site]

"How long can I stay on Induction?

The longer you consume no more than 20 grams of carbs daily, the more
body fat you will burn. Depending on how much weight you need to lose,
you can safely continue with Induction as long as the following three
conditions are met:


What utter horse patootie!

The amount of body fat you burn has very little to do with how many grams of
carbs you eat.

If it did, people wouldn't stall out for months while spilling ketones every
day.

Lowering your carbs below a certain threshold will shift your muscles and
organs first into burning ketones, and then, about three weeks later into
burning free fatty acids rather than carbs. But if your daily caloric intake
is more than you are burning off, you won't lose a pound. Even if you are
burning fat, after the first couple weeks most people (especially those who
are not young males) will see their weight loss slow down to a pound or two
a week at very most no matter how many grams they eat.

The huge burst of energy that the Atkins site waxes enthusiatic about will
also decrease after a few weeks as the body adapts to a fat-burning regimen
and many dieters will find themselves contending with low energy and
exhaustion if they don't boost their carbs a bit, especially if they are
pursuing an exercise regimen.

When you
switch to Ongoing Weight Loss, your rate of loss will naturally
diminish


This too is hogwash. Switching to OWL has nothing to do with the slowing
down of weight loss. After 3 weeks on a very low carb diet most people's
early, fast weight loss slows way down and after that it's a matter of
eating less than your body burns.

Partly this is because they've flushed the water out of their tissues, and
partly it is because after going through an initial state of confusion, in
which it is prone to drop a surprising amount of weight, the body figures
out what is going on and stops what it sees as dangerous depletion of famine
stores.

After this adaptation kicks in, weight loss slows to normal levels which
depend almost completely on how much you are eating. The more you weigh, the
more you'll tend to lose each week, but the statistics compiled from records
of manyreal dieters show that median weight loss is 1 pound a week for
people under 200 lbs and less than 2 lbs a week for people who weigh over
300 lbs.

http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/dietpage.htm summarizes the data
collected on this newsgroup from real dieters over many months.

It has always been striking to me that Atkins NEVER published any
statistical studies drawn from the many thousands of dieters he supposedly
helped, and that all the anedotes in his book described people in the very
early stages of the diet.

That's probably because while the diet works, for most people it does NOT
work in the near magical way his
bestsellers would make you believe it does.

Long term weight loss is a long, slow, process that requires discipline and
hard work no matter what diet you use. The tragedy of the Atkins diet is
that with its focus on the first couple weeks of impressive weight loss it
raises unrealistic expectations in most of the people who try it. When
things slow down after a month or two, most Atkins dieters get disillusioned
and many of them quit thinking they've failed when in fact they are getting
better than usual results.


-- Jenny

Cut the carbs to respond to my new email address!
New photo: http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/jennypics.htm
Weight: 168.5/137
Diabetes Type II diagnosed 8/1998 -
HBa1c 5.2 10/03
Low Carb 9/1998 - 8/2001 and 11/10/02 - Now

http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean
How to calculate your need for protein * How much people really lose each
month * Water Weight Gain & Loss * The "Two Gram Cure" for Hunger Cravings
* Characteristics of Successful Dieters * Indispensible Low Carb Treats *
Should You Count that Low Impact Carb? * Curing Ketobreath * Exercise
Starting from Zero * Do Starch Blockers Work? * NEW! Why the Low Carb Diet
is Great for Diabetes * NEW! Low Carb Strategies for People with Diabetes


"Sarah Fox Jahn" wrote in message
...
Just a FYI post, who those curious:

"How long can I stay on Induction?

The longer you consume no more than 20 grams of carbs daily, the more
body fat you will burn. Depending on how much weight you need to lose,
you can safely continue with Induction as long as the following three
conditions are met:

Your blood chemistries, lipid values, blood pressure or blood sugar
levels continue to improve or remain stable and within normal limits.

You feel well and are experiencing a high energy level, normal sleep
patterns and stable moods.

You are not bored. Boredom could lead to cheating and undermine your
efforts.

However, it is important to understand the entire Atkins Nutritional
ApproachTM. The ultimate goal of the program is to advance from the
Induction phase through Ongoing Weight Loss and Pre-Maintenance,
culminating in Lifetime Maintenance, which should become your
permanent way eating. By following these steps, you can find your
Critical Carbohydrate Level for Losing (CCLL), also known as your
carbohydrate threshold for losing, and ultimately your Critical
Carbohydrate Level for Maintenance (CCLM), also known as your
carbohydrate threshold for maintaining. Segueing from one phase to
another will help you maintain a healthful weight, feel good and
decrease your risk factors for chronic diseases such as heart disease,
hypertension and diabetes.

That being said, if you have a great deal of weight to lose, you can
certainly stay on Induction for six months or even more. When you
switch to Ongoing Weight Loss, your rate of loss will naturally
diminish. On the other hand, if you have a modest weight loss goal,
say 20 pounds, and lose the first pounds rapidly, it is important to
move through the more liberal phases so you can establish the good
eating habits that will become part of your ongoing lifestyle and end
yo-yo dieting."

From

http://atkins.com/helpatkins/newfaq/...Induction.html


  #4  
Old December 27th, 2003, 05:00 PM
Taffy Stoker
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website

On 27 Dec 2003 07:31:37 -0800, (n k bakker)
wrote:


How about that!! Sarah responded with some FACTS to back up what she
said...


That is quite a condescending thing to say.
  #5  
Old December 27th, 2003, 05:30 PM
Cubit
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website

Wow.
Who ****ed in your punchbowl?

So far, when I see people say they have stalled and they actually list what
they are eating, I see several items with carbs on their list. Sometimes it
seems they have been buying commercial low carb products, which often
contain CARBS.

Is it possible, that by pushing the diet too religiously, the body may be
triggerred into a high efficiency mode. Does the body think you are
starving and fight further weight loss?

I sure hope Jenny is wrong.

Cubit
308/292.5/165


  #6  
Old December 27th, 2003, 06:08 PM
LCer09
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website

It has always been striking to me that Atkins NEVER published any
statistical studies drawn from the many thousands of dieters he supposedly
helped, and that all the anedotes in his book described people in the very
early stages of the diet.


I didn't notice that "all the anecdotes in his book described people in the
very
early stages of the diet." And I've read a couple of his books. I can't recall
many references to how long people have kept the weight off, but most of them
have reached their goals, which would hardly be the "early stages". Including
that dangerously stupid doctor who "didn't exercise for fear of the excess
weight harming her" when she started out at 5'7" 160. (how or why that was
allowed to be published is beyond me)
  #7  
Old December 27th, 2003, 07:05 PM
Chet Hayes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website

"Jenny" wrote in message ...
Sarah Fox Jahn" wrote in message
...
Just a FYI post, who those curious: [quoting the Atkins web site]

"How long can I stay on Induction?

The longer you consume no more than 20 grams of carbs daily, the more
body fat you will burn. Depending on how much weight you need to lose,
you can safely continue with Induction as long as the following three
conditions are met:


What utter horse patootie!






The amount of body fat you burn has very little to do with how many grams of
carbs you eat.

If it did, people wouldn't stall out for months while spilling ketones every
day.

Lowering your carbs below a certain threshold will shift your muscles and
organs first into burning ketones, and then, about three weeks later into
burning free fatty acids rather than carbs. But if your daily caloric intake
is more than you are burning off, you won't lose a pound. Even if you are
burning fat, after the first couple weeks most people (especially those who
are not young males) will see their weight loss slow down to a pound or two
a week at very most no matter how many grams they eat.

The huge burst of energy that the Atkins site waxes enthusiatic about will
also decrease after a few weeks as the body adapts to a fat-burning regimen
and many dieters will find themselves contending with low energy and
exhaustion if they don't boost their carbs a bit, especially if they are
pursuing an exercise regimen.

When you
switch to Ongoing Weight Loss, your rate of loss will naturally
diminish


This too is hogwash. Switching to OWL has nothing to do with the slowing
down of weight loss. After 3 weeks on a very low carb diet most people's
early, fast weight loss slows way down and after that it's a matter of
eating less than your body burns.



You may think this is all hogwash, however I can tell you that for me,
it works exactly as Atkins described. Staying close to 20 grams
resulted in faster weight loss, not just for a few weeks, but for many
months. And my energy level improved during induction and stayed that
way.






Partly this is because they've flushed the water out of their tissues, and
partly it is because after going through an initial state of confusion, in
which it is prone to drop a surprising amount of weight, the body figures
out what is going on and stops what it sees as dangerous depletion of famine
stores.

After this adaptation kicks in, weight loss slows to normal levels which
depend almost completely on how much you are eating. The more you weigh, the
more you'll tend to lose each week, but the statistics compiled from records
of manyreal dieters show that median weight loss is 1 pound a week for
people under 200 lbs and less than 2 lbs a week for people who weigh over
300 lbs.

http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/dietpage.htm summarizes the data
collected on this newsgroup from real dieters over many months.

It has always been striking to me that Atkins NEVER published any
statistical studies drawn from the many thousands of dieters he supposedly
helped, and that all the anedotes in his book described people in the very
early stages of the diet.

That's probably because while the diet works, for most people it does NOT
work in the near magical way his
bestsellers would make you believe it does.




I would say that for me, it's worked exactly as Atkins described. And
I've seen plenty of others on here over the months that have reported
similar results.

BTW, when you're making posts that rely on your personal experinces,
and contradicting Atkins recommendations for the general population,
don't you think you should tell people that you're a diabetic which
can effect most of what your discussing?




Long term weight loss is a long, slow, process that requires discipline and
hard work no matter what diet you use. The tragedy of the Atkins diet is
that with its focus on the first couple weeks of impressive weight loss it
raises unrealistic expectations in most of the people who try it. When
things slow down after a month or two, most Atkins dieters get disillusioned
and many of them quit thinking they've failed when in fact they are getting
better than usual results.


-- Jenny

Cut the carbs to respond to my new email address!
New photo: http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/jennypics.htm
Weight: 168.5/137
Diabetes Type II diagnosed 8/1998 -
HBa1c 5.2 10/03
Low Carb 9/1998 - 8/2001 and 11/10/02 - Now

http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean
How to calculate your need for protein * How much people really lose each
month * Water Weight Gain & Loss * The "Two Gram Cure" for Hunger Cravings
* Characteristics of Successful Dieters * Indispensible Low Carb Treats *
Should You Count that Low Impact Carb? * Curing Ketobreath * Exercise
Starting from Zero * Do Starch Blockers Work? * NEW! Why the Low Carb Diet
is Great for Diabetes * NEW! Low Carb Strategies for People with Diabetes


"Sarah Fox Jahn" wrote in message
...
Just a FYI post, who those curious:

"How long can I stay on Induction?

The longer you consume no more than 20 grams of carbs daily, the more
body fat you will burn. Depending on how much weight you need to lose,
you can safely continue with Induction as long as the following three
conditions are met:

Your blood chemistries, lipid values, blood pressure or blood sugar
levels continue to improve or remain stable and within normal limits.

You feel well and are experiencing a high energy level, normal sleep
patterns and stable moods.

You are not bored. Boredom could lead to cheating and undermine your
efforts.

However, it is important to understand the entire Atkins Nutritional
ApproachTM. The ultimate goal of the program is to advance from the
Induction phase through Ongoing Weight Loss and Pre-Maintenance,
culminating in Lifetime Maintenance, which should become your
permanent way eating. By following these steps, you can find your
Critical Carbohydrate Level for Losing (CCLL), also known as your
carbohydrate threshold for losing, and ultimately your Critical
Carbohydrate Level for Maintenance (CCLM), also known as your
carbohydrate threshold for maintaining. Segueing from one phase to
another will help you maintain a healthful weight, feel good and
decrease your risk factors for chronic diseases such as heart disease,
hypertension and diabetes.

That being said, if you have a great deal of weight to lose, you can
certainly stay on Induction for six months or even more. When you
switch to Ongoing Weight Loss, your rate of loss will naturally
diminish. On the other hand, if you have a modest weight loss goal,
say 20 pounds, and lose the first pounds rapidly, it is important to
move through the more liberal phases so you can establish the good
eating habits that will become part of your ongoing lifestyle and end
yo-yo dieting."

From

http://atkins.com/helpatkins/newfaq/...Induction.html

  #9  
Old December 27th, 2003, 09:32 PM
n k bakker
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website

so Jenny...the Atkins website and theory are mistaken and "patootie"?

Can you tell us how and where you learned that this information is
incorrect?

Or is the poster just making some assumptions you don't agree with?

My Dr.(Paul Cantor) first mentioned the Atkins ideas of eating (and
living) in the late 60's after reading some of Atkins' first published
articles on the subject..and except for things like Diet Soda,
artifical sugars and Deserta coming on and off the market, he (Atkins)
seems to have "stayed with what brung him to the dance..."

I'd love to hear more from you regarding the errors of this theory...

Enlighten us, please...

Nancyy Bakker
  #10  
Old December 27th, 2003, 09:40 PM
Jenny
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default How Long Can You Stay on Induction - from Atkins website


I sure hope Jenny is wrong.

Cubit
308/292.5/165


Jenny only knows that back years ago when there were NO low carb junk foods,
when you had to mail order Spenda, even, and when aspartame was completely
off the list of foods she would eat, she managed to stall out at 150 lbs for
years while spilling ketones daily.

I'm far from being the only long term poster with the same experience.
Eventually several of us have found ways to break the stall. Often they
require prescription medicines that lower insulin resistance. For me the
other piece of "magic" was lowering my protein intake considerably, because
almost 60% of the protein you eat is turned into carb by the liver and in my
case this was enough to trigger insulin releases leading to stalled weight
loss and very troublesome hypoglyemia.

The real mechanism that makes low carbing work is that it makes it very easy
to cut your calories way down without noticing it, because it eliminates the
blood sugar spikes and insulin spikes that create hunger cravings. Before
the advent of low carb junk food, low carbers had to cut out so many of the
things we used to eat that we naturally cut down calories too.

But once you eat below the level of carbs that causes blood sugar spikes for
you, personally, lowering carbs any further doesn't make any difference. For
me that level is 12-15 grams per meal which works out in practice to 35 to
60 grams a day You've tamed hunger. Now, if you really want to keep at this
for years and years you need to figure out how to "eat smart" which means
low carb vegetables, fiber, and enough variety to keep you from burning out.

And you have to find the calorie level at which you'll lose too, which, does
seem to be somewhere between 8 and 12 times current body weight, depending
on how hard your body fights back.

-- Jenny

Cut the carbs to respond to my new email address!
New photo: http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/jennypics.htm
Weight: 168.5/137
Diabetes Type II diagnosed 8/1998 -
HBa1c 5.2 10/03
Low Carb 9/1998 - 8/2001 and 11/10/02 - Now

http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean
How to calculate your need for protein * How much people really lose each
month * Water Weight Gain & Loss * The "Two Gram Cure" for Hunger Cravings
* Characteristics of Successful Dieters * Indispensible Low Carb Treats *
Should You Count that Low Impact Carb? * Curing Ketobreath * Exercise
Starting from Zero * Do Starch Blockers Work? * NEW! Why the Low Carb Diet
is Great for Diabetes * NEW! Low Carb Strategies for People with Diabetes


"Cubit" wrote in message
m...
Wow.
Who ****ed in your punchbowl?

So far, when I see people say they have stalled and they actually list

what
they are eating, I see several items with carbs on their list. Sometimes

it
seems they have been buying commercial low carb products, which often
contain CARBS.

Is it possible, that by pushing the diet too religiously, the body may be
triggerred into a high efficiency mode. Does the body think you are
starving and fight further weight loss?

I sure hope Jenny is wrong.

Cubit
308/292.5/165




 




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