Just How Many Calories, Then?

"TC" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hey, a 95% failure rate is not something you can ignore. Unless you
are
an idiot, then anything is possible.

You are correct with the percent but haven't clue how to turn it around.
And please don't start spouting off about yourself and what you did.
Anecdotes prove nothing when applied to large numbers.


-DF

Doug Freese wrote:
"TC" wrote in message
oups.com...
It is surprising that debate continues about the effectiveness of
dietary treatments for obesity. Perhaps this is partly related to
ambiguity in the term effectiveness. It is well known that most
treatments produce temporary weight loss. But it is equally well known
that 90% to 95% of those who lose weight regain it within several
years.

You notice TC they did not give exception to YOUR suggested eating
regimin. All those fad diets, including your low-carb no grain fad diets
fai and do harm. I can't belive you are citing this study as it shows
how far off the planet you are.

This was published before low-carb was big and on their radar screens
in early 2000s. This refers to the commonly prescribed treatment
options which always was low calorie and low fat like LCDs and VLCDs.
Remember they are talking about "treatments" for obesity. The
mainstream has never considered low carb a valid "treatment".



The failure of fat people to achieve a goal they seem to want - and to
want almost above all else - must now be admitted for what it is: a
failure not of those people but of the methods of treatment that are
used.

Like Low-carb.

Nope, it is an indictment of mainly low fat diets.



Treat the patient not obesity

Of course obese patients should be treated for illnesses and injuries
like everyone else. They should be counselled to eat a healthy
balanced
diet and to get appropriate amounts of exercise.

Psst, TC, please read the above. BALANCED and EXERCISE .


-DF

The healthy balanced diet being low in highly refined, highly
processed, manufactured crap foods, just as I've been advocating for
years. And having enough nutrient-dense healthy whole food carbs,
animal proteins and healthy animal fats.

For example, the French Paradox. The French eat more animal fats and
less refined carbs and are thinner and healthier than Americans who eat
less animal fats and more refined carbs. And it has nothing to do with
something in the wine. It is primarily the quality of the food that
they eat and especially the quality of the carbs and the fats.

And appropriate amounts of exercise does not mean running marathons
every week. It means being moderately active.

TC

wrote in message
ups.com...

Doug Freese wrote:
"TC" wrote in message
oups.com...
It is surprising that debate continues about the effectiveness of
dietary treatments for obesity. Perhaps this is partly related to
ambiguity in the term effectiveness. It is well known that most
treatments produce temporary weight loss. But it is equally well known
that 90% to 95% of those who lose weight regain it within several
years.

You notice TC they did not give exception to YOUR suggested eating
regimin. All those fad diets, including your low-carb no grain fad diets
fai and do harm. I can't belive you are citing this study as it shows
how far off the planet you are.

This was published before low-carb was big and on their radar screens
in early 2000s. This refers to the commonly prescribed treatment
options which always was low calorie and low fat like LCDs and VLCDs.
Remember they are talking about "treatments" for obesity. The
mainstream has never considered low carb a valid "treatment".



The failure of fat people to achieve a goal they seem to want - and to
want almost above all else - must now be admitted for what it is: a
failure not of those people but of the methods of treatment that are
used.

Like Low-carb.

Nope, it is an indictment of mainly low fat diets.



Treat the patient not obesity

Of course obese patients should be treated for illnesses and injuries
like everyone else. They should be counselled to eat a healthy
balanced
diet and to get appropriate amounts of exercise.

Psst, TC, please read the above. BALANCED and EXERCISE .


-DF

The healthy balanced diet being low in highly refined, highly
processed, manufactured crap foods, just as I've been advocating for
years. And having enough nutrient-dense healthy whole food carbs,
animal proteins and healthy animal fats.

For example, the French Paradox. The French eat more animal fats and
less refined carbs and are thinner and healthier than Americans who eat
less animal fats and more refined carbs. And it has nothing to do with
something in the wine. It is primarily the quality of the food that
they eat and especially the quality of the carbs and the fats.

And the olive oil and garlic.

And appropriate amounts of exercise does not mean running marathons
every week. It means being moderately active.


Hear hear.

Six miles moderately paced walking today just to get from one place to
another. Fairly routine and no problem. I dislike public transport so unless
I'm in a tearing hurry, I walk everywhere I can.

I wouldn't be seen dead in trainers and a track suit though, making a great
big show of taking exercise, or particularly doing those daft stretching
exercises. Where did they come from? You never saw those a few years ago.
Praps teh public got so used to seeing joggers that they started ignoring
them so some of the joggers had to find a new way to draw attention to
themselves. There was a chap doing em in Regents Park today, stretching away
but looking around at passers-by as he did so, as if he were looking for
some sort of adulation from them!

No offence. If I hadn't gone to a school where it was assumed that we
automatically knew how to play sports and exercise and were taken the mickey
out of rotten if we didn't, *including* by the teachers! - I might have a
better attitude towards sport-heads, joggers etc.

nemo wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

Doug Freese wrote:
"TC" wrote in message
oups.com...
It is surprising that debate continues about the effectiveness of
dietary treatments for obesity. Perhaps this is partly related to
ambiguity in the term effectiveness. It is well known that most
treatments produce temporary weight loss. But it is equally well known
that 90% to 95% of those who lose weight regain it within several
years.

You notice TC they did not give exception to YOUR suggested eating
regimin. All those fad diets, including your low-carb no grain fad diets
fai and do harm. I can't belive you are citing this study as it shows
how far off the planet you are.

This was published before low-carb was big and on their radar screens
in early 2000s. This refers to the commonly prescribed treatment
options which always was low calorie and low fat like LCDs and VLCDs.
Remember they are talking about "treatments" for obesity. The
mainstream has never considered low carb a valid "treatment".



The failure of fat people to achieve a goal they seem to want - and to
want almost above all else - must now be admitted for what it is: a
failure not of those people but of the methods of treatment that are
used.

Like Low-carb.

Nope, it is an indictment of mainly low fat diets.



Treat the patient not obesity

Of course obese patients should be treated for illnesses and injuries
like everyone else. They should be counselled to eat a healthy
balanced
diet and to get appropriate amounts of exercise.

Psst, TC, please read the above. BALANCED and EXERCISE .


-DF

The healthy balanced diet being low in highly refined, highly
processed, manufactured crap foods, just as I've been advocating for
years. And having enough nutrient-dense healthy whole food carbs,
animal proteins and healthy animal fats.

For example, the French Paradox. The French eat more animal fats and
less refined carbs and are thinner and healthier than Americans who eat
less animal fats and more refined carbs. And it has nothing to do with
something in the wine. It is primarily the quality of the food that
they eat and especially the quality of the carbs and the fats.

And the olive oil and garlic.

Extra virgin, cold pressed olive oil and garlic fresh from the garden
or the market.

As opposed to American extra filtered, high temperature pressed,
processed clear remnants of something that used to be olive oil and
garlic powder or garlic salt from a bottle that's been sitting on the
shelf for months..


And appropriate amounts of exercise does not mean running marathons
every week. It means being moderately active.


Hear hear.

Six miles moderately paced walking today just to get from one place to
another. Fairly routine and no problem. I dislike public transport so unless
I'm in a tearing hurry, I walk everywhere I can.

Walking rocks. So does gardening. And puttering around the house. And
woodworking. And other light activities. And skating for fun. And a bit
of baseball. Or catch. Or street hockey. Just mowing around and
enjoying life.

As opposed to running lengthy distances way beyond the human bodies
naturally designed capacity on a regular basis.


I wouldn't be seen dead in trainers and a track suit though, making a great
big show of taking exercise, or particularly doing those daft stretching
exercises. Where did they come from? You never saw those a few years ago.
Praps teh public got so used to seeing joggers that they started ignoring
them so some of the joggers had to find a new way to draw attention to
themselves. There was a chap doing em in Regents Park today, stretching away
but looking around at passers-by as he did so, as if he were looking for
some sort of adulation from them!

No offence. If I hadn't gone to a school where it was assumed that we
automatically knew how to play sports and exercise and were taken the mickey
out of rotten if we didn't, *including* by the teachers! - I might have a
better attitude towards sport-heads, joggers etc.

TC wrote:
nemo wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

Doug Freese wrote:
"TC" wrote in message
oups.com...
It is surprising that debate continues about the effectiveness of
dietary treatments for obesity. Perhaps this is partly related to
ambiguity in the term effectiveness. It is well known that most
treatments produce temporary weight loss. But it is equally well
known that 90% to 95% of those who lose weight regain it within
several years.

You notice TC they did not give exception to YOUR suggested eating
regimin. All those fad diets, including your low-carb no grain fad
diets fai and do harm. I can't belive you are citing this study as
it shows how far off the planet you are.

This was published before low-carb was big and on their radar
screens in early 2000s. This refers to the commonly prescribed
treatment options which always was low calorie and low fat like
LCDs and VLCDs. Remember they are talking about "treatments" for
obesity. The mainstream has never considered low carb a valid
"treatment".



The failure of fat people to achieve a goal they seem to want -
and to want almost above all else - must now be admitted for what
it is: a failure not of those people but of the methods of
treatment that are used.

Like Low-carb.

Nope, it is an indictment of mainly low fat diets.



Treat the patient not obesity

Of course obese patients should be treated for illnesses and
injuries like everyone else. They should be counselled to eat a
healthy balanced
diet and to get appropriate amounts of exercise.

Psst, TC, please read the above. BALANCED and EXERCISE .


-DF

The healthy balanced diet being low in highly refined, highly
processed, manufactured crap foods, just as I've been advocating for
years. And having enough nutrient-dense healthy whole food carbs,
animal proteins and healthy animal fats.

For example, the French Paradox. The French eat more animal fats and
less refined carbs and are thinner and healthier than Americans who
eat less animal fats and more refined carbs. And it has nothing to
do with something in the wine. It is primarily the quality of the
food that they eat and especially the quality of the carbs and the
fats.

And the olive oil and garlic.

Extra virgin, cold pressed olive oil and garlic fresh from the garden
or the market.

As opposed to American extra filtered, high temperature pressed,
processed clear remnants of something that used to be olive oil and
garlic powder or garlic salt from a bottle that's been sitting on the
shelf for months..


And appropriate amounts of exercise does not mean running marathons
every week. It means being moderately active.


Hear hear.

Six miles moderately paced walking today just to get from one place
to another. Fairly routine and no problem. I dislike public
transport so unless I'm in a tearing hurry, I walk everywhere I can.

Walking rocks.

Funny !

So does gardening.

Funnier !!

And puttering around the house.

Funniest !!!

And woodworking. And other light activities. And skating for fun. And a
bit of baseball. Or catch. Or street hockey. Just mowing around and
enjoying life.

As opposed to running lengthy distances way beyond the human bodies
naturally designed capacity on a regular basis.

[...]


--
Bully
Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't
matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

Just How Many Calories, Then?

Not too many. And, Not too little either. But, just right. Like the
three Little Bears nursery rhyme.

There, now wasn't that simple?

"Bully" wrote in message
...
TC wrote:
nemo wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

Doug Freese wrote:
"TC" wrote in message
oups.com...
It is surprising that debate continues about the effectiveness of
dietary treatments for obesity. Perhaps this is partly related to
ambiguity in the term effectiveness. It is well known that most
treatments produce temporary weight loss. But it is equally well
known that 90% to 95% of those who lose weight regain it within
several years.

You notice TC they did not give exception to YOUR suggested eating
regimin. All those fad diets, including your low-carb no grain fad
diets fai and do harm. I can't belive you are citing this study as
it shows how far off the planet you are.

This was published before low-carb was big and on their radar
screens in early 2000s. This refers to the commonly prescribed
treatment options which always was low calorie and low fat like
LCDs and VLCDs. Remember they are talking about "treatments" for
obesity. The mainstream has never considered low carb a valid
"treatment".



The failure of fat people to achieve a goal they seem to want -
and to want almost above all else - must now be admitted for what
it is: a failure not of those people but of the methods of
treatment that are used.

Like Low-carb.

Nope, it is an indictment of mainly low fat diets.



Treat the patient not obesity

Of course obese patients should be treated for illnesses and
injuries like everyone else. They should be counselled to eat a
healthy balanced
diet and to get appropriate amounts of exercise.

Psst, TC, please read the above. BALANCED and EXERCISE .


-DF

The healthy balanced diet being low in highly refined, highly
processed, manufactured crap foods, just as I've been advocating for
years. And having enough nutrient-dense healthy whole food carbs,
animal proteins and healthy animal fats.

For example, the French Paradox. The French eat more animal fats and
less refined carbs and are thinner and healthier than Americans who
eat less animal fats and more refined carbs. And it has nothing to
do with something in the wine. It is primarily the quality of the
food that they eat and especially the quality of the carbs and the
fats.

And the olive oil and garlic.

Extra virgin, cold pressed olive oil and garlic fresh from the garden
or the market.

As opposed to American extra filtered, high temperature pressed,
processed clear remnants of something that used to be olive oil and
garlic powder or garlic salt from a bottle that's been sitting on the
shelf for months..


And appropriate amounts of exercise does not mean running marathons
every week. It means being moderately active.


Hear hear.

Six miles moderately paced walking today just to get from one place
to another. Fairly routine and no problem. I dislike public
transport so unless I'm in a tearing hurry, I walk everywhere I can.

Walking rocks.

Funny !

So does gardening.

Funnier !!

And puttering around the house.

Funniest !!!


Aha! Someone who obviously thinks that by risking injury by taking way OTT
heavy exercise will make his willie grow bigger!

nemo wrote:
"Bully" wrote in message
...
TC wrote:
nemo wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

Doug Freese wrote:
"TC" wrote in message
oups.com...
It is surprising that debate continues about the effectiveness
of dietary treatments for obesity. Perhaps this is partly
related to ambiguity in the term effectiveness. It is well
known that most treatments produce temporary weight loss. But
it is equally well known that 90% to 95% of those who lose
weight regain it within several years.

You notice TC they did not give exception to YOUR suggested
eating regimin. All those fad diets, including your low-carb no
grain fad diets fai and do harm. I can't belive you are citing
this study as it shows how far off the planet you are.

This was published before low-carb was big and on their radar
screens in early 2000s. This refers to the commonly prescribed
treatment options which always was low calorie and low fat like
LCDs and VLCDs. Remember they are talking about "treatments" for
obesity. The mainstream has never considered low carb a valid
"treatment".



The failure of fat people to achieve a goal they seem to want -
and to want almost above all else - must now be admitted for
what it is: a failure not of those people but of the methods of
treatment that are used.

Like Low-carb.

Nope, it is an indictment of mainly low fat diets.



Treat the patient not obesity

Of course obese patients should be treated for illnesses and
injuries like everyone else. They should be counselled to eat a
healthy balanced
diet and to get appropriate amounts of exercise.

Psst, TC, please read the above. BALANCED and EXERCISE .


-DF

The healthy balanced diet being low in highly refined, highly
processed, manufactured crap foods, just as I've been advocating
for years. And having enough nutrient-dense healthy whole food
carbs, animal proteins and healthy animal fats.

For example, the French Paradox. The French eat more animal fats
and less refined carbs and are thinner and healthier than
Americans who eat less animal fats and more refined carbs. And it
has nothing to do with something in the wine. It is primarily the
quality of the food that they eat and especially the quality of
the carbs and the fats.

And the olive oil and garlic.

Extra virgin, cold pressed olive oil and garlic fresh from the
garden or the market.

As opposed to American extra filtered, high temperature pressed,
processed clear remnants of something that used to be olive oil and
garlic powder or garlic salt from a bottle that's been sitting on
the shelf for months..


And appropriate amounts of exercise does not mean running
marathons every week. It means being moderately active.


Hear hear.

Six miles moderately paced walking today just to get from one place
to another. Fairly routine and no problem. I dislike public
transport so unless I'm in a tearing hurry, I walk everywhere I
can.

Walking rocks.

Funny !

So does gardening.

Funnier !!

And puttering around the house.

Funniest !!!


Aha! Someone who obviously thinks that by risking injury by taking
way OTT heavy exercise will make his willie grow bigger!

Knob off, fatty.

--
Bully
Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't
matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

On 15 Nov 2006 11:40:14 -0800, TC wrote:

Extra virgin, cold pressed olive oil

By the way, this time of the year is time for the "olio nuovo", as we say,
("new oil"), freshly pressed and very aromatic :-)


Walking rocks. So does gardening. And puttering around the house. And
woodworking. And other light activities. And skating for fun. And a bit
of baseball. Or catch. Or street hockey. Just mowing around and
enjoying life.

Also housework, babysitting, stairs-climbing, doing some shopping on foot.

As opposed to running lengthy distances way beyond the human bodies
naturally designed capacity on a regular basis.

Walk whenever you can and go for a swim if you have the chance to!