Delurk and a plan

Hi folks:

I know I've posted a couple of times already--I've been lurking over the
past month or so and sometimes I just have something to say!

A little bit of history: I was a "fit-but-fat" child and young adult.
Probably weighed around 180 when I graduated HS, which crept up to around
195-205 when I got married/had kids/became less active. I spent 18 months in
Bolivia doing my dissertation research in anthropology: nursing+pregnant,
very active lifestyle, and constant low-grade intestinal parasite load took
off about 65 lbs during that time. About 18 of that came off during the 3rd
month of my 2nd pregnancy--I definitely can't recommend the 3rd
world+pregnant+nursing+morning sickness+inadequate protein+amoebic dysentery
diet plan. When I came back to the states to write my dissertation I went
back to an inactive lifestyle and very quickly regained the weight and then
some. I peaked at around 220.

I moved about 2.5 years ago, dropped about 15 lbs in 3 months due to
stress/depression. For New Years 2003, I resolved to quit smoking and work
on improving my mental and physical health. I started running, a habit that
stuck, but didn't make much in the way of dietary modifications. I've lost
an additional 27 lbs since I started running about 1.5 years ago. My running
is inconsistent--when I'm in a good grove I get up to 20-25 miles/wk, but
there's a lot of 0-10 mile weeks in there as well. Still, I feel tons
healthier, have more energy, and look better. The lower back/hip/knee aches
that plagued me as a 220-lb couch potato are gone.

I met a terrific outdoorsy/active guy this spring, and I really love
spending time together getting hot and sweaty, indoors and out! However, he
also brought with him a habit for beer, sweet treats, taking me out for
dinner, etc. I'm down a couple pounds from the start of summer, but that's
it. Pretty much stalled out at 178 for the past couple of months. Enough to
finally break the "obese/overweight" barrier, but disappointing.

Anyhow, I decided last week to finally track my intake/outgo for a week on
fitday just to see where things stood and to decide whether I wanted to
continue with my 2-year pattern of very slow weight loss, or try to "kick it
up a notch" over the winter.

I did not explicitly try to limit myself, but I am pretty sure I ate fewer
snacks than I might normally have because of the simple awareness of having
to log it. I found fitday somewhat difficult to work with for homecooked
meals. It's especially frustrating that you can't create a custom food
(AFAIK) by entering ingredients.

My exercise level was both "typical" and "atypical" in that I started biking
to work (14 miles RT) a few weeks ago, but have run hardly at all the past
few weeks as my body adjusts to the biking load. I expect to do somewhat
more low-grade running over the winter, along the lines of 2-3 days a week,
probably about 12 miles/wk.

The Results:

Over the past week, my average calorie intake was 2162 calories: 34/47/18
fat/carb/protein. My highest day was about 2500, my lowest about 2000. I
don't believe I felt uncomfortably hungry on the lower days, so I am going
to shoot for 2,000/day from here on out. I will probably play around with
the fat/carb/pro ratios, as well as the timing of meals and macronutrients,
to minimize hunger windows and bad-snack munchies. Cutting out sugar in my
coffee and a bit smaller portions for dinner/dessert should get me to 2,000
without too much sacrifice. I am going to try to shift my whole calorie
structure, and esp. fat/protein calories, earlier in the day. I'm going to
continue drinking beer at about 2/wk rather than the 2/day I was drinking
during much of the summer.

I experimented with measuring portions, as I know that's one major problem
with many people. I was actually surprised that my typical portion sizes for
many of the things I measured *were* appropriate. Although a 1/2 c serving
of granola does look meagre...

My average calorie outgo was 2766. It calculates my basal as 2268, and I
averaged about 500 exercise calories. I got in fewer activities this weekend
(blew off a 4-mile race due to rain, cut a 6-mile trail run short due to
"intestinal upset," and couldn't swim on Saturday because we drove to the
pool and I realized I'd left my purse at home...:-( I will strive to do
better on weekends and bump up the average to a consistent 2800.

The bike commute is such an all-around win! I burn 500+ calories a day at
it, and it only takes 5 minutes longer each way to bike than it does to
drive/walk from remote parking lot. Plus, I will be saving at least
$800/year on gas and parking, not to mention that I will probably be able to
put off replacing my 9-yo car for a few years longer than I had anticipated.
My insurance rates might even go down! All of these advantages will make it
worth the small inconvenience of biking in marginal weather/etc. Roads are
usually only icy and unbikable in Jan. and Feb, so for those days with
snow/ice I'll figure on parking about a mile off campus and walking from
there or telecommuting.

In the abstract sense, this would result in a weight loss of about 1.5 lbs a
week. I suspect the reality will be more like 1 lb/wk, as I simply do not
intend, nor do I need, to be anal about measuring or about not snagging a
Hershey's kiss or two when the mood strikes.

Goals:

For New Year's 2004 I set a goal of dropping 30 lbs over the course of the
year. I'm only 1/2 way there, but I think I can lose 15 lbs in 3 months with
my plan as outlined above. That is my mini-goal. I'm planning a ski vacation
for January (my first time) and I want to be able to wear sz L ski pants,
not XL.

I am setting a final goal of 135 (43 lbs total from where I am today). It
would be a nice birthday present for myself next June. I will aim to bike
5x/wk, run 2-3x/wk, and swim 1x/wk with an eye toward switching from road
races to sprint triathlons next summer. I want to be NOT eligible for the
"Clydesdale" class (140+ lbs for women).

(Oh yeah, FWIW, I'm 36 years old, 5'5")

DrLith
220/178/135

DrLith wrote:


Anyhow, I decided last week to finally track my intake/outgo for a week on
fitday just to see where things stood and to decide whether I wanted to
continue with my 2-year pattern of very slow weight loss, or try to "kick it
up a notch" over the winter.

I did not explicitly try to limit myself, but I am pretty sure I ate fewer
snacks than I might normally have because of the simple awareness of having
to log it. I found fitday somewhat difficult to work with for homecooked
meals. It's especially frustrating that you can't create a custom food
(AFAIK) by entering ingredients.

FitDay is brilliant for creating and calculating nutrient values for
custom meals.

You go into food explorer, customs, then new custom. You search on the
ingredients, select then copy them, then paste them in the "Ingredients"
panel in the new custom. You adjust the quantities and when finished,
you select the food label or calorie panels and all of the data for the
meal is listed.

If you want to break the meal down into measured portions, it helps to
list the weights of all ingredients first, including water or other
liquids, and set that total as the "Amount" before adding the
ingredients. That way, if you have a total meal with a weight of 1 kilo
/ 2.2 pounds, when you change the amount to your serving size, it gives
an exact breakdown of the nutrients, fat/carb/protein values etc.

I use a pressure cooker quite a lot to make stock/gravy without added
flour, by cooking meat and vegetables until they break down, then adding
fresher meat and veg to make up the actual meal. You do lose some water
cooking that way, so I weigh the entire pot before starting, add more
water than I expect to need, allowing plenty to steam off then when it
is finished, I add sufficient hot water back in to bring the recipe
total weight back to the amount entered into FitDay. I end up with a
casserole with a rich gravy that has no flour or carb thickening, and a
very accurate carb count. Adding red wine and a little cream helps it
thicken.

I have several hundred meals entered into Fitday, soups, casseroles,
omelettes, Fritattas, bouillabaisse, in fact most of the low carb
recipes from ASDLC and half a dozen other sources that are floating
around the net. I have modified many of them to suit my own tastes and
diet regime, but whenever I feel like trying something new, I know
exactly what values I will get before I even start to gather the
ingredients.

I like to try out at least two or three new low-carb, or at least,
reduced carb recipes each week.

Regards


David


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To email me, please include the letters DNF anywhere in the subject line.

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"Ignoramus19386" wrote in message
...
Dr, you are doing very well, much better than most dieters. So, my
expectation is that you can figure out the way around all obstacles
that would arise in your way. That said, your goal weight of 135
strikes me as extremely ambitious. Your pictures show a basically
muscular and not small boned person (that was my impression), so, just
what body components would you lose to get to 135?

Not so sure I agree, Ig.

She is currently in the 66th percentile for weight (178 lbs), based on US
averages for gender, height, and age.

At 165 lbs, she would be in the 55th percentile.
At 155 lbs, she would be in the 45th percentile.
At 145 lbs, she would be in the 33rd percentile.
At 135 lbs, she would be in the 22nd percentile.

This is certainly an ambitious goal, but I wouldn't necessarily call it
"extreme" (however, I haven't seen the Dr's pictures).

As for the body composition changes required to reach 135, it may require
losing some muscle mass to do so. I know that's often considered a bad
thing, but I'm not sure if it really is in all cases. Overweight and obese
individual presumably require some "excess" muscle mass to move their fat
mass around. As fat mass drops, the need for some of that muscle mass
lessens. Assuming she's staying active on the bike and running, it seems to
me that losing some muscle mass would not be a problem. In fact, many
serious runners and cyclists intentionally limit upper body mass as a way of
improving performance.

GG
http://www.WeightWare.com
Your Weight and Health Diary


Portion control or some sort of "daily total control" becomes
essential after first losses...

i

"Ignoramus19386" wrote in message
...
Dr, you are doing very well, much better than most dieters. So, my
expectation is that you can figure out the way around all obstacles
that would arise in your way. That said, your goal weight of 135
strikes me as extremely ambitious. Your pictures show a basically
muscular and not small boned person (that was my impression), so, just
what body components would you lose to get to 135?

You haven't seen pictures of my butt :-)

I was at about 143 when I cam back from Bolivia--a size 10/12, and could
definitely have lost another 10 lbs off my butt/thighs and gone from looking
good to looking terrific. On the other hand, I do carry a lot of muscle and
would not look good/feel good trying to get down to 120.

"J. David Anderson" wrote in message
...
DrLith wrote:
I found fitday somewhat difficult to work with for homecooked
meals. It's especially frustrating that you can't create a custom food
(AFAIK) by entering ingredients.

FitDay is brilliant for creating and calculating nutrient values for
custom meals.

You go into food explorer, customs, then new custom. You search on the
ingredients, select then copy them, then paste them in the "Ingredients"
panel in the new custom. You adjust the quantities and when finished,
you select the food label or calorie panels and all of the data for the
meal is listed.

Is that in the PC version? I am using the Web version for now.

"Ignoramus19386" wrote in message
...
In article , GaryG wrote:
"Ignoramus19386" wrote in message
...
Dr, you are doing very well, much better than most dieters. So, my
expectation is that you can figure out the way around all obstacles
that would arise in your way. That said, your goal weight of 135
strikes me as extremely ambitious. Your pictures show a basically
muscular and not small boned person (that was my impression), so, just
what body components would you lose to get to 135?

Not so sure I agree, Ig.

She is currently in the 66th percentile for weight (178 lbs), based on
US
averages for gender, height, and age.

At 165 lbs, she would be in the 55th percentile.
At 155 lbs, she would be in the 45th percentile.
At 145 lbs, she would be in the 33rd percentile.
At 135 lbs, she would be in the 22nd percentile.

This is certainly an ambitious goal, but I wouldn't necessarily call
it "extreme" (however, I haven't seen the Dr's pictures).

So, we both agree that it is "ambitious", but I think that it is
"extremely" ambitious, and you think that it is not extremely
ambitious.

As for the body composition changes required to reach 135, it may
require
losing some muscle mass to do so. I know that's often considered a bad
thing, but I'm not sure if it really is in all cases.

This is an excellent point.

A slim person does not need as much muscle as a fat person due to
lower weight to carry around.

That said, losing muscle to reach an ambitious weight goal strikes me
as somewhat pointless. Why bother? Is there a health benefit from going
from muscular BMI of 24 to muscular BMI of 22? Is there an appearance
benefit?

For me, it was a performance benefit. Going from BMI of 25, to BMI of 23.5
has increased my cycling performance rather dramatically.


Overweight and obese individual presumably require some "excess"
muscle mass to move their fat mass around. As fat mass drops, the
need for some of that muscle mass lessens. Assuming she's staying
active on the bike and running, it seems to me that losing some
muscle mass would not be a problem. In fact, many serious runners
and cyclists intentionally limit upper body mass as a way of
improving performance.

Is it easier to maintain a somewhat higher (but normal) weight, or a
much lower weight? It probably "depends on the person", but common
sense suggests that maintaining a somewhat more modest and respectable
weight loss should likely be easier.
i

I can't answer for everyone, but as an avid cyclist, I have observed my
weight carefully. After commiting myself to a healthier lifestyle about 12
years ago, my weight seemed to stabilize around 182-185 in the summertime,
creeping up closer to 190 in the winter (I'm 6' tall). For a number of
years, I assumed this was my "setpoint" weight.

But, about a year ago I decided to experiment with it, and consciously
worked to go lower (mostly with portion control, and reducing my intake of
"problem foods"). My weight now seems to have stabilized at 173 lbs, and
maintaining it at that level hasn't been terribly difficult.

By losing that 10 lbs from my previous "setpoint", I've found that I am a
lot stronger on the bike - especially when going uphill. While I certainly
was fit and strong at 185, at 173 I'm not only fit, but fast, and enjoy the
feeling of being "light on my feet". The only downside is I can't go
downhill quite as fast as I did before :-).

GG

Ignoramus19386 wrote:

Dr, you are doing very well, much better than most dieters. So, my
expectation is that you can figure out the way around all obstacles
that would arise in your way. That said, your goal weight of 135
strikes me as extremely ambitious.


Why?

I am a six foot male and I have dropped from a June weight of 191lb to
less than 140 and am trying to put muscle weight back on. I am back up
to 139 as of this morning. I want to settle at around 170lb with a fat
percentage under 10. Losing the weight wasn't difficult to do,
calorie/carb control, plus morning and evening exercise seven days per
week.

I have five daughters, three of whom are taller than the op and none
weighs more than 115lb. They are all fit, attractive and do not look
underweight. For some reason the US seems to have a perception that
women should weigh a lot more than the weight that is deemed ideal here.
There are two weight goals, one is for health, reduced risk of weight
induced illness or disease, the other for appearance, and the second is
considerably lower but still not underweight.

If someone is prepared to make the effort to lose weight and get fit,
why not set a goal that improves their self image, not just meets their
health requirements. It gives more incentive than a healthy weight level
alone will give. My wife is 5'3" and worries if she goes over 105lbs.
Cuts out all business lunches if she does, and starts walking more. She
is attractive and wants to stay that way; image is a big incentive.

Your pictures show a basically
muscular and not small boned person (that was my impression), so, just
what body components would you lose to get to 135?

Many girls in my surf and sailing clubs are well under 135 at 5'7" and
are quite muscular and certainly not thin looking; as are many of my
forty something female tennis partners.


Regards

David

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To email me, please include the letters DNF anywhere in the subject line.

All other mail is automatically deleted.

Leafing through alt.support.diet, I read DrLith's message of 07 Oct
2004:

I did not explicitly try to limit myself, but I am pretty sure I ate
fewer snacks than I might normally have because of the simple
awareness of having to log it. I found fitday somewhat difficult to
work with for homecooked meals. It's especially frustrating that you
can't create a custom food (AFAIK) by entering ingredients.

I know FitDay is very popular on this group, maybe because it is free.
There is also a FitDay PC version that may be more cusomizable. I use
DietPower (NFI). I started using it in June 2003. It helped me to lose 80
pounds in about 10 months. I still use it to maintain my weight. It is very
good at learning about you and knowing exactly what you should be eating.
You can customize it to do just about anything, including creating your own
foods and recipes. You can download a 2-week trial from
http://www.dietpower.com.

Phil M.

"Phil M." wrote in message
...
Leafing through alt.support.diet, I read DrLith's message of 07 Oct
2004:

I did not explicitly try to limit myself, but I am pretty sure I ate
fewer snacks than I might normally have because of the simple
awareness of having to log it. I found fitday somewhat difficult to
work with for homecooked meals. It's especially frustrating that you
can't create a custom food (AFAIK) by entering ingredients.

I know FitDay is very popular on this group, maybe because it is free.
There is also a FitDay PC version that may be more cusomizable. I use
DietPower (NFI). I started using it in June 2003. It helped me to lose 80
pounds in about 10 months. I still use it to maintain my weight. It is
very
good at learning about you and knowing exactly what you should be eating.
You can customize it to do just about anything, including creating your
own
foods and recipes. You can download a 2-week trial from
http://www.dietpower.com.

Phil M.

I really like DietPower. I've used it on an off for years - constantly for
the last two years and it's helped a lot.

Jenn

One time on Usenet, "JMA" said:
"Phil M." wrote in message
...

Leafing through alt.support.diet, I read DrLith's message of 07 Oct
2004:

I did not explicitly try to limit myself, but I am pretty sure I ate
fewer snacks than I might normally have because of the simple
awareness of having to log it. I found fitday somewhat difficult to
work with for homecooked meals. It's especially frustrating that you
can't create a custom food (AFAIK) by entering ingredients.

I know FitDay is very popular on this group, maybe because it is free.
There is also a FitDay PC version that may be more cusomizable. I use
DietPower (NFI). I started using it in June 2003. It helped me to lose 80
pounds in about 10 months. I still use it to maintain my weight. It is
very
good at learning about you and knowing exactly what you should be eating.
You can customize it to do just about anything, including creating your
own
foods and recipes. You can download a 2-week trial from
http://www.dietpower.com.

Phil M.

I really like DietPower. I've used it on an off for years - constantly for
the last two years and it's helped a lot.

I'm a DietPower user too -- I love being able to input my own recipes
and let it figure out what size portion I'm allowed, based on my caloric
goals. (I'm doing 1600 kcals per day right now.) When my doctor told me
that to lose weight I had to count calories, I was freaked until I found
out how easy it could be with software. Thanks heavens for the digital
age... :-)


--
J.J. in WA * 275/234
Goal #2: 215 By Dec 31 '05
Goal #3: 195 by May 31 '05