"Net" Carbs.... "Digstible" Carbs???

Just bought a box of "Dreamfields" macaroni elbows. The front of the
box says 5 grams of 'digestible' carbs. The carb count is 42 per half
cup dry with 4 grams of dietary fiber. No mention of sugar alcohols or
anything else that looks like it should or could be subtracted. Any
ideas on how they're justifying the 5 gram number?

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Kitt wrote:
Just bought a box of "Dreamfields" macaroni elbows. The front of the
box says 5 grams of 'digestible' carbs. The carb count is 42 per half
cup dry with 4 grams of dietary fiber. No mention of sugar alcohols or
anything else that looks like it should or could be subtracted. Any
ideas on how they're justifying the 5 gram number?


They're claiming that a patentable process prevents digestion of the
starch matrix of the wheat.

Experiences show otherwise, however, for those of us who use blood
glucose meters to test the effect of foods on our bg.

Many folks can eat Dreamfields pasta (small servings, as listed on the
package) with no serious blood glucose rise. Many, however, have found
that the bg spike is merely delayed, not prevented. Testing shows that
for many of us, it happens 3-5 hours after eating instead of the usual
one hour, and it lasts far longer than the spike caused by regular pasta.

It's a YMMV product, but don't believe the 5 digestible gram label for a
second.

Susan

Thanks Susan. I kind of figured it was some kind of voodoo labeling,
but I tried it anyway right after I posted. I can't claim to a true
adherent of strict low carb, as I allow myself too many cheats. But,
it never hurts to make the cheats as low carb as possible. The
Dreamfields was quite good compared to the soy pasta and even better
than Mueller's "reduced" carb pasta which nets out at 19 grams per 2/3
cup serving. Anyhoo, I guess this is an acceptable food for my day
off. I try to stay under 75 grams total on my one cheat day per week
and under 40 the rest of the week. Now, if I could just get off my
lazy butt more and do smaller portions, I'm set for a a big whoosh. As
it is, I'm maybe losing a little and most importantly, not gaining.

I had a prove it to myself session after an injury a little over a year
ago. I've been doing some form of reduced carb eating since I first
read the original "Carbohydrate Addicts Diet" quite a few years ago,
until I sprained my ankle early last summer. I ate whatever landed in
front of me for about three months and gained nearly thirty pounds.
After a couple weeks of induction and another eight or ten months of
what I describe above, I've lost the thirty plus a couple and now I
need to get rid of the next fifty. Bottom line, I've proven the
validity of low carb eating to myself all over again. Sorry for
babbling and thanks again for the input.

Kitt



Susan wrote:
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Kitt wrote:
Just bought a box of "Dreamfields" macaroni elbows. The front of the
box says 5 grams of 'digestible' carbs. The carb count is 42 per half
cup dry with 4 grams of dietary fiber. No mention of sugar alcohols or
anything else that looks like it should or could be subtracted. Any
ideas on how they're justifying the 5 gram number?


They're claiming that a patentable process prevents digestion of the
starch matrix of the wheat.

Experiences show otherwise, however, for those of us who use blood
glucose meters to test the effect of foods on our bg.

Many folks can eat Dreamfields pasta (small servings, as listed on the
package) with no serious blood glucose rise. Many, however, have found
that the bg spike is merely delayed, not prevented. Testing shows that
for many of us, it happens 3-5 hours after eating instead of the usual
one hour, and it lasts far longer than the spike caused by regular pasta.

It's a YMMV product, but don't believe the 5 digestible gram label for a
second.

Susan

x-no-archive: yes

Kitt wrote:
Thanks Susan. I kind of figured it was some kind of voodoo labeling,
but I tried it anyway right after I posted. I can't claim to a true
adherent of strict low carb, as I allow myself too many cheats. But,
it never hurts to make the cheats as low carb as possible. The
Dreamfields was quite good compared to the soy pasta and even better
than Mueller's "reduced" carb pasta which nets out at 19 grams per 2/3
cup serving.

I can't stqnd any of the soy based or enhanced products, bleah.
Dreamfields is made from semolina, IIRC, and it tastes just like regular
pasta. I do note that even though my BG rose high and stayed high
after eating it, Dreamfields did not cause the immediate post meal bloat
that normal white flour pasta would.

Anyhoo, I guess this is an acceptable food for my day
off. I try to stay under 75 grams total on my one cheat day per week
and under 40 the rest of the week. Now, if I could just get off my
lazy butt more and do smaller portions, I'm set for a a big whoosh. As
it is, I'm maybe losing a little and most importantly, not gaining.

I had a prove it to myself session after an injury a little over a year
ago. I've been doing some form of reduced carb eating since I first
read the original "Carbohydrate Addicts Diet" quite a few years ago,
until I sprained my ankle early last summer. I ate whatever landed in
front of me for about three months and gained nearly thirty pounds.
After a couple weeks of induction and another eight or ten months of
what I describe above, I've lost the thirty plus a couple and now I
need to get rid of the next fifty. Bottom line, I've proven the
validity of low carb eating to myself all over again. Sorry for
babbling and thanks again for the input.

Kitt

Slow and steady is better than not doing anything for yourself... keep
it up!

Susan

The BG spikes after eating Dreamfields pastas only seem to affect people
who are pre- or already diabetic, and not even to all of them. I've eaten
Dreamfields pastas for an entire week for lunch and still continued to lose
weight staying at 40g net carbs/day and that was counting only the
digestible carbs that Dreamfields claim. We have NEVER heard from anyone
who is not diabetic that they've had a problem with Dreamfields.

on Thu, 15 Sep 2005 12:27:11 -0400, Susan wrote:

They're claiming that a patentable process prevents digestion of the
starch matrix of the wheat.

Experiences show otherwise, however, for those of us who use blood
glucose meters to test the effect of foods on our bg.

Many folks can eat Dreamfields pasta (small servings, as listed on the
package) with no serious blood glucose rise. Many, however, have found
that the bg spike is merely delayed, not prevented. Testing shows that
for many of us, it happens 3-5 hours after eating instead of the usual
one hour, and it lasts far longer than the spike caused by regular pasta.

It's a YMMV product, but don't believe the 5 digestible gram label for a
second.
-----
Bev

x-no-archive: yes

Bev-Ann wrote:
The BG spikes after eating Dreamfields pastas only seem to affect people
who are pre- or already diabetic, and not even to all of them.

This may be true, IME. My point is that it completely puts the lie to
the claim that 37 grams of carbohydrate are reliably undigestible.

Further, the folks looking for low carb foods are often, if not most
often, insulin resistant (approx 1/4 - 1/3 of the total population, and
most of the obese population) or diabetic. This makes the claim
especially irresponsible, IMO. Legally ctionable, even.

I've eaten
Dreamfields pastas for an entire week for lunch and still continued to lose
weight staying at 40g net carbs/day and that was counting only the
digestible carbs that Dreamfields claim. We have NEVER heard from anyone
who is not diabetic that they've had a problem with Dreamfields.

Uh, Bev-Ann? How many non-diabetics do you know who use BG meters to
test the effect of foods post-meal? I was one of those who said I had
no problem with it until I got a glucose meter, so not hearing from
anyone says nothing about whether they're digesting the carbs without
knowing it, your own weight loss notwithstanding.

Susan

I was thinking that too, Susan. Only the diabetics normally test for bg, so
they'd be the only one to know if their bg was being spiked. However, I
think what Bev-Ann probably meant was that the "normals" didn't get the
symptoms (aka problems) from Dreamfields that they'd tend to get from other
white flour products - cravings, etc.

By the way, I tend to agree with you that Dreamfields has a serious
truth-in-labeling issue. Although I love the stuff, and don't get cravings
from it (and don't test bg so have no idea about any bg spike that might or
might not occur), the fact that diabetics are getting elevated bgs from it
is pretty good evidence that their claims for it are untrue. I've stopped
using it (except for once in a blue moon) for that reason.

HG


"Susan" wrote in message

Uh, Bev-Ann? How many non-diabetics do you know who use BG meters to test
the effect of foods post-meal? I was one of those who said I had no
problem with it until I got a glucose meter, so not hearing from anyone
says nothing about whether they're digesting the carbs without knowing it,
your own weight loss notwithstanding.

Here's what Dreamfields says:

How is the level of digestible carbohydrate established for Dreamfields
pasta?

A clinical testing method utilizing healthy human subjects is used to
measure the levels of digestible carbohydrate contained in DREAMFIELDS
pasta. The clinical tests are designated as "in vivo" testing or
testing that utilizes a living being, as this is the only known way to
establish how the body will process a specific food to create a blood
glucose response. The shape and area under a blood glucose response
curve is used to determine the level of digestible carbohydrate in a
food and if the body is properly processing digested carbohydrates
appropriately. DREAMFIELDS clinical testing is conducted at an
independent laboratory that complies with FDA guidelines.

x-no-archive: yes

wrote:
Here's what Dreamfields says:

How is the level of digestible carbohydrate established for Dreamfields
pasta?

A clinical testing method utilizing healthy human subjects is used to
measure the levels of digestible carbohydrate contained in DREAMFIELDS
pasta. The clinical tests are designated as "in vivo" testing or
testing that utilizes a living being, as this is the only known way to
establish how the body will process a specific food to create a blood
glucose response. The shape and area under a blood glucose response
curve is used to determine the level of digestible carbohydrate in a
food and if the body is properly processing digested carbohydrates
appropriately. DREAMFIELDS clinical testing is conducted at an
independent laboratory that complies with FDA guidelines.


That's the problem; Dreamfields probably tested at one and two hours.
For many folks, it's longer than that, maybe for most folks, til the spike.

They're selling something: I'm not.

Susan

You're right, most non-diabetics have no reason to test their BG. But I'm
not the only non-diabetic who eats Dreamfields on a regular basis and has
no problems with it. Trust me, if we started to gain weight, we'd stop
using their products without needing to test our BG.
Dreamfields claims are based on tests of healthy individuals. It's
possible that diabetics are digesting something in their products
differently than healthy people. It's likely similar to why a lot of
people, like me, react badly to sugar alcohols because we can't digest them
and then there are some who have no problem digesting them so should stay
away from them on an LC eating plan. That doesn't mean that SA's claims to
be LC-friendly are false.

on Thu, 15 Sep 2005 14:26:46 -0400, Susan wrote:

Bev-Ann wrote:
The BG spikes after eating Dreamfields pastas only seem to affect people
who are pre- or already diabetic, and not even to all of them.

This may be true, IME. My point is that it completely puts the lie to
the claim that 37 grams of carbohydrate are reliably undigestible.

Further, the folks looking for low carb foods are often, if not most
often, insulin resistant (approx 1/4 - 1/3 of the total population, and
most of the obese population) or diabetic. This makes the claim
especially irresponsible, IMO. Legally ctionable, even.

I've eaten
Dreamfields pastas for an entire week for lunch and still continued to lose
weight staying at 40g net carbs/day and that was counting only the
digestible carbs that Dreamfields claim. We have NEVER heard from anyone
who is not diabetic that they've had a problem with Dreamfields.

Uh, Bev-Ann? How many non-diabetics do you know who use BG meters to
test the effect of foods post-meal? I was one of those who said I had
no problem with it until I got a glucose meter, so not hearing from
anyone says nothing about whether they're digesting the carbs without
knowing it, your own weight loss notwithstanding.
-----
Bev