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#1
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Fat people
On Apr 18, 12:33 pm, Always Learning wrote:
On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 18:55:13 -0600, Tiger_Lily wrote this stuff here : Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 12:25:25 -0400, Marshall Price wrote this stuff here : Naughty Boy wrote: Tiger_Lily wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in news:Z7qdnWpVRfQX9WranZ2dnUVZ_tninZ2d@eart hlink.com: Naughty Boy wrote: WaCoder wrote in : Pete wrote: Today, i would like to discuss fat people with all of you... What do we know about fat people? Other than that they are obese, i mean... Generally speaking, fat people are lazy and stupid. This is the most insulting, uninformed, prejudiced, bigoted statement I have ever heard in my life. If you had replaced "fat" with "black" or "Mexican", you would have been dismissed out of hand as a bigot, racist, stupid and not worth the time of day. But just because you're bashing fat ppl, you think you can get away with it. For shame.... Not really. Black or Mexican people had no choice as to what race they were born. Fat people do it to themselves. Is that how bariatricians explain it, or do we have to rely on you for the straight dope? How else do fat people get fat? Certainly not by being lazy or stupid. What theories do you have? let's hear them! untreated hypothyroid for 3 years because my GP didn't want to add thyroid meds to diabetes meds is that good enough for you? kate The old "thyroid" bull**** excuse. I was wondering how long it would take for that one to come up. What makes you presume to imply thyroid diseases don't exist? I can't imagine why you want to flaunt such ignorance in public. For every one million fatasses their might be ONE with some thyroid condition. Most fattys are fat because they eat too much food and do not exercise. i lost 30 lbs in the first 3 mo of synthroid treatment look up Hashimoto's and i hope YOU don't have to deal with this soon at 5'6" i have weighed 125 lbs since high school........... over 30 years ago ok, back to you on your high horse kate I noticed you didn't deny it's probably 1 in 1 million.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - "1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." This number may actually be a substantial underestimate of the actual number of people affected. According to Vahab Fatourechi, MD, of the Division of Endocrinology, Diabetes, Metabolism and Nutrition at Mayo Clinic in Rochester, if the upper limit of normal range of the TSH test were reduced from 5.0 to 3.0, as recommended by the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists and the National Academy of Clinical Biochemistry, there would be a 3-fold increase in the diagnosis of hypothyroidism. Dr. Fatourechi's estimates, which were reported in the Mayo Endocrinology Update, mean that an additional 22 million to 28 million people would be hypothyroid. The actual number of people with thyroid disease, therefore, is likely far higher, falling somewhere in the range of 49 million to 55 million people. http://thyroid.about.com/od/publicaw...7awareness.htm Possibly 49 to 55 million people are affected with some form of thyroid disease in the US alone. So out of 300 million in the US it could be approx. 20%. of the population could be affected. I'm not saying everyone with a weight issue has a thyroid problem but it does seem that there could be a lot more of them out there than one would believe. Ragnar |
#2
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Fat people
On Fri, 18 Apr 2008, Ragnar wrote:
I noticed you didn't deny it's probably 1 in 1 million.- Hide quoted text - "1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." This number may actually be a substantial underestimate of the actual number of people affected. Hasn't Kenny's inability to understand quotes from the doctors who conducted a medical study prove the futility of even trying? Here you are, offering a bigot troll an actual quote from a medical doctor who knows what the flip they are talking about. However, it violates the very foundation of the troll's bigoted attatude. As such, the troll will ignore the fact, and instead rely on their previously stated opinion. The actual number of people with thyroid disease, therefore, is likely far higher, falling somewhere in the range of 49 million to 55 million people. At the above mentioned 1:1,000,000 ratio, 50,000,000 cases would require the population of the USA to be 50,000,000,000,000 people. Since it's not, rather then adjust the fictional ratio, the troll will attack either the doctor's credability, or your ability to understand the quote. |
#3
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Fat people
On Apr 18, 2:56*pm, The Master
wrote: On Fri, 18 Apr 2008, Ragnar wrote: I noticed you didn't deny it's probably 1 in 1 million.- Hide quoted text - "1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." This number may actually be a substantial underestimate of the actual number of people affected. Hasn't Kenny's inability to understand quotes from the doctors who conducted a medical study prove the futility of even trying? Kenny's inability to understand quotes doesn't concern me. The village idiot isn't expected to understand everything that the more intelligent members of the town do Here you are, offering a bigot troll an actual quote from a medical doctor who knows what the flip they are talking about. *However, it violates the very foundation of the troll's bigoted attatude. *As such, the troll will ignore the fact, and instead rely on their previously stated opinion. That’s right, here I am slamming it back in the bigoted troll's face. How he or she chooses to twist the evidence around is not a concern as well. It doesn’t really matter to me because in reality they cannot escape their delusional pretenses. The actual number of people with thyroid disease, therefore, is likely far higher, falling somewhere in the range of 49 million to 55 million people. At the above mentioned 1:1,000,000 ratio, 50,000,000 cases would require the population of the USA to be 50,000,000,000,000 people. *Since it's not, rather then adjust the fictional ratio, the troll will attack either the doctor's credability, or your ability to understand the quote. Well then obviously the joke is on them now isn’t it. Why worry? Fools will be fools. Ragnar |
#4
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Fat people
On Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:02:31 -0700 (PDT), Ragnar
wrote: On Apr 18, 12:33 pm, Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 18:55:13 -0600, Tiger_Lily wrote this stuff here : Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 12:25:25 -0400, Marshall Price wrote this stuff here : Naughty Boy wrote: Tiger_Lily wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in news:Z7qdnWpVRfQX9WranZ2dnUVZ_tninZ2d@eart hlink.com: Naughty Boy wrote: WaCoder wrote in : Pete wrote: Today, i would like to discuss fat people with all of you... What do we know about fat people? Other than that they are obese, i mean... Generally speaking, fat people are lazy and stupid. This is the most insulting, uninformed, prejudiced, bigoted statement I have ever heard in my life. If you had replaced "fat" with "black" or "Mexican", you would have been dismissed out of hand as a bigot, racist, stupid and not worth the time of day. But just because you're bashing fat ppl, you think you can get away with it. For shame.... Not really. Black or Mexican people had no choice as to what race they were born. Fat people do it to themselves. Is that how bariatricians explain it, or do we have to rely on you for the straight dope? How else do fat people get fat? Certainly not by being lazy or stupid. What theories do you have? let's hear them! untreated hypothyroid for 3 years because my GP didn't want to add thyroid meds to diabetes meds is that good enough for you? kate The old "thyroid" bull**** excuse. I was wondering how long it would take for that one to come up. What makes you presume to imply thyroid diseases don't exist? I can't imagine why you want to flaunt such ignorance in public. For every one million fatasses their might be ONE with some thyroid condition. Most fattys are fat because they eat too much food and do not exercise. i lost 30 lbs in the first 3 mo of synthroid treatment look up Hashimoto's and i hope YOU don't have to deal with this soon at 5'6" i have weighed 125 lbs since high school........... over 30 years ago ok, back to you on your high horse kate I noticed you didn't deny it's probably 1 in 1 million.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - "1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." This number may actually be a substantial underestimate of the actual number of people affected. According to Vahab Fatourechi, MD, of the Division of Endocrinology, Diabetes, Metabolism and Nutrition at Mayo Clinic in Rochester, if the upper limit of normal range of the TSH test were reduced from 5.0 to 3.0, as recommended by the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists and the National Academy of Clinical Biochemistry, there would be a 3-fold increase in the diagnosis of hypothyroidism. Dr. Fatourechi's estimates, which were reported in the Mayo Endocrinology Update, mean that an additional 22 million to 28 million people would be hypothyroid. The actual number of people with thyroid disease, therefore, is likely far higher, falling somewhere in the range of 49 million to 55 million people. http://thyroid.about.com/od/publicaw...7awareness.htm Possibly 49 to 55 million people are affected with some form of thyroid disease in the US alone. So out of 300 million in the US it could be approx. 20%. of the population could be affected. I'm not saying everyone with a weight issue has a thyroid problem but it does seem that there could be a lot more of them out there than one would believe. Ragnar Just going from the part you quoted above, I find it ignorant and hypocritical that you, a person who always seems to be suspicious of any information on obesity given by the medical community at large, would be wholeheartedly accepting an admitted guess about thyroid disorders from a group of people (Mayo Clinic and Endocrinologists in general) who stand to make more money the more thyroid problems they can uncover. Dr. Fatourechi wouldn't happen to be on the advisory board of any thyroid treatment producing pharmaceutical companies, would he? That is an outlandish figure that would make thyroid problems more common than colds and it is an admitted estimate, yet you choose to promote it as evidence of something. I guess any info that fits your agenda, right? Jade |
#5
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Fat people
On Apr 21, 12:04*pm, Daedalus wrote:
On Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:02:31 -0700 (PDT), Ragnar wrote: On Apr 18, 12:33 pm, Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 18:55:13 -0600, Tiger_Lily wrote this stuff here : Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 12:25:25 -0400, Marshall Price wrote this stuff here : Naughty Boy wrote: Tiger_Lily wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in news:Z7qdnWpVRfQX9WranZ2dnUVZ_tninZ2d@eart hlink.com: Naughty Boy wrote: WaCoder wrote in : Pete wrote: Today, i would like to discuss fat people with all of you.... What do we know about fat people? Other than that they are obese, i mean... Generally speaking, fat people are lazy and stupid. This is the most insulting, uninformed, prejudiced, bigoted statement I have ever heard in my life. If you had replaced "fat" with "black" or "Mexican", you would have been dismissed out of hand as a bigot, racist, stupid and not worth the time of day. But just because you're bashing fat ppl, you think you can get away with it. For shame.... Not really. Black or Mexican people had no choice as to what race they were born. Fat people do it to themselves. Is that how bariatricians explain it, or do we have to rely on you for the straight dope? How else do fat people get fat? Certainly not by being lazy or stupid. What theories do you have? let's hear them! untreated hypothyroid for 3 years because my GP didn't want to add thyroid meds to diabetes meds is that good enough for you? kate The old "thyroid" bull**** excuse. I was wondering how long it would take for that one to come up. What makes you presume to imply thyroid diseases don't exist? *I can't imagine why you want to flaunt such ignorance in public. For every one million fatasses their might be ONE with some thyroid condition. Most fattys are fat because they eat too much food and do not exercise. i lost 30 lbs in the first 3 mo of synthroid treatment look up Hashimoto's and i hope YOU don't have to deal with this soon at 5'6" i have weighed 125 lbs since high school........... over 30 years ago ok, back to you on your high horse kate I noticed you didn't deny it's probably 1 in 1 million.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - "1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." This number may actually be a substantial underestimate of the actual number of people affected. According to Vahab Fatourechi, MD, of the Division of Endocrinology, Diabetes, Metabolism and Nutrition at Mayo Clinic in Rochester, if the upper limit of normal range of the TSH test were reduced from 5.0 to 3.0, as recommended by the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists and the National Academy of Clinical Biochemistry, there would be a 3-fold increase in the diagnosis of hypothyroidism. Dr. Fatourechi's estimates, which were reported in the Mayo Endocrinology Update, mean that an additional 22 million to 28 million people would be hypothyroid. The actual number of people with thyroid disease, therefore, is likely far higher, falling somewhere in the range of 49 million to 55 million people. http://thyroid.about.com/od/publicaw...7awareness.htm Possibly 49 to 55 million people are affected with some form of thyroid disease in the US alone. So out of 300 million in the US it could be approx. 20%. of the population could be affected. I'm not saying everyone with a weight issue has a thyroid problem but it does seem that there could be a lot more of them out there than one would believe. Ragnar Just going from the part you quoted above, I find it ignorant and hypocritical that you, a person who always seems to be suspicious of any information on obesity given by the medical community at large, would be wholeheartedly accepting an admitted guess about thyroid disorders from a group of people (Mayo Clinic and Endocrinologists in general) who stand to make more money the more thyroid problems they can uncover. Jade I was only commenting on what might or might not be. I never spoke in absolutes. Please re-read. The only thing ignorant here is you bitch. Your continuous running off at the mouth is getting tiresome. My comment was directed toward the possible number of those affected by some form of thyroid disorder not the correlation between thyroid issues and obesity. If you go back and read I only suggested that the number of obese people COULD be affected with thyroid disease and never made any claims that the numbers claimed in the article were in fact hard data. In fact I do believe that the article itself states as such and only suggests that the numbers quoted could be real. I any event doctors will not treat someone for thyroid issues unless the patient is afflicted with thyroid disease so how can anyone profit from inflating the numbers. Do you think that suddenly people are just going to willingly go to their physician and get treated for diseases they don’t have? You’re an idiot and stop fishing for an argument that isn’t there. If the Mayo Clinic is trying to inflate numbers in order to receive more funding for research then so be it. You got something against healthcare R&D? It not like they are trying to push the latest diet fad or inflate the number of deaths attributed to a perticular affiction. Dr. Fatourechi wouldn't happen to be on the advisory board of any thyroid treatment producing pharmaceutical companies, would he? I don’t know and I don’t care. Maybe he just receives grant money from big pharma, most research facilities do. Are you trying to say he has a hidden agenda? Isn’t that what many members of this group have been suggesting about medical research and the diet industry? Again you seem to be laboring under the idea that I’m pushing his numbers as real hard facts. That is an outlandish figure that would make thyroid problems more common than colds and it is an admitted estimate, yet you choose to promote it as evidence of something. I guess any info that fits your agenda, right? Wrong as usual dumbass, I never claimed his numbers to be 100% factual. Show me where I made that claim. Besides you stupid fool, some forms of thyroid disease can go undiagnosed for years in individuals so real numbers are difficult to verify. Minor elevated or decreased levels of thyroid hormone can be present in people without physical symptoms of the disease being noticeable. My wife had thyroid issues for years and no one ever picked up on it because the symptoms didn’t manifest themselves readily. That being the case who really knows how many people could be affected and any proposed number can only be looked at as supposition. Does that sound like an agenda building case to you moron? Look for an argument elsewhere, you failed at finding one here. Ragnar |
#6
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Fat people
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 10:03:07 -0700 (PDT), Ragnar
wrote: On Apr 21, 12:04*pm, Daedalus wrote: On Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:02:31 -0700 (PDT), Ragnar wrote: On Apr 18, 12:33 pm, Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 18:55:13 -0600, Tiger_Lily wrote this stuff here : Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 12:25:25 -0400, Marshall Price wrote this stuff here : Naughty Boy wrote: Tiger_Lily wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in news:Z7qdnWpVRfQX9WranZ2dnUVZ_tninZ2d@eart hlink.com: Naughty Boy wrote: WaCoder wrote in : Pete wrote: Today, i would like to discuss fat people with all of you... What do we know about fat people? Other than that they are obese, i mean... Generally speaking, fat people are lazy and stupid. This is the most insulting, uninformed, prejudiced, bigoted statement I have ever heard in my life. If you had replaced "fat" with "black" or "Mexican", you would have been dismissed out of hand as a bigot, racist, stupid and not worth the time of day. But just because you're bashing fat ppl, you think you can get away with it. For shame.... Not really. Black or Mexican people had no choice as to what race they were born. Fat people do it to themselves. Is that how bariatricians explain it, or do we have to rely on you for the straight dope? How else do fat people get fat? Certainly not by being lazy or stupid. What theories do you have? let's hear them! untreated hypothyroid for 3 years because my GP didn't want to add thyroid meds to diabetes meds is that good enough for you? kate The old "thyroid" bull**** excuse. I was wondering how long it would take for that one to come up. What makes you presume to imply thyroid diseases don't exist? *I can't imagine why you want to flaunt such ignorance in public. For every one million fatasses their might be ONE with some thyroid condition. Most fattys are fat because they eat too much food and do not exercise. i lost 30 lbs in the first 3 mo of synthroid treatment look up Hashimoto's and i hope YOU don't have to deal with this soon at 5'6" i have weighed 125 lbs since high school........... over 30 years ago ok, back to you on your high horse kate I noticed you didn't deny it's probably 1 in 1 million.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - "1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." This number may actually be a substantial underestimate of the actual number of people affected. According to Vahab Fatourechi, MD, of the Division of Endocrinology, Diabetes, Metabolism and Nutrition at Mayo Clinic in Rochester, if the upper limit of normal range of the TSH test were reduced from 5.0 to 3.0, as recommended by the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists and the National Academy of Clinical Biochemistry, there would be a 3-fold increase in the diagnosis of hypothyroidism. Dr. Fatourechi's estimates, which were reported in the Mayo Endocrinology Update, mean that an additional 22 million to 28 million people would be hypothyroid. The actual number of people with thyroid disease, therefore, is likely far higher, falling somewhere in the range of 49 million to 55 million people. http://thyroid.about.com/od/publicaw...7awareness.htm Possibly 49 to 55 million people are affected with some form of thyroid disease in the US alone. So out of 300 million in the US it could be approx. 20%. of the population could be affected. I'm not saying everyone with a weight issue has a thyroid problem but it does seem that there could be a lot more of them out there than one would believe. Ragnar Just going from the part you quoted above, I find it ignorant and hypocritical that you, a person who always seems to be suspicious of any information on obesity given by the medical community at large, would be wholeheartedly accepting an admitted guess about thyroid disorders from a group of people (Mayo Clinic and Endocrinologists in general) who stand to make more money the more thyroid problems they can uncover. Jade I was only commenting on what might or might not be. I never spoke in absolutes. You missed the point, dip****, or rather you're avoiding it. If someone posted an AMA article "estimating" that 50% of fat people will die early from cancer, you'd be pitching a fit over the diet industry's ownership of the medical community and any other reason you could think of to doubt the truth of it. Yet here you are posting something equally questionable and calling it a viable possibility. Hy-Po-Crite. Please re-read. The only thing ignorant here is you bitch. Your continuous running off at the mouth is getting tiresome. Hypocrite My comment was directed toward the possible number of those affected by some form of thyroid disorder not the correlation between thyroid issues and obesity. I never said you were relating it. See above. That is undoubtedly where this discussion was headed however. If you go back and read I only suggested that the number of obese people COULD be affected with thyroid disease and never made any claims that the numbers claimed in the article were in fact hard data. But it is a viable possiblity in your mind, because this one fits your agenda. In fact I do believe that the article itself states as such and only suggests that the numbers quoted could be real. Not only that. They go on to ridiculously state that the numbers could only be real if they changed the definition of what a thyroid disorder was. I clearly understood this when I wrote my post which you did not get at all. I any event doctors will not treat someone for thyroid issues unless the patient is afflicted with thyroid disease so how can anyone profit from inflating the numbers. Are you serious? Do you think that suddenly people are just going to willingly go to their physician and get treated for diseases they don’t have? Of course they are. It happens all the time. That's how the ADD industry came to be a booming business. It makes it much easier when they change the definition of thyroid problems. You’re an idiot and stop fishing for an argument that isn’t there. Actually, that's what you were setting up to do. I'm calling you on it. If the Mayo Clinic is trying to inflate numbers in order to receive more funding for research then so be it. And if inflated numbers help you argue with people on usenet, then who cares if it is real data or a guess? You got something against healthcare R&D? It not like they are trying to push the latest diet fad or inflate the number of deaths attributed to a perticular affiction. It is exactly like that, dummy. Guess where much of the R&D money comes from? And guess who benefits from the R&D money they spend - You're still not getting it, are you? Dr. Fatourechi wouldn't happen to be on the advisory board of any thyroid treatment producing pharmaceutical companies, would he? I don’t know and I don’t care. So you post questionable information to prove a point on usenet and admit not caring whether it is completely inaccurate or even intentionally perverted? Some integrity you got there. Maybe he just receives grant money from big pharma, most research facilities do. And theyare usually pressured to pay it back in new drug patents or in research data that supports the business. That is the only reason that grant money is ever given. Are you trying to say he has a hidden agenda? I don't know, but unlike you, I care to know. Isn’t that what many members of this group have been suggesting about medical research and the diet industry? LOLOLOLOL! Jesus ****ing Christ! the monkey and the keyboard axiom comes to life. You didn't read my post at all, did you? Again you seem to be laboring under the idea that I’m pushing his numbers as real hard facts. Nope. Your protobrain once again imported thoughts that never appeared on usenet. Please reread what I posted. You will look far less like a fool next time you respond to me. That is an outlandish figure that would make thyroid problems more common than colds and it is an admitted estimate, yet you choose to promote it as evidence of something. I guess any info that fits your agenda, right? Wrong as usual dumbass, I never claimed his numbers to be 100% factual. Show me where I made that claim. You presented the estimates as evidence, Ragnar. You felt that they proved there was a possibility of massive thyroid epidemics or you would not have posted them. People don't post things they think are wrong in an argument, even people as stupid as you. Besides you stupid fool, some forms of thyroid disease can go undiagnosed for years in individuals so real numbers are difficult to verify. No ****. That's why making an estimate that one in six people has one is pretty ****ing ridiculous. Doing a good job here tearing apart your own post. Do you still think that the good Dr's estimate is a viable possiblity? Minor elevated or decreased levels of thyroid hormone can be present in people without physical symptoms of the disease being noticeable. My wife had thyroid issues for years and no one ever picked up on it because the symptoms didn’t manifest themselves readily. That being the case who really knows how many people could be affected and any proposed number can only be looked at as supposition. Nobody knows. Yet you posted it as though it meant something. Does that sound like an agenda building case to you moron? Look for an argument elsewhere, you failed at finding one here. oops. Guess you got me there. lol hypocrite. Jade |
#7
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Fat people
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008, Daedalus wrote:
"1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." You missed the point, dip****, or rather you're avoiding it. If someone posted an AMA article "estimating" that 50% of fat people will die early from cancer, you'd be pitching a fit over the diet industry's ownership of the medical community and any other reason you could think of to doubt the truth of it. Yet here you are posting something equally questionable and calling it a viable possibility. Hy-Po-Crite. How many people are diagnosed with hypothyroid? Rather then using the 49 million "revised estimate", is the 27 million by "current standard" accepted? If we assume the real value is 20 million, and only half are diagnosed, that would be 10 million have been diagnosed. Is that about correct? 10 million diagnosed, assuming a 50/50 split for hypo vrs hyper, that leaves 5 million diagnosed with hypothyroidism. Is that a figure that is agreed upon? My comment was directed toward the possible number of those affected by some form of thyroid disorder not the correlation between thyroid issues and obesity. I never said you were relating it. See above. That is undoubtedly where this discussion was headed however. Well, someone that shall remain nameless has said that the ratio of hypothiroidism to normal is 1 out of 1 million. So, doing the math... 5 million americans with hypo, times the 1 million ratio... That would require the United States Population to be 5 trillion. What's the population of the United States again? For that matter, what's the population of the entire world? I do believe the 1:1 million ratio is a tad off. |
#8
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Fat people
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 18:10:43 +0000, The Master
wrote: On Mon, 21 Apr 2008, Daedalus wrote: "1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." You missed the point, dip****, or rather you're avoiding it. If someone posted an AMA article "estimating" that 50% of fat people will die early from cancer, you'd be pitching a fit over the diet industry's ownership of the medical community and any other reason you could think of to doubt the truth of it. Yet here you are posting something equally questionable and calling it a viable possibility. Hy-Po-Crite. How many people are diagnosed with hypothyroid? Rather then using the 49 million "revised estimate", is the 27 million by "current standard" accepted? If we assume the real value is 20 million, and only half are diagnosed, that would be 10 million have been diagnosed. Is that about correct? 10 million diagnosed, assuming a 50/50 split for hypo vrs hyper, that leaves 5 million diagnosed with hypothyroidism. Is that a figure that is agreed upon? I don't know. My argument here is only that Ragnar is a hypocrite. My comment was directed toward the possible number of those affected by some form of thyroid disorder not the correlation between thyroid issues and obesity. I never said you were relating it. See above. That is undoubtedly where this discussion was headed however. Well, someone that shall remain nameless has said that the ratio of hypothiroidism to normal is 1 out of 1 million. So, doing the math... 5 million americans with hypo, times the 1 million ratio... That would require the United States Population to be 5 trillion. What's the population of the United States again? For that matter, what's the population of the entire world? I do believe the 1:1 million ratio is a tad off. 1 in a million is a ridiculous figure if taken literally. I think the poster who said that figuratively meant that people who were obese due to thyroid problems were very rare. I would agree with that. My point, once again, was that Ragnar tried to rebut the poster with specious medical claims when he has a history of railing against what he considers to be specious medical claims. Jade |
#9
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Fat people
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008, Daedalus wrote:
1 in a million is a ridiculous figure if taken literally. I think the poster who said that figuratively meant that people who were obese due to thyroid problems were very rare. I would agree with that. Quite possibly. And if you want to address it like that, I'll accept it. My point, once again, was that Ragnar tried to rebut the poster with specious medical claims when he has a history of railing against what he considers to be specious medical claims. Carry on with your flame war. |
#10
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Fat people
On Apr 21, 1:46*pm, Daedalus wrote:
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 10:03:07 -0700 (PDT), Ragnar wrote: On Apr 21, 12:04*pm, Daedalus wrote: On Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:02:31 -0700 (PDT), Ragnar wrote: On Apr 18, 12:33 pm, Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 18:55:13 -0600, Tiger_Lily wrote this stuff here : Always Learning wrote: On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 12:25:25 -0400, Marshall Price wrote this stuff here : Naughty Boy wrote: Tiger_Lily wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in : Naughty Boy wrote: Marshall Price wrote in news:Z7qdnWpVRfQX9WranZ2dnUVZ_tninZ2d@eart hlink.com: Naughty Boy wrote: WaCoder wrote in : Pete wrote: Today, i would like to discuss fat people with all of you... What do we know about fat people? Other than that they are obese, i mean... Generally speaking, fat people are lazy and stupid. This is the most insulting, uninformed, prejudiced, bigoted statement I have ever heard in my life. If you had replaced "fat" with "black" or "Mexican", you would have been dismissed out of hand as a bigot, racist, stupid and not worth the time of day. But just because you're bashing fat ppl, you think you can get away with it. For shame.... Not really. Black or Mexican people had no choice as to what race they were born. Fat people do it to themselves. Is that how bariatricians explain it, or do we have to rely on you for the straight dope? How else do fat people get fat? Certainly not by being lazy or stupid. What theories do you have? let's hear them! untreated hypothyroid for 3 years because my GP didn't want to add thyroid meds to diabetes meds is that good enough for you? kate The old "thyroid" bull**** excuse. I was wondering how long it would take for that one to come up. What makes you presume to imply thyroid diseases don't exist? *I can't imagine why you want to flaunt such ignorance in public. For every one million fatasses their might be ONE with some thyroid condition. Most fattys are fat because they eat too much food and do not exercise. i lost 30 lbs in the first 3 mo of synthroid treatment look up Hashimoto's and i hope YOU don't have to deal with this soon at 5'6" i have weighed 125 lbs since high school........... over 30 years ago ok, back to you on your high horse kate I noticed you didn't deny it's probably 1 in 1 million.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - "1.) Up to 27 million Americans may be affected by thyroid disorders, although more than half remain undiagnosed." This number may actually be a substantial underestimate of the actual number of people affected. According to Vahab Fatourechi, MD, of the Division of Endocrinology, Diabetes, Metabolism and Nutrition at Mayo Clinic in Rochester, if the upper limit of normal range of the TSH test were reduced from 5.0 to 3.0, as recommended by the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists and the National Academy of Clinical Biochemistry, there would be a 3-fold increase in the diagnosis of hypothyroidism. Dr. Fatourechi's estimates, which were reported in the Mayo Endocrinology Update, mean that an additional 22 million to 28 million people would be hypothyroid. The actual number of people with thyroid disease, therefore, is likely far higher, falling somewhere in the range of 49 million to 55 million people. http://thyroid.about.com/od/publicaw...7awareness.htm Possibly 49 to 55 million people are affected with some form of thyroid disease in the US alone. So out of 300 million in the US it could be approx. 20%. of the population could be affected. I'm not saying everyone with a weight issue has a thyroid problem but it does seem that there could be a lot more of them out there than one would believe. Ragnar Just going from the part you quoted above, I find it ignorant and hypocritical that you, a person who always seems to be suspicious of any information on obesity given by the medical community at large, would be wholeheartedly accepting an admitted guess about thyroid disorders from a group of people (Mayo Clinic and Endocrinologists in general) who stand to make more money the more thyroid problems they can uncover. Jade I was only commenting on what might or might not be. I never spoke in absolutes. You missed the point, dip****, or rather you're avoiding it. If someone posted an AMA article "estimating" that 50% of fat people will die early from cancer, you'd be pitching a fit over the diet industry's ownership of the medical community and any other reason you could think of to doubt the truth of it. Yet here you are posting something equally questionable and calling it a viable possibility. Hy-Po-Crite. You missed the entire point asswipe; I only presented some an article that may have shed some light on what a poster was questioning. The “always learning” stated something to the effect that thyroid disorders only affect 1 in a million people. I present some numbers that contradicted his or her ludicrous claims. I never presented them as completely undeniably factual. Do you have supportable numbers to the contrary, I’d love to see them? Besides dumbass show me where I ever pitched a fit over cancer rates and a supposed correlation to obesity. People post inflammatory articles that at times even contradict each other and you rarely see me making statement as you claim I do. You obviously are still fishing for an argument. Is your life that lacking for entertainment? You pathetic piece of ****. What’s the matter you ugly slob? Still can’t get laid on the weekends? Please re-read. The only thing ignorant here is you bitch. Your continuous running off at the mouth is getting tiresome. Hypocrite Idiot My comment was directed toward the possible number of those affected by some form of thyroid disorder not the correlation between thyroid issues and obesity. I never said you were relating it. See above. That is undoubtedly where this discussion was headed however. Okay, now Jade can read minds. Got anymore tricks for us dumbass? HEY EVERYBODY JADES SHOWING OFF HER POWERS OF CLAIRVOYANCE! COME SEE THE SHOW! What’s next, communication with the dead? You really are a presumptuous ass. If you go back and read I only suggested that the number of obese people COULD be affected with thyroid disease and never made any claims that the numbers claimed in the article were in fact hard data. But it is a viable possiblity in your mind, because this one fits your agenda. Viable or not, it is a possibility just like it might not be. I can’t say for certain, nor can you. But you do seem to think that the numbers are bogus so why don’t you set me straight and produce some more accurate numbers that are verifiable. In fact I do believe that the article itself states as such and only suggests that the numbers quoted could be real. Not only that. They go on to ridiculously state that the numbers could only be real if they changed the definition of what a thyroid disorder was. The article suggests lowering the upper limit of the TSH test from . 05 to 5 down to .03 to 3 as recommended by the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists and the National Academy of Clinical Biochemistry. But it doesn’t give a reason why. So commenting on that is irrelevant. You have no clue regarding the reasoning behind the testing threshold so you are not qualified to dispute it. I clearly understood this when I wrote my post which you did not get at all. * More of Jade’s circle jerk bull**** noted. You clearly recognized nothing of the sort in your pitiful attempt at an argument. I any event doctors will not treat someone for thyroid issues unless the patient is afflicted with thyroid disease so how can anyone profit from inflating the numbers. Are you serious? Yes very, a miss or false diagnosis of thyroid disease can lead to serious health complications or even death. No competent doctor would take that kind of chance, so providing inflated study numbers translates to nothing in the real world. Do you think that suddenly people are just going to willingly go to their physician and get treated for diseases they don’t have? Of course they are. It happens all the time. That's how the ADD industry came to be a booming business. It makes it much easier when they change the definition of thyroid problems. ADHD and thyroid are very different issues. Diagnosing thyroid disease requires lab blood analysis and as I stated before a misdiagnosis of a thyroid issue can lead to serious health consequences VERY rapidly. In other words provide a bad diagnosis and prescribe the wrong meds and the patient can die. While ADHD only requires sociological profiling of the suspected individual and the meds prescribed do not carry the same health risks. Prescribing the wrong meds for a thyroid issue can be just as deadly as prescribing the wrong heart medication for a person that doesn’t need it. Maybe you should brush up on thyroid disease and the meds provide for such diseases before you make anymore ludicrous statement and embarrass your self further. You are a certifiable idiot. You obviously know nothing about hypo or hyperthyroidism and what constitutes the disease. You’re an idiot and stop fishing for an argument that isn’t there. Actually, that's what you were setting up to do. I'm calling you on it. Yeah okay you are privy to what’s in my head. LOL. If the Mayo Clinic is trying to inflate numbers in order to receive more funding for research then so be it. And if inflated numbers help you argue with people on usenet, then who cares if it is real data or a guess? You still haven't proven that the numbers are inflated and I wasn’t arguing, that point seems to escape you constantly. You got something against healthcare R&D? It not like they are trying to push the latest diet fad or inflate the number of deaths attributed to a perticular affiction. It is exactly like that, dummy. Guess where much of the R&D money comes from? And guess who benefits from the R&D money they spend - You're still not getting it, are you? Everyone benefits that’s how it works. Pharmaceuticals make money and those afflicted with the disease get a cure or a way to control their affliction. If you think it works any other way then you are obviously paranoid delusional. It matters not the motive. Dr. Fatourechi wouldn't happen to be on the advisory board of any thyroid treatment producing pharmaceutical companies, would he? I don’t know and I don’t care. So you post questionable information to prove a point on usenet and admit not caring whether it is completely inaccurate or even intentionally perverted? Some integrity you got there. So you can’t disprove the numbers so you attack the integrity of the poster and the data provided, how typical of you Jade. Look at it this way, if integrity was what I was after I would be dignifying you with a response now would I? Maybe he just receives grant money from big pharma, most research facilities do. And theyare usually pressured to pay it back in new drug patents or in research data that supports the business. That is the only reason that grant money is ever given. So you are saying that all grant supported medical research is tainted? Are you trying to say he has a hidden agenda? I don't know, but unlike you, I care to know. Yeah of course you do. Why don’t you investigate and report back to me plebe. Isn’t that what many members of this group have been suggesting about medical research and the diet industry? LOLOLOLOL! Jesus ****ing Christ! the monkey and the keyboard axiom comes to life. You didn't read my post at all, did you? Frankly Jade your posts get so predictable that reading them becomes a matter of wading through bull**** and never getting anything conclusive. Again you seem to be laboring under the idea that I’m pushing his numbers as real hard facts. Nope. Your protobrain once again imported thoughts that never appeared on usenet. Please reread what I posted. You will look far less like a fool next time you respond to me. Then what is your point you mean you haven’t been attacking me for posting unverifiable data and claiming it is for real? Did you spew so much bull**** that you forget your own argument? LOL. That is an outlandish figure that would make thyroid problems more common than colds and it is an admitted estimate, yet you choose to promote it as evidence of something. I guess any info that fits your agenda, right? Wrong as usual dumbass, I never claimed his numbers to be 100% factual. Show me where I made that claim. You presented the estimates as evidence, Ragnar. You felt that they proved there was a possibility of massive thyroid epidemics or you would not have posted them. People don't post things they think are wrong in an argument, even people as stupid as you. I never said the number were right or wrong. I only wanted to illustrate that the 1 in a million figure posted by “always learning” was in all likelihood a trolls fabrication much like your current argument. So you think the numbers are bogus? Well they could very well be but don’t make assumptions on what I think they are. I’ve already stated that they may or may not be true but one thing is certain the numbers are a lot higher than 1 in a million as “always learning” was trying to claim. Since you claim to be so concerned why don’t you counter those supposedly bogus numbers with the real data? I would also like to see it. My own stance on this issue has never been one of absolutes as you have claimed it is. I’m still waiting for you to show me where I came out and endorsed the quoted numbers as 100% factual. I would suspect that even a bright bulb like you would be hard pressed to prove that. Besides you stupid fool, some forms of thyroid disease can go undiagnosed for years in individuals so real numbers are difficult to verify. No ****. That's why making an estimate that one in six people has one is pretty ****ing ridiculous. Doing a good job here tearing apart your own post. Do you still think that the good Dr's estimate is a viable possiblity? Idiot, since you claim the numbers are essentially unverifiable then claiming a 1 in 6 ratio is a possibility until disproved with provable data. I don’t really care how ridiculous it looks to you. Prove the numbers wrong then open your maw. Minor elevated or decreased levels of thyroid hormone can be present in people without physical symptoms of the disease being noticeable. My wife had thyroid issues for years and no one ever picked up on it because the symptoms didn’t manifest themselves readily. That being the case who really knows how many people could be affected and any proposed number can only be looked at as supposition. Nobody knows. Yet you posted it as though it meant something. So did the doctor that claims the numbers to be true. I still haven’t seen anything out of you to the contrary other than your arguably unqualified opinion. Does that sound like an agenda building case to you moron? Look for an argument elsewhere, you failed at finding one here. oops. Guess you got me there. lol I’m glad we can agree ****stick. Now run along and find the supportable contrary data that you are so concerned about before I am forced to kick you in that rotten **** of yours again. hypocrite. Hypocrite? Do you even know the meaning of the word? Ragnar |
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