Why MUST I drink lots of water on low carb?

I always just figured it kept your stomach full. When your stomach is
full, then you don't want to eat as much.

[They've said that small children who drink too much juice and do not eat
enough food can actually be malnourished because they aren't hungry, and
thus don't eat, since, unlike most of us, small children don't like to
extend their stomachs just because it happens to taste good.]

Anyway, so why wouldn't it work for us older people, only in
reverse...keep our stomachs so full of water or other sugar free liquids
that we don't want to eat as much because the stomach is already full.

For me, it didn't have to be water. I managed to lose 50+ lbs without
drinking water...unfortunately...I used Diet Coke.

Becky P.

Martin W. Smith wrote:
:: "Roger Zoul" wrote:
::
::: Martin W. Smith wrote:
::::: "John E" wrote:
:::::
:::::: Hi folks,
::::::
:::::: I heard on TV that you must remain VERY hydrated, i.e. drink
:::::: lots and lots of water when you are in Ketosis. They guy
:::::: gave no reason.
::::::
:::::: Can somoene please explain the detailed reason behind it?
::::::
:::::: Does being-hydrated help you lose weight faster?
:::::: Does it give you energy so you won't give up?
:::::: Or is it a necessity so you won't develop kidney problems
:::::: because that organ HATES ketone concentration.
::::::
:::::: Your help is appreciated,
:::::
::::: One reason is related to the exercise component. The body normally
::::: stores glycogen in and around the muscles. Glycogen is one part
::::: carb and four parts water. It is fuel that can be burned quickly,
::::: when the muscles are called on to work hard. If you are doing the
::::: exercise component of Atkins properly, ie lots of exercise daily,
::::: then especially during the weight loss phases, your body will
::::: normally be depleted of glycogen and so will have much less
::::: stored water. Drinking all this extra water helps keep the level
::::: up to where it would normally be if you were eating more carbs.
::::: It is especially important if you are training hard.
:::
::: So if there is little glycogen, how can the muscle be holding water?
::
:: It isn't holding nearly as much. That's the point. You have to keep
:: drinking.
::
::: You
::: can guzzle all the water you want, but the water will just flow
::: through and it won't stored in the muscles with glycogen if you're
::: exercising and restricting carbs.
::
:: The drinking isn't for storing the water. The drinking is for
:: ensuring water is there for the processes that need it, because they
:: can't get enough of it by burning glycogen, when there isn't much
:: glycogen to be burned.

But a LCer can drink all the water in the world, but since the carbs are low
there will be little glycogen for water to bind to, hence it won't be stored
in and around muscle tissue and in the liver. That water weight can only be
replaced by upping the carbs or eating enough protein to get glycogen stores
refilled as a result of conversion. Water can be other places in the
body....

::
:: When you try your first century without drinking water, you will see
:: what I mean. You probably won't reach the finish line.

You don't think I'd try a century without drinking water, do you? I won't
even do 20 miles without water.

curious wrote:
:: I always just figured it kept your stomach full. When your stomach
:: is full, then you don't want to eat as much.
::
:: [They've said that small children who drink too much juice and do
:: not eat enough food can actually be malnourished because they aren't
:: hungry, and thus don't eat, since, unlike most of us, small children
:: don't like to extend their stomachs just because it happens to taste
:: good.]
::
:: Anyway, so why wouldn't it work for us older people, only in
:: reverse...keep our stomachs so full of water or other sugar free
:: liquids that we don't want to eat as much because the stomach is
:: already full.

I recently fasted for 36 hours. I would drink liquid every time I felt
hungry. However, the pangs would return quickly, even though they never
increased in intensity. I don't think drinking water is any real substitute
for food. Also, liquids seem to empty out of the stomach very, very
quickly.

::
:: For me, it didn't have to be water. I managed to lose 50+ lbs without
:: drinking water...unfortunately...I used Diet Coke.
::

What's so unfortunate about that?

DJ Delorie wrote:
:: "Jim Bard" writes:
::: Drink all the water you can handle.
::
:: Advice I saw elsewhere (Lyle, I think) was that you should drink
:: enough water to have 4-5 clear urinations per day. That ensures that
:: you're fully hydrated without drinking more than is needed and
:: overtaxing (maybe) your kidneys.

Yes, that's Lyle's advice.

::
:: Me, I just keep a 2 liter bottle in the fridge and refill it each
:: night.

"Roger Zoul" wrote:

Martin W. Smith wrote:
:: "Roger Zoul" wrote:
::
::: Martin W. Smith wrote:
::::: "John E" wrote:
:::::
:::::: Hi folks,
::::::
:::::: I heard on TV that you must remain VERY hydrated, i.e. drink
:::::: lots and lots of water when you are in Ketosis. They guy
:::::: gave no reason.
::::::
:::::: Can somoene please explain the detailed reason behind it?
::::::
:::::: Does being-hydrated help you lose weight faster?
:::::: Does it give you energy so you won't give up?
:::::: Or is it a necessity so you won't develop kidney problems
:::::: because that organ HATES ketone concentration.
::::::
:::::: Your help is appreciated,
:::::
::::: One reason is related to the exercise component. The body normally
::::: stores glycogen in and around the muscles. Glycogen is one part
::::: carb and four parts water. It is fuel that can be burned quickly,
::::: when the muscles are called on to work hard. If you are doing the
::::: exercise component of Atkins properly, ie lots of exercise daily,
::::: then especially during the weight loss phases, your body will
::::: normally be depleted of glycogen and so will have much less
::::: stored water. Drinking all this extra water helps keep the level
::::: up to where it would normally be if you were eating more carbs.
::::: It is especially important if you are training hard.
:::
::: So if there is little glycogen, how can the muscle be holding water?
::
:: It isn't holding nearly as much. That's the point. You have to keep
:: drinking.
::
::: You
::: can guzzle all the water you want, but the water will just flow
::: through and it won't stored in the muscles with glycogen if you're
::: exercising and restricting carbs.
::
:: The drinking isn't for storing the water. The drinking is for
:: ensuring water is there for the processes that need it, because they
:: can't get enough of it by burning glycogen, when there isn't much
:: glycogen to be burned.

But a LCer can drink all the water in the world, but since the carbs are low
there will be little glycogen for water to bind to, hence it won't be stored
in and around muscle tissue and in the liver. That water weight can only be
replaced by upping the carbs or eating enough protein to get glycogen stores
refilled as a result of conversion. Water can be other places in the
body....

That's right, but that's why drinking water is so important for an
athlete on a low-carb diet. I'm not talking about replacing water
weight. I'm talking about ensuring that sufficient water is available
when it is needed.

:: When you try your first century without drinking water, you will see
:: what I mean. You probably won't reach the finish line.

You don't think I'd try a century without drinking water, do you? I won't
even do 20 miles without water.

Good, but on a full glycogen load, I can go hard for two hours
without drinking water, with no ill effects or drop in performance.
That's much further than 20 miles. When I am low-carbing, I can't go
anywhere near that long without drinking.

What is better for you, I'm sure, and costs a lot less, but for me, the
taste of Diet Coke helped me not miss all that sugary foods.

Becky P.

I am among those that think the water thing is overdone. I have
maintained a 60 lb. loss on Atkins, and normally drink 1 quart of
water daily. The only exception would be if I am very active or in
very hot conditions, then I adjust accordingly.

Initially, I drank a gallon daily. It seemed I was constantly downing
pints of water, as well as continuously running to the washroom. I
was also getting up in the middle of the night to go, something I had
never done before (and don't do since I have cut back).

I think people hear that drinking a quart of water (or whatever) is a
good habit, so they figure if a quart is good then a gallon must be
fantastic. I'm sure they also feel that it keeps them full, something
not really necessary on Atkins. Just eat some fat and you'll feel
full.

I also found that when I overdid the water consumption, especially
during meals, that I got some stomach pain. I was frequently drinking
a quart of water with a large meal, which common sense should have
told me was too much.

Overdoing a good thing is not necessarily a good thing.

Martin W. Smith wrote:
:: "Roger Zoul" wrote:
::
::: Martin W. Smith wrote:
::::: "Roger Zoul" wrote:
:::::
:::::: Martin W. Smith wrote:
:::::::: "John E" wrote:
::::::::
::::::::: Hi folks,
:::::::::
::::::::: I heard on TV that you must remain VERY hydrated, i.e. drink
::::::::: lots and lots of water when you are in Ketosis. They guy
::::::::: gave no reason.
:::::::::
::::::::: Can somoene please explain the detailed reason behind it?
:::::::::
::::::::: Does being-hydrated help you lose weight faster?
::::::::: Does it give you energy so you won't give up?
::::::::: Or is it a necessity so you won't develop kidney problems
::::::::: because that organ HATES ketone concentration.
:::::::::
::::::::: Your help is appreciated,
::::::::
:::::::: One reason is related to the exercise component. The body
:::::::: normally stores glycogen in and around the muscles. Glycogen
:::::::: is one part carb and four parts water. It is fuel that can be
:::::::: burned quickly, when the muscles are called on to work hard.
:::::::: If you are doing the exercise component of Atkins properly, ie
:::::::: lots of exercise daily, then especially during the weight loss
:::::::: phases, your body will normally be depleted of glycogen and so
:::::::: will have much less stored water. Drinking all this extra
:::::::: water helps keep the level up to where it would normally be if
:::::::: you were eating more carbs. It is especially important if you
:::::::: are training hard.
::::::
:::::: So if there is little glycogen, how can the muscle be holding
:::::: water?
:::::
::::: It isn't holding nearly as much. That's the point. You have to
::::: keep drinking.
:::::
:::::: You
:::::: can guzzle all the water you want, but the water will just flow
:::::: through and it won't stored in the muscles with glycogen if
:::::: you're exercising and restricting carbs.
:::::
::::: The drinking isn't for storing the water. The drinking is for
::::: ensuring water is there for the processes that need it, because
::::: they can't get enough of it by burning glycogen, when there isn't
::::: much glycogen to be burned.
:::
::: But a LCer can drink all the water in the world, but since the
::: carbs are low there will be little glycogen for water to bind to,
::: hence it won't be stored in and around muscle tissue and in the
::: liver. That water weight can only be replaced by upping the carbs
::: or eating enough protein to get glycogen stores refilled as a
::: result of conversion. Water can be other places in the body....
::
:: That's right, but that's why drinking water is so important for an
:: athlete on a low-carb diet. I'm not talking about replacing water
:: weight. I'm talking about ensuring that sufficient water is available
:: when it is needed.

Sure....everyone needs sufficient water and low-carbers are no different.

::
::::: When you try your first century without drinking water, you will
::::: see what I mean. You probably won't reach the finish line.
:::
::: You don't think I'd try a century without drinking water, do you?
::: I won't even do 20 miles without water.
::
:: Good, but on a full glycogen load, I can go hard for two hours
:: without drinking water, with no ill effects or drop in performance.
:: That's much further than 20 miles. When I am low-carbing, I can't go
:: anywhere near that long without drinking.

Well, one thing about low-carbing is the loss of electrolytes like sodium,
potassium, and magnesium due to ketosis. So, when you're glycogen loaded
you won't have a deficiency in these and your muscles have glycogen, so you
can tap type 2 fibers more to enable you to go hard. On low carb, you're
deplete of all of these (electrolytes and gylcogen), so going hard will be,
er, hard. You can get muscle cramps and not have much of an attitude for
going hard. I think this occurs regards of how much water one drinks,
provided one has enough. I don't see what extra water will do if you're low
on electrolytes and gylcogen and that impairing exercise ability.

Your argument is that a LCer needs more water because water is lost in and
around muscles due to depleted glycogen stores. But just drinking more
water while LCing doesn't replenish that water - no matter how much you
drink. The water will just pass through.

The bottom line: I think one's water needs will be the same whether LCing or
not. Lyle's suggestion of 4 to 5 clear pees per day seems like the best
advice on water consumption. Electrolyte supplementation may be necessary,
however, for the LCing athlete.

As far as dieting goes, almost every diet book in existence recommends
drinking ****loads of water. It has been shown repeatedly that this
recommendation is baseless in fact. But if you have some citations
somewhere that says that LCers NEED more water because of restricted carbs,
please pass that on.

Just for the heck of it, though, i'm going to gorge on water before my
Thursday AM ride, which I will do while LCing (I've done this before, BTW).
I'm sure I'll be uncomfortable with a belly full of water while riding up
the first hill.

Martin W. Smith wrote:
:: "Roger Zoul" wrote:
::
::: Martin W. Smith wrote:
::::: "Roger Zoul" wrote:
:::::
:::::: Martin W. Smith wrote:
:::::::: "John E" wrote:
::::::::
::::::::: Hi folks,
:::::::::
::::::::: I heard on TV that you must remain VERY hydrated, i.e. drink
::::::::: lots and lots of water when you are in Ketosis. They guy
::::::::: gave no reason.
:::::::::
::::::::: Can somoene please explain the detailed reason behind it?
:::::::::
::::::::: Does being-hydrated help you lose weight faster?
::::::::: Does it give you energy so you won't give up?
::::::::: Or is it a necessity so you won't develop kidney problems
::::::::: because that organ HATES ketone concentration.
:::::::::
::::::::: Your help is appreciated,
::::::::
:::::::: One reason is related to the exercise component. The body
:::::::: normally stores glycogen in and around the muscles. Glycogen
:::::::: is one part carb and four parts water. It is fuel that can be
:::::::: burned quickly, when the muscles are called on to work hard.
:::::::: If you are doing the exercise component of Atkins properly, ie
:::::::: lots of exercise daily, then especially during the weight loss
:::::::: phases, your body will normally be depleted of glycogen and so
:::::::: will have much less stored water. Drinking all this extra
:::::::: water helps keep the level up to where it would normally be if
:::::::: you were eating more carbs. It is especially important if you
:::::::: are training hard.
::::::
:::::: So if there is little glycogen, how can the muscle be holding
:::::: water?
:::::
::::: It isn't holding nearly as much. That's the point. You have to
::::: keep drinking.
:::::
:::::: You
:::::: can guzzle all the water you want, but the water will just flow
:::::: through and it won't stored in the muscles with glycogen if
:::::: you're exercising and restricting carbs.
:::::
::::: The drinking isn't for storing the water. The drinking is for
::::: ensuring water is there for the processes that need it, because
::::: they can't get enough of it by burning glycogen, when there isn't
::::: much glycogen to be burned.
:::
::: But a LCer can drink all the water in the world, but since the
::: carbs are low there will be little glycogen for water to bind to,
::: hence it won't be stored in and around muscle tissue and in the
::: liver. That water weight can only be replaced by upping the carbs
::: or eating enough protein to get glycogen stores refilled as a
::: result of conversion. Water can be other places in the body....
::
:: That's right, but that's why drinking water is so important for an
:: athlete on a low-carb diet. I'm not talking about replacing water
:: weight. I'm talking about ensuring that sufficient water is available
:: when it is needed.

Sure....everyone needs sufficient water and low-carbers are no different.

::
::::: When you try your first century without drinking water, you will
::::: see what I mean. You probably won't reach the finish line.
:::
::: You don't think I'd try a century without drinking water, do you?
::: I won't even do 20 miles without water.
::
:: Good, but on a full glycogen load, I can go hard for two hours
:: without drinking water, with no ill effects or drop in performance.
:: That's much further than 20 miles. When I am low-carbing, I can't go
:: anywhere near that long without drinking.

Well, one thing about low-carbing is the loss of electrolytes like sodium,
potassium, and magnesium due to ketosis. So, when you're glycogen loaded
you won't have a deficiency in these and your muscles have glycogen, so you
can tap type 2 fibers more to enable you to go hard. On low carb, you're
deplete of all of these (electrolytes and gylcogen), so going hard will be,
er, hard. You can get muscle cramps and not have much of an attitude for
going hard. I think this occurs regards of how much water one drinks,
provided one has enough. I don't see what extra water will do if you're low
on electrolytes and gylcogen and that impairing exercise ability.

Your argument is that a LCer needs more water because water is lost in and
around muscles due to depleted glycogen stores. But just drinking more
water while LCing doesn't replenish that water - no matter how much you
drink. The water will just pass through.

The bottom line: I think one's water needs will be the same whether LCing or
not. Lyle's suggestion of 4 to 5 clear pees per day seems like the best
advice on water consumption. Electrolyte supplementation may be necessary,
however, for the LCing athlete.

As far as dieting goes, almost every diet book in existence recommends
drinking ****loads of water. It has been shown repeatedly that this
recommendation is baseless in fact. But if you have some citations
somewhere that says that LCers NEED more water because of restricted carbs,
please pass that on.

Just for the heck of it, though, i'm going to gorge on water before my
Thursday AM ride, which I will do while LCing (I've done this before, BTW).
I'm sure I'll be uncomfortable with a belly full of water while riding up
the first hill.

TAD wrote:
:: I am among those that think the water thing is overdone. I have
:: maintained a 60 lb. loss on Atkins, and normally drink 1 quart of
:: water daily. The only exception would be if I am very active or in
:: very hot conditions, then I adjust accordingly.
::
:: Initially, I drank a gallon daily. It seemed I was constantly
:: downing pints of water, as well as continuously running to the
:: washroom. I was also getting up in the middle of the night to go,
:: something I had never done before (and don't do since I have cut
:: back).
::
:: I think people hear that drinking a quart of water (or whatever) is a
:: good habit, so they figure if a quart is good then a gallon must be
:: fantastic. I'm sure they also feel that it keeps them full,
:: something not really necessary on Atkins. Just eat some fat and
:: you'll feel full.
::
:: I also found that when I overdid the water consumption, especially
:: during meals, that I got some stomach pain. I was frequently
:: drinking a quart of water with a large meal, which common sense
:: should have told me was too much.
::
:: Overdoing a good thing is not necessarily a good thing.

Many people right here in this ng will report on downing amazing amounts of
water - yet they don't manage to lose much weight, either. There seems to
be the general notion amongst dieters that you must drink lots and lots of
water - yet many dieters don't successfully lose and maintain weight loss.