Low carb high protein -- a misnomer?

Rusty wrote:
|| Jennifer wrote:
||
||| Not exactly.
|||
||| First of all, most of us are not eating that much more protein than
||| before.
|||
||| Here's an example: I went to lunch with friends yesterday. We all
||| ordered the same thing, a cheeseburger plate. I asked for no bun
||| and
||| had a salad instead of the fries. Since we all had the same
||| hamburger patty... our protein content was the same... mine was a
||| higher "percentage" of my meal, but the grams were the same as my
||| friends.
|||
||| Also, protein does not convert to glucose the way you assume.
|||
||| Of every 100 grams (3 1/2 ounces by weight) of protein you eat,
||| about 58 grams of it becomes sugar.
|||
||| But it's important to note that we are talking about the weight of
||| the protein itself, not the weight of the protein food.
|||
||| A 3 1/2-ounce piece of meat weighs 100 grams, but it only contains
||| about 20 or 25 grams of protein.
|||
||| The piece of meat would give about 10 to 14 grams of actual
||| carbohydrates, not 58 grams.
|||
||| And only 58% of that 10 to 14g will convert to glucose, or about 6
||| - 8g
||| of carbs.
|||
||| Jennifer
|||
|||
||| Ignoramus26161 wrote:
|||
|||| Here's what I am thinking about... If we eat more protein than our
|||| body requires for repairing body tissues, the rest is converted to
|||| carbs/glucose.
||||
|||| If so, then a high protein diet actually supplies us with a lot of
|||| carbs, right?
||||
|||| So, then, real low carbing should involve eating modest amount of
|||| protein, and not a gross excess of protein. Otherwise it is not
|||| really low carb.
||||
|||| Makes sense?
||||
|||| i
|||
|||
|| How do you explain bodybuilders that taper the carbs and increase the
|| protein during cutting? If all that protein was converted to sugar,
|| how would they ever drop the extra pounds?

easy....eat below a maintenance level of calories.

Roger Zoul wrote:

Jennifer wrote:
|| Roger Zoul wrote:
||
||| Jennifer wrote:
||||| Not exactly.
|||
||| Not exactly what? I confused by that.
||
|| The "not exactly" referred to the OP comment:
||
|| ||| So, then, real low carbing should involve eating modest
|| amount of ||| protein, and not a gross excess of protein.
|| Otherwise it is not ||| really low carb.
|| |||
|| ||| Makes sense?

So what does not exactly mean? Are you saying that most LCers don't eat
modest amounts of protein or that eating a gross excess of protein is really
low carb? I guess it is the latter...


The "not exactly", was an answer to "Makes sense"... it doesn't
*exactly* make sense.


||
||
|||
|||||
||||| First of all, most of us are not eating that much more protein
||||| than before.
|||
||| Okay, but it is possible to eat a lot more protein. Some people do
||| so.
||
|| I didn't say it wasn't possible.

Right. I was commenting that some on LC do eat lots of protein.

||
|||
|||||
||||| Here's an example: I went to lunch with friends yesterday. We
||||| all ordered the same thing, a cheeseburger plate. I asked for no
||||| bun and had a salad instead of the fries. Since we all had the
||||| same
||||| hamburger patty... our protein content was the same... mine was a
||||| higher "percentage" of my meal, but the grams were the same as my
||||| friends.
|||||
||||| Also, protein does not convert to glucose the way you assume.
|||
||| I didn't see an assumption...
||
|| This was the assumption:
||
|| ||| Here's what I am thinking about... If we eat more protein
|| than our ||| body requires for repairing body tissues, the rest
|| is converted to ||| carbs/glucose.
||
|| The "rest" is not coverted to carbs/glucose.
||

What happens to it?

Not all the rest is converted to carbs/glucose, as the OP inferred.

Some are broken down into building blocks known as peptides.

Then, it is further broken down and it becomes amino acids.

The amino acids are absorbed through the small intestine's lining and
enter the blood stream.

From here, some of the amino acids build the body's protein stores.

Excess protein, which is absorbed, but not utilized may be excreted in the
form of urea and other carbon containing compounds. And some if eaten
in the extreme can be stored as fat.

Jennifer



||
|||||
||||| Of every 100 grams (3 1/2 ounces by weight) of protein you eat,
||||| about 58 grams of it becomes sugar.
|||||
||||| But it's important to note that we are talking about the weight of
||||| the protein itself, not the weight of the protein food.
|||||
||||| A 3 1/2-ounce piece of meat weighs 100 grams, but it only contains
||||| about 20 or 25 grams of protein.
|||||
||||| The piece of meat would give about 10 to 14 grams of actual
||||| carbohydrates, not 58 grams.
|||
||| Thanks for the math and breakdown, but that point was not in
||| question. I guess what I'm wanting to know is what you mean by "Not
||| exactly".
|||
|||||
||||| And only 58% of that 10 to 14g will convert to glucose, or about
||||| 6 - 8g
||||| of carbs.
|||
|||
||| But if I eat enough protein food to get 200 g of protein, than that
||| is 116 g of carbs just from protein-rich foods. That is certainly
||| possible to do since that only represents 800 kcals of foodj.
||
|| To eat 200g of protein you'd be eating approx. 800g - 1000g of actual
|| food... remember it's not the weight of the food, it's the grams of
|| protein in that food. Every 100g of a protein food is comprised of
|| approx. 20 -25g of protein.
||

If you notice I said "to get 200g of protein". it is very easy to do that
just by tracking the amount of protein in various food sources, so I'm not
sure why you felt the need to explain that again, as if I didn't know.

|| And of course, yes it's possible to eat that much.

I know it is because I've done it.

Roger Zoul wrote:

Jennifer wrote:
|| Roger Zoul wrote:
||
||| Jennifer wrote:
||||| Not exactly.
|||
||| Not exactly what? I confused by that.
||
|| The "not exactly" referred to the OP comment:
||
|| ||| So, then, real low carbing should involve eating modest
|| amount of ||| protein, and not a gross excess of protein.
|| Otherwise it is not ||| really low carb.
|| |||
|| ||| Makes sense?

So what does not exactly mean? Are you saying that most LCers don't eat
modest amounts of protein or that eating a gross excess of protein is really
low carb? I guess it is the latter...


The "not exactly", was an answer to "Makes sense"... it doesn't
*exactly* make sense.


||
||
|||
|||||
||||| First of all, most of us are not eating that much more protein
||||| than before.
|||
||| Okay, but it is possible to eat a lot more protein. Some people do
||| so.
||
|| I didn't say it wasn't possible.

Right. I was commenting that some on LC do eat lots of protein.

||
|||
|||||
||||| Here's an example: I went to lunch with friends yesterday. We
||||| all ordered the same thing, a cheeseburger plate. I asked for no
||||| bun and had a salad instead of the fries. Since we all had the
||||| same
||||| hamburger patty... our protein content was the same... mine was a
||||| higher "percentage" of my meal, but the grams were the same as my
||||| friends.
|||||
||||| Also, protein does not convert to glucose the way you assume.
|||
||| I didn't see an assumption...
||
|| This was the assumption:
||
|| ||| Here's what I am thinking about... If we eat more protein
|| than our ||| body requires for repairing body tissues, the rest
|| is converted to ||| carbs/glucose.
||
|| The "rest" is not coverted to carbs/glucose.
||

What happens to it?

Not all the rest is converted to carbs/glucose, as the OP inferred.

Some are broken down into building blocks known as peptides.

Then, it is further broken down and it becomes amino acids.

The amino acids are absorbed through the small intestine's lining and
enter the blood stream.

From here, some of the amino acids build the body's protein stores.

Excess protein, which is absorbed, but not utilized may be excreted in the
form of urea and other carbon containing compounds. And some if eaten
in the extreme can be stored as fat.

Jennifer



||
|||||
||||| Of every 100 grams (3 1/2 ounces by weight) of protein you eat,
||||| about 58 grams of it becomes sugar.
|||||
||||| But it's important to note that we are talking about the weight of
||||| the protein itself, not the weight of the protein food.
|||||
||||| A 3 1/2-ounce piece of meat weighs 100 grams, but it only contains
||||| about 20 or 25 grams of protein.
|||||
||||| The piece of meat would give about 10 to 14 grams of actual
||||| carbohydrates, not 58 grams.
|||
||| Thanks for the math and breakdown, but that point was not in
||| question. I guess what I'm wanting to know is what you mean by "Not
||| exactly".
|||
|||||
||||| And only 58% of that 10 to 14g will convert to glucose, or about
||||| 6 - 8g
||||| of carbs.
|||
|||
||| But if I eat enough protein food to get 200 g of protein, than that
||| is 116 g of carbs just from protein-rich foods. That is certainly
||| possible to do since that only represents 800 kcals of foodj.
||
|| To eat 200g of protein you'd be eating approx. 800g - 1000g of actual
|| food... remember it's not the weight of the food, it's the grams of
|| protein in that food. Every 100g of a protein food is comprised of
|| approx. 20 -25g of protein.
||

If you notice I said "to get 200g of protein". it is very easy to do that
just by tracking the amount of protein in various food sources, so I'm not
sure why you felt the need to explain that again, as if I didn't know.

|| And of course, yes it's possible to eat that much.

I know it is because I've done it.

Roger Zoul wrote:


I wonder how this fits in with that protein power plan? They consider their
diet LC and high protein, correct?

Not according to their website... they say:

"The Protein Power plan is a nutritional strategy involving lower
carbohydrate, adequate protein and healthy fat choices."

Jennifer

Roger Zoul wrote:


I wonder how this fits in with that protein power plan? They consider their
diet LC and high protein, correct?

Not according to their website... they say:

"The Protein Power plan is a nutritional strategy involving lower
carbohydrate, adequate protein and healthy fat choices."

Jennifer

Jennifer wrote:

Not exactly.

First of all, most of us are not eating that much more protein than
before.

Not in amount, but the overall percentage of what a person eats in protein
and/or fat changes with low carb.

Jennifer wrote:

Not exactly.

First of all, most of us are not eating that much more protein than
before.

Not in amount, but the overall percentage of what a person eats in protein
and/or fat changes with low carb.

Jennifer wrote.

A 3 1/2-ounce piece of meat weighs 100 grams, but it only contains about
20 or 25 grams of protein.

The piece of meat would give about 10 to 14 grams of actual
carbohydrates, not 58 grams.

And only 58% of that 10 to 14g will convert to glucose, or about 6 - 8g
of carbs.


Hi Jennifer,

haven't you applied the 58% conversion factor twice?
(58% of 25g is app. 14g and then 58% of 14g yields app. 8g ?)

Also, I am not quite clear about what happens to the amount of protein
the body needs for tissue repair - is that partially converted to glucose as
well
or does the glucose conversion only take place when consuming protein
above that level?

Your very informative website on protein needs
http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/proteincalc.htm
seems to indicate that. In that case - what happens to the
42% of the amino acids that cannot be converted to glucose?
Are they all excreeted?

BTW - thanks very much for compiling your excellent websites -
they have really helped me a lot ! (especially your page on "protein breath"
was an eye opener for me - whenever I notice protein breath now
I cut down on protein and it goes away.. )


Take care,
Hamburger

Here's what I am thinking about... If we eat more protein than our
body requires for repairing body tissues, the rest is converted to
carbs/glucose.

If so, then a high protein diet actually supplies us with a lot of
carbs, right?

I guess the problem is that I don't know of any low-carb high-protein diets.
Maybe some bodybuilder type plans? I do Atkins, so It really doesn't concern me
much.
LCing since 12/01/03-
Me- 5'7" 265/169/140
& hubby- 6' 310/190/180
http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/lcer09/my_photos

Here's what I am thinking about... If we eat more protein than our
body requires for repairing body tissues, the rest is converted to
carbs/glucose.

If so, then a high protein diet actually supplies us with a lot of
carbs, right?

I guess the problem is that I don't know of any low-carb high-protein diets.
Maybe some bodybuilder type plans? I do Atkins, so It really doesn't concern me
much.
LCing since 12/01/03-
Me- 5'7" 265/169/140
& hubby- 6' 310/190/180
http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/lcer09/my_photos