clinton surgery question

On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 08:11:13 -0400, Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

COMMENT:
Why no, but I think you're about to make a splendid argument why
Christians should never put violent criminals into prison, since the
effect of this is to remove free will and free choice from people who
make persistantly bad choices to do evil.

Fyi, incarceration does not remove free will. It does limit options for
exercising free will.

Yes, exactly the point.

On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 08:11:13 -0400, Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

COMMENT:
Why no, but I think you're about to make a splendid argument why
Christians should never put violent criminals into prison, since the
effect of this is to remove free will and free choice from people who
make persistantly bad choices to do evil.

Fyi, incarceration does not remove free will. It does limit options for
exercising free will.

Yes, exactly the point.

"MU" wrote in message
It's hypocritical to state that an all-powerful being is benevolent and
yet
is the cause of unspeakable agony.

Only to you. I would be careful with the word "cause"; be more accurate
and use the word "allow".

Read up on Pharoh.

There is no event in human history that can be accurately traced to the
direct intervention of God.

Cool. So you don't take the bible literally? You do not believe that the
events it described ever happened?

moo

"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" wrote in message ...
Steve Harris wrote:

John wrote in message . ..
COMMENT:

Excuse me? There's a lot of agony in the world, and I want to know if
you think all of it is necessary.

A good portion of the agony in the world is caused by people's free
will choices. Would you be willing to give up free will to avoid rape
and murder? Unfortunately, free will allows people to make bad,
really bad choices that harm themselves and others. But free will
without the ability to make a bad choice isn't free will, is it?

COMMENT:
Why no, but I think you're about to make a splendid argument why
Christians should never put violent criminals into prison, since the
effect of this is to remove free will and free choice from people who
make persistantly bad choices to do evil.

Fyi, incarceration does not remove free will. It does limit options for
exercising free will.



COMENT:

No ****, Einstein. And exacly the same argument applies to god. There
are many possible ways he could restrain evil people from carrying out
evil actions, without depriving them of free will. But whenever
nonbelievers wonder why a compassionate and omnipotent god doesn't DO
any of these things (give Ted Bundy polio or John Wayne Gacy a
paralyzing spinal tumor or something) it's always the believers who
chime in to say that this use of force would remove free agency.

What is it--- does something in your brains make you Rock-Stupid when
it comes to your own beliefs, but magically make the dummy-think wear
off temporarily when those same beliefs are fed back at you in
disguised form?

SBH

On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 14:20:51 -0400, Happy Dog wrote:

"MU" wrote in message

I know this through God's teachings and the *intimate* reasons for His
Plan (why this and that) I don't have any real knowledge nor should I.
Nor do I
need to.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 14:20:51 -0400, Happy Dog wrote:

WTF is THAT supposed to mean?

Exactly what is says. It's a simple sentence, grade school level.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 14:20:51 -0400, Happy Dog wrote:

Grade one, maybe. Idiot Mu. You claimed that you know what doesn't happen
in the afterlife WRT reqard and punishment. You claim to know this through
god's teachings etc.

I claim to know that I learned that I do not know? Nope, never said that
Unhappy TrollPuppy.

Then you claim that you have no real knowledge or any
need for it. And you also claim to be a skeptic. This is patently
hallucinatory.

Maybe to you. Makes perfect sense and works quite well for me. One can be
skeptical without the need to know; you confuse "desire to know" with need
to know. I desire to know, and will, someday but I have no need to know
until then. God's Plan.

Why do you care what I say? You made a point of claiming my uselessness.
Why do you even respond? Why waste your time?

On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 14:20:51 -0400, Happy Dog wrote:

I care only enough to post worthy rebuttals, like above. I don't care that
you're a dysfunctional religious nut.

Oh, I am highly functional; what do you do when you aren't a TROLL? Do you
work? Sleep all the time? Use your Puppy pan?

You claim to be a skeptic but
feel that "God's teachings" are axiomatic.

I never said that. You made that up out of thin air.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 14:20:51 -0400, Happy Dog wrote:

Nope. You can't explain how god's teachings are transmitted and how you
arrive at a particular viewpoint when most of the rest of the world has a
different one.

Sure I can. As to what the rest of the world knows is of little concern to
me.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 14:20:51 -0400, Happy Dog wrote:

All that adds up to a POV which requires god's teachings to
be self-evident to any right-thinking individual. Like you, no?

God lets me know what He feels I need to know. Faith not right thinking
opens that channel of knowledge.

So when I ask you to show us, in
detail, exactly what the no-**** teachings are that eclipse all the other
no-**** teachings of other gods, you'll put it in a succint and credible
form. Not.

You never asked me for any such detail. Drink less when you post.

"When I ask you" is in the present. The question is implied.

I don't know what a "no ****" teaching is. Try again. No ****, please do.
lol

On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 14:20:51 -0400, Happy Dog wrote:

Only to one so blinded by the Light that they can't grasp the logical
fundamental that all untestable (as in impossible to test) claims are
logically equivalent.

See above regarding drinking.

Gee MU, you've really seized on this particular insult. Projecting perhaps?

Projecting what? You post like you are imbibed, that's all.

I am afraid Dr. Chung is performing a kind of Sisyphus work trying to
explain rationally the idea of God (three in one, one for three?) of his
words, of his deeds. Men are not and will never be able to understand this.
It is the matter of belief, of faith. - The virtually ununderstable things -
f.i. the Holy Trinity, mankind's sufferings, etc. - belong to the "secret
of faith..."
That simple.
D.
PS Nevertheless, I appreciate dr. Chung's efforts to be good and make the
unbelievers good too...;-)

"Steve Harris " je
napisal v sporocilo m ...
"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" wrote in message
...
Steve Harris wrote:

John wrote in message
. ..
COMMENT:

Excuse me? There's a lot of agony in the world, and I want to know
if
you think all of it is necessary.

A good portion of the agony in the world is caused by people's free
will choices. Would you be willing to give up free will to avoid
rape
and murder? Unfortunately, free will allows people to make bad,
really bad choices that harm themselves and others. But free will
without the ability to make a bad choice isn't free will, is it?

COMMENT:
Why no, but I think you're about to make a splendid argument why
Christians should never put violent criminals into prison, since the
effect of this is to remove free will and free choice from people who
make persistantly bad choices to do evil.

Fyi, incarceration does not remove free will. It does limit options for
exercising free will.



COMENT:

No ****, Einstein. And exacly the same argument applies to god. There
are many possible ways he could restrain evil people from carrying out
evil actions, without depriving them of free will. But whenever
nonbelievers wonder why a compassionate and omnipotent god doesn't DO
any of these things (give Ted Bundy polio or John Wayne Gacy a
paralyzing spinal tumor or something) it's always the believers who
chime in to say that this use of force would remove free agency.

What is it--- does something in your brains make you Rock-Stupid when
it comes to your own beliefs, but magically make the dummy-think wear
off temporarily when those same beliefs are fed back at you in
disguised form?

SBH

I am afraid Dr. Chung is performing a kind of Sisyphus work trying to
explain rationally the idea of God (three in one, one for three?) of his
words, of his deeds. Men are not and will never be able to understand this.
It is the matter of belief, of faith. - The virtually ununderstable things -
f.i. the Holy Trinity, mankind's sufferings, etc. - belong to the "secret
of faith..."
That simple.
D.
PS Nevertheless, I appreciate dr. Chung's efforts to be good and make the
unbelievers good too...;-)

"Steve Harris " je
napisal v sporocilo m ...
"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" wrote in message
...
Steve Harris wrote:

John wrote in message
. ..
COMMENT:

Excuse me? There's a lot of agony in the world, and I want to know
if
you think all of it is necessary.

A good portion of the agony in the world is caused by people's free
will choices. Would you be willing to give up free will to avoid
rape
and murder? Unfortunately, free will allows people to make bad,
really bad choices that harm themselves and others. But free will
without the ability to make a bad choice isn't free will, is it?

COMMENT:
Why no, but I think you're about to make a splendid argument why
Christians should never put violent criminals into prison, since the
effect of this is to remove free will and free choice from people who
make persistantly bad choices to do evil.

Fyi, incarceration does not remove free will. It does limit options for
exercising free will.



COMENT:

No ****, Einstein. And exacly the same argument applies to god. There
are many possible ways he could restrain evil people from carrying out
evil actions, without depriving them of free will. But whenever
nonbelievers wonder why a compassionate and omnipotent god doesn't DO
any of these things (give Ted Bundy polio or John Wayne Gacy a
paralyzing spinal tumor or something) it's always the believers who
chime in to say that this use of force would remove free agency.

What is it--- does something in your brains make you Rock-Stupid when
it comes to your own beliefs, but magically make the dummy-think wear
off temporarily when those same beliefs are fed back at you in
disguised form?

SBH

"Steve Harris " wrote:

"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" wrote in message ...
Steve Harris wrote:

John wrote in message . ..
COMMENT:

Excuse me? There's a lot of agony in the world, and I want to know if
you think all of it is necessary.

A good portion of the agony in the world is caused by people's free
will choices. Would you be willing to give up free will to avoid rape
and murder? Unfortunately, free will allows people to make bad,
really bad choices that harm themselves and others. But free will
without the ability to make a bad choice isn't free will, is it?

COMMENT:
Why no, but I think you're about to make a splendid argument why
Christians should never put violent criminals into prison, since the
effect of this is to remove free will and free choice from people who
make persistantly bad choices to do evil.

Fyi, incarceration does not remove free will. It does limit options for
exercising free will.

COMENT:

No ****, Einstein.

Then why write it?

And exacly the same argument applies to god. There
are many possible ways he could restrain evil people from carrying out
evil actions, without depriving them of free will.

Correct. For example, He could have prevented the crucifixion of His Son but then we would not have been saved.

But whenever
nonbelievers wonder why a compassionate and omnipotent god doesn't DO
any of these things (give Ted Bundy polio or John Wayne Gacy a
paralyzing spinal tumor or something) it's always the believers who
chime in to say that this use of force would remove free agency.

What I discern is that such actions would be contrary to His will and plan.


What is it--- does something in your brains make you Rock-Stupid when
it comes to your own beliefs, but magically make the dummy-think wear
off temporarily when those same beliefs are fed back at you in
disguised form?


This would not be about my beliefs but about what is true.


SBH

You remain in my prayers, dear Steve whom I love.


Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?L26062048

What is all this about?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?R20632B48

Is this spam?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?N69721867

On Sat, 25 Sep 2004 00:34:19 +0200, DP wrote:

I am afraid Dr. Chung is performing a kind of Sisyphus work trying to
explain rationally the idea of God (three in one, one for three?) of his
words, of his deeds. Men are not and will never be able to understand this.
It is the matter of belief, of faith. - The virtually ununderstable things -
f.i. the Holy Trinity, mankind's sufferings, etc. - belong to the "secret
of faith..."
That simple.

Yes it is.

On Sat, 25 Sep 2004 00:34:19 +0200, DP wrote:

I am afraid Dr. Chung is performing a kind of Sisyphus work trying to
explain rationally the idea of God (three in one, one for three?) of his
words, of his deeds. Men are not and will never be able to understand this.
It is the matter of belief, of faith. - The virtually ununderstable things -
f.i. the Holy Trinity, mankind's sufferings, etc. - belong to the "secret
of faith..."
That simple.

Yes it is.