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Ignoramus13725 wrote:
They are all very aware | of their current weight and they actively manage it. snip They moved away from food obsessions and food takes little | place in their life, which I cannot say yet about myself, although it | has been getting a tad better later. This seems contradictory to me. In reality, food has become even more of an obsession, only in a different way. If they are "very aware of their current weight and actively mange it," they are still not able to live a "normal" life without obsessing about what they eat. This is where I am right now also; I hope that the day will come when I don't have to be "very aware of my current weight and actively manage it;" unfortunately, I believe that for many of us it's a lifetime of having to pay abnormabl attention to what we eat. -- Peter Before/Current Pix: http://users.thelink.net/marengo/wei...htlosspix.html |
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Great stuff. I felt the summary probably covered everything I needed, but I
bought a copy anyway, just in case the summary webpage goes away. Amazon used books were too pricey, but I found a hardback copy on eBay for $3.50 plus $2 shipping. my ended eBay purchase: http://tinyurl.com/6ny8e I'm concerned that I too spend too much time focusing on my diet. Maybe that will change, when I'm no longer restricting my calories to a 1400 per day average. Someday, 1600 per day should be much more comfortable. "Ignoramus13725" wrote in message ... I am reading a book _Keeping it Off_ by Robert Colvin and Susan Olson. This is an old book from 1985, I bought it used from Amazon. The book is excellent and a summary of it is available at http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/success.htm The book is a great read and I highly recommend it. It describes what is common amongst successful maintainers, which are defined as people who - lost over 20% of body weight - kept it off for 2 years - are not more than 5 lbs away from their lowest weight The discuss the traits amongst those successful people, how they think about weight loss, what they do, what they do not do etc. There are very few books about weight maintenance, probably because so few people can get to the point where they need to maintain weight, and even fewer of them actually maintain the loss. According to authors, only 2% of those who started dieting can maintain successfully for 2 years. Unfortunately, the authors are psychologists, and looked at those successful dieters from only psychological point of view. (I am not done with the book yet). I wish they tried to look at the somatic differences, if any, between successful and unsuccessful dieters. It also does not do a good enough job at comparing those successful people with controls who have not managed to be as successful. So, they could fall into a trap of describing their common traits that did not make a difference. Both of them had prior clinical experience with "treating" obese dieters, with little (average) success, so, hopefully, they could detect those success traits based on their experience. All in all, it is a great common sense book that describes what works. The great majority of maintainers lost weight on their own, not on any sort of commercial programs. All of them had an epiphany at some point, which has been my experience exactly. They are all very aware of their current weight and they actively manage it. Again, my experience. They moved away from food obsessions and food takes little place in their life, which I cannot say yet about myself, although it has been getting a tad better later. i |
#3
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_Keeping it off_ book
Ig,
Reading that book (which I found in our public library) really helped me. Though the focus is on the psychology, there's quite a bit on the physiology, too. It was interesting to me that the successful dieters lost weight on all kinds of different regimens and diets, but that the researchers found the common threads no matter what the food plan. I also found it helpful to see that contrary to what the people selling gym memberships tell you, exercise was helpful mostly after the weight was lost, and it was not necessary for the weight loss to occur. Most women started exercising after losing a lot of weight (like I did) and did very well. I know so many people at the gym who work out four times a week and have only lost 2 or 3 pounds all year (these are people who need to lose 30 or 40 lbs.) So I liked having it made clear that exercise is NOT the magic bullet for weight loss, calorie restriction is. I also found it interesting to look at the calorie levels at which people lost and maintained no matter WHAT diet. It's worth remembering that the book was written back when low carbing was just going out of fashion so many of the long term diet success stories in the book were low carbers. -- Jenny - Low Carbing for 5 years. Below goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes, hba1c 5.7 . Cut the carbs to respond to my email address! Jenny's new site: What they Don't Tell You About Diabetes http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/ Jenny's Low Carb Diet Facts & Figures http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Looking for help controlling your blood sugar? Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/...0Diagnosed.htm "Ignoramus13725" wrote in message ... I am reading a book _Keeping it Off_ by Robert Colvin and Susan Olson. This is an old book from 1985, I bought it used from Amazon. The book is excellent and a summary of it is available at http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/success.htm The book is a great read and I highly recommend it. It describes what is common amongst successful maintainers, which are defined as people who - lost over 20% of body weight - kept it off for 2 years - are not more than 5 lbs away from their lowest weight The discuss the traits amongst those successful people, how they think about weight loss, what they do, what they do not do etc. There are very few books about weight maintenance, probably because so few people can get to the point where they need to maintain weight, and even fewer of them actually maintain the loss. According to authors, only 2% of those who started dieting can maintain successfully for 2 years. Unfortunately, the authors are psychologists, and looked at those successful dieters from only psychological point of view. (I am not done with the book yet). I wish they tried to look at the somatic differences, if any, between successful and unsuccessful dieters. It also does not do a good enough job at comparing those successful people with controls who have not managed to be as successful. So, they could fall into a trap of describing their common traits that did not make a difference. Both of them had prior clinical experience with "treating" obese dieters, with little (average) success, so, hopefully, they could detect those success traits based on their experience. All in all, it is a great common sense book that describes what works. The great majority of maintainers lost weight on their own, not on any sort of commercial programs. All of them had an epiphany at some point, which has been my experience exactly. They are all very aware of their current weight and they actively manage it. Again, my experience. They moved away from food obsessions and food takes little place in their life, which I cannot say yet about myself, although it has been getting a tad better later. i |
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Ig,
Reading that book (which I found in our public library) really helped me. Though the focus is on the psychology, there's quite a bit on the physiology, too. It was interesting to me that the successful dieters lost weight on all kinds of different regimens and diets, but that the researchers found the common threads no matter what the food plan. I also found it helpful to see that contrary to what the people selling gym memberships tell you, exercise was helpful mostly after the weight was lost, and it was not necessary for the weight loss to occur. Most women started exercising after losing a lot of weight (like I did) and did very well. I know so many people at the gym who work out four times a week and have only lost 2 or 3 pounds all year (these are people who need to lose 30 or 40 lbs.) So I liked having it made clear that exercise is NOT the magic bullet for weight loss, calorie restriction is. I also found it interesting to look at the calorie levels at which people lost and maintained no matter WHAT diet. It's worth remembering that the book was written back when low carbing was just going out of fashion so many of the long term diet success stories in the book were low carbers. -- Jenny - Low Carbing for 5 years. Below goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes, hba1c 5.7 . Cut the carbs to respond to my email address! Jenny's new site: What they Don't Tell You About Diabetes http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/ Jenny's Low Carb Diet Facts & Figures http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Looking for help controlling your blood sugar? Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/...0Diagnosed.htm "Ignoramus13725" wrote in message ... I am reading a book _Keeping it Off_ by Robert Colvin and Susan Olson. This is an old book from 1985, I bought it used from Amazon. The book is excellent and a summary of it is available at http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/success.htm The book is a great read and I highly recommend it. It describes what is common amongst successful maintainers, which are defined as people who - lost over 20% of body weight - kept it off for 2 years - are not more than 5 lbs away from their lowest weight The discuss the traits amongst those successful people, how they think about weight loss, what they do, what they do not do etc. There are very few books about weight maintenance, probably because so few people can get to the point where they need to maintain weight, and even fewer of them actually maintain the loss. According to authors, only 2% of those who started dieting can maintain successfully for 2 years. Unfortunately, the authors are psychologists, and looked at those successful dieters from only psychological point of view. (I am not done with the book yet). I wish they tried to look at the somatic differences, if any, between successful and unsuccessful dieters. It also does not do a good enough job at comparing those successful people with controls who have not managed to be as successful. So, they could fall into a trap of describing their common traits that did not make a difference. Both of them had prior clinical experience with "treating" obese dieters, with little (average) success, so, hopefully, they could detect those success traits based on their experience. All in all, it is a great common sense book that describes what works. The great majority of maintainers lost weight on their own, not on any sort of commercial programs. All of them had an epiphany at some point, which has been my experience exactly. They are all very aware of their current weight and they actively manage it. Again, my experience. They moved away from food obsessions and food takes little place in their life, which I cannot say yet about myself, although it has been getting a tad better later. i |
#5
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Ig,
Since the book was written when low carb was going out of fashion and looked at people who had lost weight many years in the past and kept it off, many of their dieters were low carbers (including, for example, all those on plans like Weight Watchers which was low carb back then). No one in their right minds would have done a high carb, low fat diet in the 1970s since we all knew back then that bread and potatoes and cookies make you fat, whether with butter or not! -- Jenny - Low Carbing for 5 years. Below goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes, hba1c 5.7 . Cut the carbs to respond to my email address! Jenny's new site: What they Don't Tell You About Diabetes http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/ Jenny's Low Carb Diet Facts & Figures http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Looking for help controlling your blood sugar? Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/...0Diagnosed.htm "Ignoramus26161" wrote in message ... In article , Jenny wrote: Ig, Reading that book (which I found in our public library) really helped me. Though the focus is on the psychology, there's quite a bit on the physiology, too. First of all, thanks for posting a review of that book that prompted me to buy it. There is not that much regarding physiology, in it. I personally prefer to look at physiology because solutions in that area are more concrete and can be evaluated. Psychology is more nebulous. It was interesting to me that the successful dieters lost weight on all kinds of different regimens and diets, but that the researchers found the common threads no matter what the food plan. Yes. I liked that they mostly were absolutist regarding giving up sugar. I was quite disconcerted by their conclusion that they were almost all lowfatting, which would be a diet that I would not enjoy at all. I also found it helpful to see that contrary to what the people selling gym memberships tell you, exercise was helpful mostly after the weight was lost, and it was not necessary for the weight loss to occur. Most women started exercising after losing a lot of weight (like I did) and did very well. But, Jenny, men started much earlier, I started walking in the first days after my epiphany. I know so many people at the gym who work out four times a week and have only lost 2 or 3 pounds all year (these are people who need to lose 30 or 40 lbs.) So I liked having it made clear that exercise is NOT the magic bullet for weight loss, calorie restriction is. I also found it interesting to look at the calorie levels at which people lost and maintained no matter WHAT diet. to me, exercise is a way to keep good mood, eat extra food, and feel good and look good. It's worth remembering that the book was written back when low carbing was just going out of fashion so many of the long term diet success stories in the book were low carbers. low fatters? I am reading a book _Keeping it Off_ by Robert Colvin and Susan Olson. This is an old book from 1985, I bought it used from Amazon. The book is excellent and a summary of it is available at http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/success.htm The book is a great read and I highly recommend it. It describes what is common amongst successful maintainers, which are defined as people who - lost over 20% of body weight - kept it off for 2 years - are not more than 5 lbs away from their lowest weight The discuss the traits amongst those successful people, how they think about weight loss, what they do, what they do not do etc. There are very few books about weight maintenance, probably because so few people can get to the point where they need to maintain weight, and even fewer of them actually maintain the loss. According to authors, only 2% of those who started dieting can maintain successfully for 2 years. Unfortunately, the authors are psychologists, and looked at those successful dieters from only psychological point of view. (I am not done with the book yet). I wish they tried to look at the somatic differences, if any, between successful and unsuccessful dieters. It also does not do a good enough job at comparing those successful people with controls who have not managed to be as successful. So, they could fall into a trap of describing their common traits that did not make a difference. Both of them had prior clinical experience with "treating" obese dieters, with little (average) success, so, hopefully, they could detect those success traits based on their experience. All in all, it is a great common sense book that describes what works. The great majority of maintainers lost weight on their own, not on any sort of commercial programs. All of them had an epiphany at some point, which has been my experience exactly. They are all very aware of their current weight and they actively manage it. Again, my experience. They moved away from food obsessions and food takes little place in their life, which I cannot say yet about myself, although it has been getting a tad better later. i |
#6
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Ig,
Since the book was written when low carb was going out of fashion and looked at people who had lost weight many years in the past and kept it off, many of their dieters were low carbers (including, for example, all those on plans like Weight Watchers which was low carb back then). No one in their right minds would have done a high carb, low fat diet in the 1970s since we all knew back then that bread and potatoes and cookies make you fat, whether with butter or not! -- Jenny - Low Carbing for 5 years. Below goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes, hba1c 5.7 . Cut the carbs to respond to my email address! Jenny's new site: What they Don't Tell You About Diabetes http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/ Jenny's Low Carb Diet Facts & Figures http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Looking for help controlling your blood sugar? Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/...0Diagnosed.htm "Ignoramus26161" wrote in message ... In article , Jenny wrote: Ig, Reading that book (which I found in our public library) really helped me. Though the focus is on the psychology, there's quite a bit on the physiology, too. First of all, thanks for posting a review of that book that prompted me to buy it. There is not that much regarding physiology, in it. I personally prefer to look at physiology because solutions in that area are more concrete and can be evaluated. Psychology is more nebulous. It was interesting to me that the successful dieters lost weight on all kinds of different regimens and diets, but that the researchers found the common threads no matter what the food plan. Yes. I liked that they mostly were absolutist regarding giving up sugar. I was quite disconcerted by their conclusion that they were almost all lowfatting, which would be a diet that I would not enjoy at all. I also found it helpful to see that contrary to what the people selling gym memberships tell you, exercise was helpful mostly after the weight was lost, and it was not necessary for the weight loss to occur. Most women started exercising after losing a lot of weight (like I did) and did very well. But, Jenny, men started much earlier, I started walking in the first days after my epiphany. I know so many people at the gym who work out four times a week and have only lost 2 or 3 pounds all year (these are people who need to lose 30 or 40 lbs.) So I liked having it made clear that exercise is NOT the magic bullet for weight loss, calorie restriction is. I also found it interesting to look at the calorie levels at which people lost and maintained no matter WHAT diet. to me, exercise is a way to keep good mood, eat extra food, and feel good and look good. It's worth remembering that the book was written back when low carbing was just going out of fashion so many of the long term diet success stories in the book were low carbers. low fatters? I am reading a book _Keeping it Off_ by Robert Colvin and Susan Olson. This is an old book from 1985, I bought it used from Amazon. The book is excellent and a summary of it is available at http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/success.htm The book is a great read and I highly recommend it. It describes what is common amongst successful maintainers, which are defined as people who - lost over 20% of body weight - kept it off for 2 years - are not more than 5 lbs away from their lowest weight The discuss the traits amongst those successful people, how they think about weight loss, what they do, what they do not do etc. There are very few books about weight maintenance, probably because so few people can get to the point where they need to maintain weight, and even fewer of them actually maintain the loss. According to authors, only 2% of those who started dieting can maintain successfully for 2 years. Unfortunately, the authors are psychologists, and looked at those successful dieters from only psychological point of view. (I am not done with the book yet). I wish they tried to look at the somatic differences, if any, between successful and unsuccessful dieters. It also does not do a good enough job at comparing those successful people with controls who have not managed to be as successful. So, they could fall into a trap of describing their common traits that did not make a difference. Both of them had prior clinical experience with "treating" obese dieters, with little (average) success, so, hopefully, they could detect those success traits based on their experience. All in all, it is a great common sense book that describes what works. The great majority of maintainers lost weight on their own, not on any sort of commercial programs. All of them had an epiphany at some point, which has been my experience exactly. They are all very aware of their current weight and they actively manage it. Again, my experience. They moved away from food obsessions and food takes little place in their life, which I cannot say yet about myself, although it has been getting a tad better later. i |
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"Ignoramus8743" wrote in message
... Maybe that is true, but that's not what the book says. It pretty much said that the winners' strategy, in their words, is to drop as much sugar and as much fat as possible. Yes, that was the traditionnal way of doing diets in the old days... That's actually what many generalists still advice nowadays in France. Drop sugars and fats, then each doctor adds his peculiar obsession (drop pasta, drop red meat, drop coffee, add vegetables, eat more breakfast...) to that framework. Though the summary seems to point to the fact that the diet itself was not really the important factor in the success or not of these dieters. |
#8
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"Ignoramus8743" wrote in message
... Maybe that is true, but that's not what the book says. It pretty much said that the winners' strategy, in their words, is to drop as much sugar and as much fat as possible. Yes, that was the traditionnal way of doing diets in the old days... That's actually what many generalists still advice nowadays in France. Drop sugars and fats, then each doctor adds his peculiar obsession (drop pasta, drop red meat, drop coffee, add vegetables, eat more breakfast...) to that framework. Though the summary seems to point to the fact that the diet itself was not really the important factor in the success or not of these dieters. |
#9
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"Ignoramus8743" wrote in message
... My personal opinion, is that what it points out, is the possibility that likely most of the interviewed persons did not have metabolic syndrome/diabetes. Well, people with diabete are still a minority, thankfully. I don't know how many obeses also have a metabolic syndrom, and how much of their obesity can be linked to it. You also have to consider that weight loss, at least for some people, can reduce the metabolic syndrom to such an extent that it is no longer a problem past the first few pounds. Even with diabete, weight loss is very effective for some. My FBG returned to high normal within a month of losing weight for instance. Right now, if I had not been tested before, I would pass most casual diabete screenings (A1c, FBG) without even registering as pre-diabetic. Of course, that would show on a GTT, but they're rarely used nowadays. It's quite possible that for some of these people with metabolical syndrom, rapid weight loss put them into a range where insulin resistance was low enough to allow maintainance. It's not that I think that metabolic disorder people cannot lose weight at all, but I don't think that a low fat diet is what would work for many of them. There is a whole world between no fat and no carb I still think these people could lose on a traditional diet (i.e. a well established cultural diet, not one designed by a doctor) with basic portion control. The integrist low fat diet (all fats=bad, less than 25% calories from fats) is so abnormal that it's a wonder people actually managed to lose on it (and stay healthy). Now, I know, that you consider yourself a counterexample, a diabetic who became obese because of psychological issues that you are now addressing, but, I don't think that you are on a low fat diet. Indeed, my diet is getting closer to the traditionnal French diet, with a few exceptions (I should drink more wine ). It's certainly not low fat (I eat quite a lot of nuts lately, along with olive oil and walnut oil and some butter) and it's not high carb either. Some days are higher carbs than others too. Today was a rather high carb day for instance, but this might be linked to increased exercise yesterday. I just bought a cardiometer [tr?] to use bio-feedback for meditation, but I also use it for exercising. As a result, I have added bursts of sprinting to my power-walking (heart going at 140bpm on average [75% max], peaks at 167 [90% max]), for one hour yesterday and half an hour today. This certainly felt great, but I did some serious sweating as a result, and this did raise hunger quite a bit, and craving for carbs (I guess glycogen stores were quite empty). But I don't really exercise with the intent to lose weight, the goal is to improve my insulin resistance. I would actually say I'm a psychological obese who got diabetic because of the excess weight (and total sedentarity during the past few years). Diabete probably helped me put on weight so quickly in the past years, but only because I was eating an insane amount of food. The fact that my FBG and A1c are going down through pure weight loss and exercise and not too much diet seems to hint to that. Likewise, the fact that I have experienced little reactive hypoglycemia (except when I was using Prandin), and that what hypoglycemia I have experienced made me nauseous, make it difficult for me to blame the overeating on it. I seem to lose weight about as easily as I put it on, it's really totally symetric there. That's also something I share with my father, and maybe my grandfather on my mother's side. Men in the familly (both sides) also build muscles as easily (people often think wrongly that my father is into bodybuilding), and it seems I have inherited that trait (I was always quite muscular, even under the fat). So, it's really a matter of pushing the body in the right direction, and being so sedentary certainly didn't push it towards building muscles rather than fat. |
#10
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Ignoramus5536 wrote:
|| || Speaking of hypo... My MIL had a serious hypo attack at BG of 70 || (sic). || || To me, this is a quite normal level these days. I would experience || perhaps very slight shakiness, but would feel quite well otherwise. If you do some reading on hypo, you'll discover that hypo is not merely a low BG reading...they symptoms can be brought on by the rate that BG levels fall, so the BG doesn't even need to be that low for one to experience hypo. |
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