'Put fat children on Atkins diet'

"Bob in CT" wrote

I'm on low carb and eat a lot of vegetables and avoid sugars to the exent
I can. I also eat some fruits that are low glycemic and high fiber.

I'm also a low carb advocate.

Sounds like you're more of a "low-sugar" or "low-glycemic" advocate, which
is better, IMO.

avoid sugars to the extent I can

The cheap little "Shoppers' Guide" put out by Sugar Busters is a good source
of info about low and high-glycemic goods, including brand names. If you
avoid just a few very high glycemic fruits and vegetables (ripe bananas,
pineapples, white potatoes, mangos, corn, beets and a few others) and watch
your nutrition labels to avoid anything with over 3g of sugars listed, you
can pretty easily avoid the sugars. You still have to watch those labels
for artificial sweeteners, though, if, like me, you are trying to avoid the
"sweet taste", not just the sugars.

mack
austin

"Mack"

Seems to me, one of the most egregious problems from the "low-carb"
advocates is their lack of distinction between simple carbs, i.e. sugars,
and complex carbs, i.e. fruits and vegetables.

Low carbers are acutely aware of the differences between carbs. They use
ketostix and blood glucose meters to measure the impact carbs have on their
body. They know that fiber carbs have no effect on their body, and they do not
count them. On the other hand, when it comes to either simple sugars or complex
carbs, it only takes about 10-15 carbs in a meal to cause a measurable reaction.

If people on Adkins could eat a couple of pieces of fruit a day without weight
loss dramatically slowing or even stopping, they would. People don't like
depriving themselves.

"Sunshyne"

I wonder if they do more studies, including the long term affects on
children doing it.

A large number of elliptic children have been put on extreme high fat/low carb
diets, and they stayed on them for more than a decade. And no health problems
have turned up. On the other hand, the medical establishment has successfully
encouraged the American people to reduce their consumption of fat, and the
result has been obesity and diabetes rising to epidemic proportions.

How could I have myself or children participate
with the study. It would be interesting too to be involved in a study
for those with Fibromyalia and low carbing.

Fibromyalia is a warning sign for Syndrome X. And chance are you can reduce
your Fibromyalia as well as enormously improve your health, by lowing your blood
sugar level. The closer you can bring your morning blood sugar to 80, the
better.

But don't rely on studies to tell you what the best diet is. What you need to
have is a feedback mechanism that would tell your if your diet is benefiting
you. Now the traditional way people gage a diet is by how much weight they
lose. But a lot of people are thin, and they still have high blood pressure or
high cholesterol. Some diets cause muscles to waste. And frankly, waiting to
lose weight takes a long time.

For immediate feedback, I use a blood glucose meter. A blood glucose meter
doesn't cost any more than bathroom scales. And you can test your blood glucose
level after every meal, and find out if the meal was health or not (the less
your blood sugar goes up the better).

What I found out is the low carbers were right. And that a low carb diet was
not enough to fully control my blood sugar. I have a strange problem called the
dawn phenomena, that causes my blood sugar to start to rise at 5 am. And
through continued experimentation, that getting up at 2 am and using a product
called Relora (a cortisol blocker), fixes the problem (I feel like a brand new
person). And if I hadn't used a blood glucose meter, my problem would have
remained undiagnosed, and it would eventually cause me to become a diabetic.

Anyway, you need to be able to monitor what is going on in your body, and adjust
your diet for what works for you.

I'm on low carb and eat a lot of vegetables and avoid sugars to the
exent
I can. I also eat some fruits that are low glycemic and high fiber.

I'm also a low carb advocate.

Sounds like you're more of a "low-sugar" or "low-glycemic" advocate,
which
is better, IMO.

avoid sugars to the extent I can

The cheap little "Shoppers' Guide" put out by Sugar Busters is a good
source
of info about low and high-glycemic goods, including brand names. If
you
avoid just a few very high glycemic fruits and vegetables (ripe
bananas,
pineapples, white potatoes, mangos, corn, beets and a few others) and
watch
your nutrition labels to avoid anything with over 3g of sugars listed,
you
can pretty easily avoid the sugars. You still have to watch those
labels
for artificial sweeteners, though, if, like me, you are trying to
avoid the
"sweet taste", not just the sugars.

Avoiding sugar is not enough. You need to avoid quickly absorbed
starches too.

Anyway, if you avoid everything with GI 25 (not that unreasonable),
you will end with low-carb diet. There simply is not enough carbs in
low-glycemic foods to get you over 100g carbs/day, "official" threshold
for LC diet (if you do not intent to eat 10 pounds of vegetables of
course

BTW, I have no problem with "sweet taste" - I think that my LC
choko-yougurt each evening helps me prevent my candy-cravings. YMMV.

Mirek

"Mirek Fidler" wrote

Avoiding sugar is not enough. You need to avoid quickly absorbed
starches too.

That is why I mentioned "white potatoes" as an example of a high-glycemic
food you need to avoid.

BTW, I have no problem with "sweet taste" - I think that my LC
choko-yougurt each evening helps me prevent my candy-cravings. YMMV.

You have to do what you have to do. But it has been my experience that
making the transition from sweets to artificial sweets to no sweets
eventually kills or greatly lessens the sweet cravings. If you could wean
yourself off the artificial sweeteners and get used to the taste of food
without the sweet taste, eventually, you would not want the candy. In
theory, at least. That might not work for you; I don't know.

mack
austin




Mirek

If people on Adkins could eat a couple of pieces of fruit a day without weight
loss dramatically slowing or even stopping, they would. People don't like
depriving themselves.


I eat up to 6 pieces of fruit a day and loose up too two pounds a week. about
the only really carbs I usually eat. so it is possible. but I feel good when I
eat fruit. but I also cycle 20 miles a day 5 days a week too.

--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com For prices and ordering instructions.

You have to do what you have to do. But it has been my experience
that
making the transition from sweets to artificial sweets to no sweets
eventually kills or greatly lessens the sweet cravings. If you could
wean
yourself off the artificial sweeteners and get used to the taste of
food
without the sweet taste, eventually, you would not want the candy. In
theory, at least. That might not work for you; I don't know.

Well, actually I admit this approach is even better. But I am just a
human

Mirek

On 19 Mar 2004 03:34:54 GMT, Ignoramus21235
posted:

In article , Mack wrote:
You have to do what you have to do. But it has been my experience that
making the transition from sweets to artificial sweets to no sweets
eventually kills or greatly lessens the sweet cravings. If you could wean
yourself off the artificial sweeteners and get used to the taste of food
without the sweet taste, eventually, you would not want the candy. In
theory, at least. That might not work for you; I don't know.

Works for me. No more candy cravings. I eat nothing sweetened. My
theory is that good food does not need sweetening.

Sure puts the kybosh on fruit and honey and so on. Fine foods in
moderation.

Mack wrote:

Seems to me, one of the most egregious problems from the "low-carb"
advocates is their lack of distinction between simple carbs, i.e. sugars,
and complex carbs, i.e. fruits and vegetables.

Unless you deal with nasty inconvenient hard work topics like truth,
paying attention to the endless discussion of experienced low carbers
teaching naive new low carbers, and shock of shocks actually reading
the entire contents of a few of the well known low carb plan books,
anyways. What rock did you crawl out from under that you missed
simple basics like every single well known low carb plan without
exception puts much focus on glycemic index? Heck, there's even
Sugarbusters that focuses on complex vs simple carbs almost to the
exclusion of restricting total carb intake.

Thomas Edison said: "Most people miss opportunity because it is
dressed in coveralls and looks like work." Mack, actually reading the
books you attempt to discuss looks like work, but you really need to
try it. You know. Pick up book, open to page one, read the table
of contents. That sort of stuff that you clearly haven't done yet.
There isn't a single book out there that lacks focus on glycemic
index so it doesn't even matter *which* popular one you pick. Get
with the program. Do your homework. If you want to object to low
carbing, learn enough that you can actually do so on a basis of the
facts.

No, it definitely does not "put the kybosh" on fruit. I only avoid the
particularly high-glycemic fruits, like watermelon, ripe bananas,
pineapples, raisins. It does put it on honey. Two very different things.
Honey is an extremely high-glycemic food, like sugar. Sugared and
artifically-sweetened food tastes -- at least to me -- dramatically sweeter
than any fruit I eat.

mack
austin

"Moosh" wrote in message
...
On 19 Mar 2004 03:34:54 GMT, Ignoramus21235
posted:

In article , Mack wrote:
You have to do what you have to do. But it has been my experience that
making the transition from sweets to artificial sweets to no sweets
eventually kills or greatly lessens the sweet cravings. If you could
wean
yourself off the artificial sweeteners and get used to the taste of
food
without the sweet taste, eventually, you would not want the candy. In
theory, at least. That might not work for you; I don't know.

Works for me. No more candy cravings. I eat nothing sweetened. My
theory is that good food does not need sweetening.

Sure puts the kybosh on fruit and honey and so on. Fine foods in
moderation.