Binge-eating is seen as eating disorder

On 5/21/2004 1:44 PM, Ignoramus29346 wrote:

it is not impossible to avoid those foods

I think taht you left out a few words. It's not impossible *FOR YOU* to
avoid those foods.

--
jmk in NC

On Thu, 20 May 2004 18:43:07 -0500, "JMA"
wrote:

cross posts snipped
"Leslie DiMaggio" wrote in message
...
Binge-eating is seen as eating disorder
It is recognized as growing health problem in U.S.

Thursday, May 20, 2004

Helen's symptoms are typical of a newly recognized disease called
binge-eating disorder, although she calls herself a compulsive overeater.

They're a little slow on the draw. The book I have - Overcoming Binge
Eating - is copyrighted in 1995 and lists Binge Eating Disorder as an eating
disorder.

Jenn

Yes, but to be fair, for many years anorexia and bulimia were seen as
eating disorders, but binge eating went unrecognised. I still suspect
that most of the medical profession find it far harder to comprehend
than the first two.

janice

On 21 May 2004 17:44:25 GMT, Ignoramus29346
wrote:


According to

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/magaz...157072,00.html

``One of the common problems highlighted by bulimics is that once they
start eating, they can't stop. And while any foods may be tempting,
experience shows that most bulimics gravitate towards sugary and
starchy carbohydrates. This carb-fest will generally send blood-sugar
levels skyrocketing and there is evidence that this surge in the
system has the potential to skew the delicate biochemistry of the
brain. This has repercussions for both appetite and mood.''

it is not impossible to avoid those foods, and choose carbohydrates
that are low in glycemic index and are hard to overeat (due to already
being bulky, for example).

I can't comment on bulimics because this is not a behaviour I've even
remotely contemplated. However, for me bingeing consists largely of
the foods I know I'll be forced to limit when I'm back on track if I
want to lose weight - because they're calorie dense. I see this more
as the binge being the other side of the coin to the diet, rather than
being drawn towards these foods because of an addiction. It's a fine
line, though, and I can't be completely sure of the reasons for going
for these foods.

janice

On 21 May 2004 20:52:54 GMT, Ignoramus29346
wrote:

In article , janice wrote:

I can't comment on bulimics because this is not a behaviour I've even
remotely contemplated. However, for me bingeing consists largely of
the foods I know I'll be forced to limit when I'm back on track if I
want to lose weight - because they're calorie dense. I see this more
as the binge being the other side of the coin to the diet, rather than
being drawn towards these foods because of an addiction. It's a fine
line, though, and I can't be completely sure of the reasons for going
for these foods.

What foods are those Janice?

Just curious. Also, if I was in your shoes, I would try to take some
glucose level measurements around a binge to see if anything unusual
happens. Here in the US, glucose meters are very affordable.

Well, things I love but can't afford the calories if I want to lose
weight. Therefore mainly fats, refined carbs, and some sugary foods.
Examples, butter, cream, cakes, puddings, pastries, dried fruit.
Some sweets and chocolates but not in a huge way. The more I go
without these things the more I seem to indulge in them when I fall
off the wagon. I can go for 6 or 7 months without these foods, but if
I fall then the binge behaviour comes right back.

I would guess my blood sugar goes right up during a binge, and falls
if I stop eating for a while, resulting in the unpleasant symptoms
that this causes. However, there are periods when I don't even let
myself get hungry I just keep topping up before this gets a chance to
happen.

janice

Hark! I heard (janice) say:

I too find it very
hard to empathise with other people over things I can't identify with
from my own experience. Examples - I've never experienced PMS and
therefore I find myself thinking (even though I don't say it) that
when other people talk about it, it must be something that exists in
their head. Likewise, I've never failed to lose weight when I stick
to an appropriate WOE. I therefore find myself very sceptical about
others who claim to not be able to lose weight but say they don't eat
much.

snip

I think many of these folks could be in plain old denial. I speak
from experience -- I used to complain to DH that I didn't eat that
much, certainly no more than he does, so why was I heavy? For years,
I kept telling myself that since I never sat down and ate half a pie
or a box of donuts at one sitting, that I just didn't eat that much.
When I finally faced the truth (by tracking my calorie intake), I
realized that I'd been fooling myself and had to eat less junk and
excercise more...


--
J.J. in WA State - 251/234/150
(Change COLD to HOT for e-mail)

"Ignoramus29346" wrote in message
...
Basically, I think that what your argument boils down to, is that not
all people are able to stop their destructive behaviors cold turkey.
Examples of such behaviors are quitting drinking completely or
quitting smoking completely or quitting eating junk food and trigger
foods completely.

And that is quite possible that not all people can do it. Why not all
people cannot do it is not clear at all. Could be a few reasons
together.

When you read the book you will see that are other studies that show
bulimics do not focus on sugary foods, but instead the composition is
primarily fat or more correctly sweet foods with a high fat content. If it
were just sugary foods then things like pop and candy would be up there on
the list. What most bulimics report as food they binge on are "forbidden
foods" meaning that the elimination of certain foods from a diet actually
triggers binges for most bulimics and anorexics, not necessarily those with
binge eating disorder. Bulimics and anorexics are not necessarily addicted
to foods. When you are addicted, you actually *want* the substance you're
addicted to. Bulimics and anorexics avoid food.

Now, when the people who cannot stop such behaviors cold turkey hear
that stopping them works, naturally, they become upset at the
messenger. But, that they are upset does not mean that the message is
false.

i

People get ****ed off at you not because of your message but because of your
delivery system. And when you continually dismiss and belittle people and
treat them like they're stupid, your message gets lost in the noise.

Here's an example. I quit smoking a number of years ago after a 20+ year
habit that began when I was 11. I decided to stop one day and did for the
most part with a few lapses, mostly involving alcohol. I can't remember the
last time I had a cigarette and have no desire for one. Anyway, I have a lot
of friends who smoke that have been unsuccessful in quitting. When they
come to me for support, I could say one of two things:
1. Just put down your cigarettes and don't light another. The sooner you
stop the better off you will be. All I did was decide I wasn't going to
smoke one day and it worked. That's all you need to do.
2. I was fortunate that I could stop just by deciding not to do it anymore.
I had occasional lapses, but I don't have the desire to smoke anymore. What
methods have you tried? (etc. I might go on to recommend other things that
have helped people I know like zyban, whatever)

Think before you speak or hit the send button. Remember your audience. As
you have been reminded, this is a support group. Believe it or not, most
binge eaters and definitely all bulimics are already doing enough
self-belittling and criticizing and don't need your help in feeling like
failures.

"Ignoramus29346" wrote in message
...
In other words, you are suggesting that it is impossible for some
people, right? What do you mean by impossible? Do you mean that they
cannot avoid the temptation, or do you mean that they would suffer
health damage if they were deprived of such foods?

What if they were locked up in a hypothetical prison, and given access
to other foods, except those foods that trigger binges. Normal
exercise etc would be available. Would such people die or suffer
damage to their health, in your opinion?

This is exactly why inpatient treatment for bulimia does not have a great
success rate. It's not the food, it's the diet and restriction. They'll
comply while in treatment and go right back when out in the real world
again.

Regardless of whether all people can give them up, those foods are
what trigger binging, according to the article I mentioned.

i

And according to numerous other studies, restricting foods, extreme, and/or
severe dieting also trigger binges.

janice wrote:
Examples - I've never experienced PMS and
therefore I find myself thinking (even though I don't say it) that
when other people talk about it, it must be something that exists in
their head.

I was told it was in my head. However, I used to have extremely irregular
periods. The very day before each period, I'd have intense, weepy times,
get irrationally angry with my husband, and have no freaking clue why.
(Also, have wicked chocolate cravings).

I'd wake up the next morning, NO cravings, feeling a ton better, but having
my period. I'd wake up thinking "well, doh, I should have known!". It's
like the day before my hormones got together and had a wicked party.

Nowadays, with better eating and proper thyroid treatment, my periods are
more regular. I can better prepare for pms because I now have a more or
less even number of days between check marks on my calendar. Being able to
predict these past couple of years of periods in advance has made the pms
episodes FAR less dramatic, and less troubling.

--
The post you just read, unless otherwise noted, is strictly my opinion
and experience. Please interpret accordingly.

"J.J. Marie" wrote in message
...
Hark! I heard (janice) say:

I too find it very
hard to empathise with other people over things I can't identify with
from my own experience. Examples - I've never experienced PMS and
therefore I find myself thinking (even though I don't say it) that
when other people talk about it, it must be something that exists in
their head. Likewise, I've never failed to lose weight when I stick
to an appropriate WOE. I therefore find myself very sceptical about
others who claim to not be able to lose weight but say they don't eat
much.

snip

I think many of these folks could be in plain old denial. I speak
from experience -- I used to complain to DH that I didn't eat that
much, certainly no more than he does, so why was I heavy? For years,
I kept telling myself that since I never sat down and ate half a pie
or a box of donuts at one sitting, that I just didn't eat that much.
When I finally faced the truth (by tracking my calorie intake), I
realized that I'd been fooling myself and had to eat less junk and
excercise more...


Yep, there are those people and they may be the majority of the obese people
out there. However, there really are people with an eating disorder who are
extremely conscious of what they're eating and yet not able to control it.
When I was fat I never questioned why, I always knew. I realize it's
difficult to understand if you aren't in it. I haven't been to France, but
I know it's there.

Jenn

I've always thought there was something wrong with me since I never knew
binge disorder was a problem when I was growing up.

"janice"
Yes, but to be fair, for many years anorexia and bulimia were seen as
eating disorders, but binge eating went unrecognised. I still suspect
that most of the medical profession find it far harder to comprehend
than the first two.

janice