Behavioral and body size correlates of energy intake underreporting by obese

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

J Am Diet Assoc 1999 Mar;99(3):300-6; quiz 307-8

Published erratum appears in J Am Diet Assoc 1999 Apr;99(4):411

Behavioral and body size correlates of energy intake underreporting by
obese and normal-weight women.

Kretsch MJ, Fong AK, Green MW
US Department of Agriculture, Western Human Nutrition Research Center,
Presidio of San Francisco, CA 94129, USA.

OBJECTIVE: To examine behavioral and body size influences on the
underreporting of energy intake by obese and normal-weight women. DESIGN:
Seven-day estimated food records were kept by subjects before they
participated in a 49-day residential study. Self-reported energy intake was
compared with energy intake required to maintain a stable body weight
during the residential study (reference standard). Energy intake bias and
its relationship to various body size and behavioral measures were
examined. SUBJECTS: Twenty-two, healthy, normal-weight (mean body mass
index [BMI] = 21.3) and obese (mean BMI = 34.2) women aged 22 to 42 years
were studied. STATISTICAL ANALYSES: Analysis of variance, paired t test,
simple linear regression, and Pearson correlation analyses were conducted.
RESULTS: Mean energy intake from self-reported food records was
underreported by normal-weight (-9.7%) and obese (-19.4%) women. BMI
correlated inversely with the energy intake difference for normal-weight
women (r = -.67, P =02), whereas the Beck Depression Inventory correlated
positively with the
energy intake difference for obese women (r = .73, P .01).
CONCLUSION/APPLICATIONS: Results suggest that body size and behavioral
traits play a role in the ability of women to accurately self-report energy
intake. BMI appears to be predictive of underreporting of energy intake by
normal-weight women, whereas emotional factors related to depression appear
to be more determinant of underreporting for obese women. Understanding
causative factors of the underreporting phenomenon will help practicing
dietitians to devise appropriate and realistic diet intervention plans that
clients can follow to achieve meaningful change.

NR

http://www.pat-acceptance.org/kookrant.html
http://www.pat-acceptance.org/kookrant2.html

If I catch you busting into a mass and vilifying a church, the last thing
you'll hear in your entire life, will be the ratatatatat of an automatic.
- --Steve Chaney to Mark Ira Kaufman
Message-ID:

Young Mr. Chaney, the man who has told me that he wants to murder me and
sodomize women in my family, has said, repeatedly, that advocates for
choice had vandalized churches.
- --Mark Ira Kaufman
Message-ID:

she probably has to have her picture taken by satellite because no normal
camera can fit all that whale blubber into one picture.
- --Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

Excessively fat women look ugly. It is impractical to try and have sex when
she's 100lbs overweight and the weight is all fat - but most women ain't
that big.
- --Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

You of course do know what a lot of Asian women prefer, right? Besides,
after ****ing a cute asian chick, experience tells me it isn't all that
except that she looks good on your arm. In bed it ain't much at all. If the
lights go out, any guy whose hormones are more fixed on performance than
looks, is going to go to sleep right there and then.
- --Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

Clarice and Allisson were well beyond a BMI of 25 in their pictures where
they were called cows.
- --Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

If Dutton knocked on Steve's door and Steve shot him in the face, I would
really not care.
- --Crash Street Kidd about Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

Stephen A Chaney admits to sodomizing his daughter if he forges me now.


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While I agree that most of those who stall on diets are underreporting food
intake, this is not always true. I've met too many people with undiagnosed
impared glucose tolerance who simply cannot lose on low calorie high carb
diets. These people find they can lose relatively easily on higher energy
intake if it is a low carb diet.

I remember one case, this lady said her morbidly obese father, hospitilized,
was put on a 1000 cal/day liquid fast. He still wasn't losing weight. How
could it be possible he was sneaking food in his situation?

"NR" wrote in message
...
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

J Am Diet Assoc 1999 Mar;99(3):300-6; quiz 307-8

Published erratum appears in J Am Diet Assoc 1999 Apr;99(4):411

Behavioral and body size correlates of energy intake underreporting by
obese and normal-weight women.

Kretsch MJ, Fong AK, Green MW
US Department of Agriculture, Western Human Nutrition Research Center,
Presidio of San Francisco, CA 94129, USA.

OBJECTIVE: To examine behavioral and body size influences on the
underreporting of energy intake by obese and normal-weight women. DESIGN:
Seven-day estimated food records were kept by subjects before they
participated in a 49-day residential study. Self-reported energy intake
was
compared with energy intake required to maintain a stable body weight
during the residential study (reference standard). Energy intake bias and
its relationship to various body size and behavioral measures were
examined. SUBJECTS: Twenty-two, healthy, normal-weight (mean body mass
index [BMI] = 21.3) and obese (mean BMI = 34.2) women aged 22 to 42 years
were studied. STATISTICAL ANALYSES: Analysis of variance, paired t test,
simple linear regression, and Pearson correlation analyses were conducted.
RESULTS: Mean energy intake from self-reported food records was
underreported by normal-weight (-9.7%) and obese (-19.4%) women. BMI
correlated inversely with the energy intake difference for normal-weight
women (r = -.67, P =02), whereas the Beck Depression Inventory correlated
positively with the
energy intake difference for obese women (r = .73, P .01).
CONCLUSION/APPLICATIONS: Results suggest that body size and behavioral
traits play a role in the ability of women to accurately self-report
energy
intake. BMI appears to be predictive of underreporting of energy intake by
normal-weight women, whereas emotional factors related to depression
appear
to be more determinant of underreporting for obese women. Understanding
causative factors of the underreporting phenomenon will help practicing
dietitians to devise appropriate and realistic diet intervention plans
that
clients can follow to achieve meaningful change.

NR

http://www.pat-acceptance.org/kookrant.html
http://www.pat-acceptance.org/kookrant2.html

If I catch you busting into a mass and vilifying a church, the last thing
you'll hear in your entire life, will be the ratatatatat of an automatic.
- --Steve Chaney to Mark Ira Kaufman
Message-ID:

Young Mr. Chaney, the man who has told me that he wants to murder me and
sodomize women in my family, has said, repeatedly, that advocates for
choice had vandalized churches.
- --Mark Ira Kaufman
Message-ID:

she probably has to have her picture taken by satellite because no normal
camera can fit all that whale blubber into one picture.
- --Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

Excessively fat women look ugly. It is impractical to try and have sex
when
she's 100lbs overweight and the weight is all fat - but most women ain't
that big.
- --Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

You of course do know what a lot of Asian women prefer, right? Besides,
after ****ing a cute asian chick, experience tells me it isn't all that
except that she looks good on your arm. In bed it ain't much at all. If
the
lights go out, any guy whose hormones are more fixed on performance than
looks, is going to go to sleep right there and then.
- --Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

Clarice and Allisson were well beyond a BMI of 25 in their pictures where
they were called cows.
- --Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

If Dutton knocked on Steve's door and Steve shot him in the face, I would
really not care.
- --Crash Street Kidd about Steve Chaney
Message-ID:

Stephen A Chaney admits to sodomizing his daughter if he forges me now.


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Version: N/A

iQA/AwUBQK91UzL3IlvsWvnjEQJ67gCfabNVmij/0j2MfFnuLgkTo6bcAFMAoMZP
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On Sat, 22 May 2004, "aurora" wrote:

I remember one case, this lady said her morbidly obese father, hospitilized,
was put on a 1000 cal/day liquid fast. He still wasn't losing weight.

I would not believe a questionable personal anecdote when such a feat had
never been replicated in a controlled setting. One fat acceptor claimed
she ate no more than 600 calories per day a few years ago.

How could it be possible he was sneaking food in his situation?

The same way drugs are smuggled into high security prisons.

Comments like this just make me laugh. Are you so uneducated about
nutrition that you don't realize that believe it or not, SOME people are not
fat because they overeat??? Have you never heard of food intolerances
which cause the body to retain and/or generate fluid in an attempt to "push
out" the offending substance? Same principal as aspiration pneumonia.
Lungs generate fluid to push out the offending food particle and in the
process, the person drowns in their own fluids. Are you a healthcare worker
who has seen people struggle day in/day out to lose weight and can't lose
very quickly or not at all? Have you personally met every single solitary
"fat acceptor as you call it" on the face of the planet? How can you make
a comment that they must be lying then? Do you PERSONALLY know that the only
way a person gains weight is by overeating? Do you even have a clue how
sharply the diagnose of congestive heart failure is rising in this country?
YOUNG people are dying from CHF due to an overload of unexplained fluid in
their bodies! Fluid accounts for some that number on the scales you know.
You make me laugh. Medical nutrition has a long ways to go to explain why
people are fat. There are reasons besides not being able to control one's
hand to mouth disease. You're so willing to accept that doctors are wrong
when it comes to low carb eating but hey, they gotta be right when it comes
to how the body processes the food put into it.............

People need to learn what works for their OWN bodies to be healthy. You
can't rely on doctors, nutritionsts, or anyone but yourself. Isn't that
what you low carbers have been saying for years?? So why would anyone make
such a statement as this? You don't know them, you don't know their body,
you're making an assumption. I guess you know what THAT makes you. Before
you go passing judgement on every obese person in the world with such a
blanket statement, why don't you educate yourself?

And before you ask? I am only about 15 pounds overweight. But I used to be
quite heavy and guess what? It was food intolerances that was the problem!
Folks, learn your body, keep a food dairy and write down everything if you
think it's possible that you may have a food problem. If you KNOW your food
intake is no more than an average of 1800 calories a day and you're STILL
overweight? And you're active? Investigate the possibility of food
intolerances.

A lurker


"Premium Glossy" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 May 2004, "aurora" wrote:

I remember one case, this lady said her morbidly obese father,
hospitilized,
was put on a 1000 cal/day liquid fast. He still wasn't losing weight.

I would not believe a questionable personal anecdote when such a feat had
never been replicated in a controlled setting. One fat acceptor claimed
she ate no more than 600 calories per day a few years ago.

How could it be possible he was sneaking food in his situation?

The same way drugs are smuggled into high security prisons.

After reading your posting, I am interested in how you may address a
few questions.

Why was morbid obesity much less prevalent in the USA two or three
generations ago than it is today?

answer

That's an interesting question. The WHO did a study back in the late 50's
involving people on an island. It's a much talked about study but I can't
remember the name of it. I'm sure if you research it even alittle you'll
find the study thru google. Anyways, on this island, the inhabitants only
ate what they themselves grew on their island, The rate of heart disease,
cancer, diabetes was practically unheard of on this island. In the years to
follow, a large amount of some type of ore was found on this island. The
people there began exporting their fine ore and since they were becoming
wealthy, they also begain importing foods from American, England, Europe and
other places. The WHO went back into this island in the late 90's repeat
their study. Over 75% of the population now had diabetes, cancer and heart
disease! Of the 25% of the people who were still pretty healthy? They
continued to eat what they grew on their island. If that doesn't tell the
story clearly enough, I don't know what does. It's obvious to me that the
overly processed foods in this country have more to do with the morbid
obesity rate in this country than overeating, although I do believe that
there are some people who truly do have eating disorders or emotionally eat.
I personally believe those numbers are smaller than the media/health
profession would have us to believe. God forbid, all these companies
couldn't peddle their "lose weight quick with us!" products if we really
knew the truth. But there are many, many studies that have been done since
the 60's and are available online that bear this out.

Why is morbid obesity today much less prevalent in so many other
nations around the world than in the USA.

answer

How many people do you know in other countries that hit McD's, KFC, and eat
the junk food that we eat? In France, they eat real cream and real butter,
cream sauces and pasta galore...........yet they are alot healthier than we
are.

Why have some people who were formerly morbidly obese been able to
shed their excess weight following the usual conventional diet and
exercise plans?

answer

some people being the key phrase here. Statistics show that most people who
lose weight either starve it off and then regain it in two years time or
they really did have an eating problem in the first place and got control of
it. The numbers show that more people yo-yo than who truly keeps the weight
off for any length of time. I mean look at what the low carb folks eat?
faux this and flaxseed oil......who does that for a lifetime? But I'll tell
you this, anyone I know that loses the weight due to cutting out processed
foods period? And they stick with that kind of eating? They are healthier,
the wide mood swings are under control, the blood sugars are under control
and they have more energy, less depression..........I myself even had my
irregular periods become regular after only two months of eating no
processed foods. Our bodies were not made to eat alot of fat, meat and
chemical junk. They were made to eat fruits, veggies and meat in
moderation. Fresh food, nothing processed. No fast food. And whole grain
breads or cereal in moderation. We don't burn as many calories as we did
back in the days of our parents. We're a disposable society with everything
at our fingertips. So we don't need as many calories as we used to. But
everyone's body is their own and each person much figure out what works for
them and what doesn't. In my opinion that is.

Why have many of the morbidly obese lost significant amounts of weight
following conventional diet and exercise plans and then when they
abandoned those routines gained the weigh back?

answer

When people lose alot of weight, what do they usally cut out of their diets?
sodas, candy, single sugar items, breads, potatoes.......they eat more fish,
chicken and lean meats. They cut out grains in general. Now what is it we
want the most when we're feeling deprived? Candy, salty foods,
junk..........and it's human nature to say to hell with the work out too.
People who take food for granted rarely realize how much a part of our
socialization is connected to food. Think about the
holidays..........memorial day, 4th of July, labor day? BBQs and beer in
the back yard with good friends, right? Thanksgiving means turkey, pie,
potatoes, etc......Christmas the same. And on NYE we go out and drink don't
we? So you see why folks give it all up go back to their old eating habits?
it's because they are so closed tied in with our socializing.

Why is morbid obesity rarely seen in individuals who have occupations
that demand strenuous physical exertion all day on a daily basis?

answer

That's a mighty wide assumption you make there. Take the nursing
profession, of which I am part of. When you go into a hospital or even a
nursing home..............how often do you see a nurse just sitting unless
their charting? They are on the move most of their shift, if they get to go
to the bathroom some days it's a miracle. Yet how many heavy nurses do you
see? Plenty. And chronically ill too. The US did a study in the late 90s,
they came up with this.......the average nurse is 47 years old, overweight
and chronically ill. Is there any wonder there's a nursing shortage going
on? And we nurses lift bodies for a living, does it get alot more strenous
than that? And push a heavy medication cart up and down the hall some 3-4
times a shift. Unless your in construction or something like that, nursing
is a pretty demanding job, both physically and mentally.

Do you see any connection between the obesity seen in todays children
and the pronounced decline in their physical activity. (TV, Music
Players, provided transportation to school rather than walking) I
used to see kids playing outdoor games far more than I do today.
When many mothers were Stay-At-Home moms I suspect that the kids meals
were more structured than today. IOW, they did not get so many
snacks and high fat foods at the fast food stores. Schools did not
have candy and soda machines. They ate most or all their meals at
home.

answer

Yes, I absolutely do see a connection between the obesity in our children
and the decline in their physical activity but more than that, I see it
caused by too many trips to McD's instead of parents (that includes the
fathers too:-) cooking fresh at home. Everything is either in a can or a
box or a restruant these days. But these days parents are afraid to let
their children out to play unsupervised.......and who can blame them? Kids
disappear from fenced in yards these days:-(

These are excellent questions, thanks for giving me an opportunity to voice
my thoughts. Now I'll go back into lurk mode:-)

Aprial Gundar

"A Lurker" wrote in message ...
Comments like this just make me laugh. Are you so uneducated about
nutrition that you don't realize that believe it or not, SOME people are not
fat because they overeat???

Show us a picture of an inmate of a Serbian or Nazi/Japanese
concentration camp who remained fat while all around him/ her wasted
away. If you cannot, then you are a contemptible fool.

Have you never heard of food intolerances
which cause the body to retain and/or generate fluid

Lucky for all of those inmates that their diets were free of these.

in an attempt to "push
out" the offending substance? Same principal as aspiration pneumonia.
Lungs generate fluid to push out the offending food particle and in the
process, the person drowns in their own fluids. Are you a healthcare worker
who has seen people struggle day in/day out to lose weight and can't lose
very quickly or not at all?

Apparently you believe them when they tell you about their bogus
struggles.

Have you personally met every single solitary
"fat acceptor as you call it" on the face of the planet? How can you make
a comment that they must be lying then? Do you PERSONALLY know that the only
way a person gains weight is by overeating? Do you even have a clue how
sharply the diagnose of congestive heart failure is rising in this country?
YOUNG people are dying from CHF due to an overload of unexplained fluid in
their bodies! Fluid accounts for some that number on the scales you know.
You make me laugh. Medical nutrition has a long ways to go to explain why
people are fat. There are reasons besides not being able to control one's
hand to mouth disease. You're so willing to accept that doctors are wrong
when it comes to low carb eating but hey, they gotta be right when it comes
to how the body processes the food put into it.............


Show us the pictures of fat prizon camp inmates or you should shut
up and sit down.


People need to learn what works for their OWN bodies to be healthy. You
can't rely on doctors, nutritionsts, or anyone but yourself. Isn't that
what you low carbers have been saying for years?? So why would anyone make
such a statement as this? You don't know them, you don't know their body,
you're making an assumption. I guess you know what THAT makes you. Before
you go passing judgement on every obese person in the world with such a
blanket statement, why don't you educate yourself?

You are kidding yourself.


And before you ask? I am only about 15 pounds overweight. But I used to be
quite heavy and guess what? It was food intolerances that was the problem!
Folks, learn your body, keep a food dairy and write down everything if you
think it's possible that you may have a food problem. If you KNOW your food
intake is no more than an average of 1800 calories a day and you're STILL
overweight?

Then what you know is wrong. An example of people in prizon work
campes who remained fat, despite being required to build railroads in
the jungle on limited food intake would be useful for giving us a
reason to think you are not an idiot.

And you're active? Investigate the possibility of food
intolerances.



A lurker


"Premium Glossy" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 May 2004, "aurora" wrote:

I remember one case, this lady said her morbidly obese father,
hospitilized,
was put on a 1000 cal/day liquid fast. He still wasn't losing weight.

I would not believe a questionable personal anecdote when such a feat had
never been replicated in a controlled setting. One fat acceptor claimed
she ate no more than 600 calories per day a few years ago.

How could it be possible he was sneaking food in his situation?

The same way drugs are smuggled into high security prisons.

In article m, Aprial
Gundar wrote:

On Sat, 22 May 2004 19:37:14 -0600, "A Lurker"
wrote:

Comments like this just make me laugh. Are you so uneducated about
nutrition that you don't realize that believe it or not, SOME people are not
fat because they overeat??? Have you never heard of food intolerances
which cause the body to retain and/or generate fluid in an attempt to "push
out" the offending substance? Same principal as aspiration pneumonia.
Lungs generate fluid to push out the offending food particle and in the
process, the person drowns in their own fluids. Are you a healthcare worker
who has seen people struggle day in/day out to lose weight and can't lose
very quickly or not at all? Have you personally met every single solitary
"fat acceptor as you call it" on the face of the planet? How can you make
a comment that they must be lying then? Do you PERSONALLY know that the only
way a person gains weight is by overeating? Do you even have a clue how
sharply the diagnose of congestive heart failure is rising in this country?
YOUNG people are dying from CHF due to an overload of unexplained fluid in
their bodies! Fluid accounts for some that number on the scales you know.
You make me laugh. Medical nutrition has a long ways to go to explain why
people are fat. There are reasons besides not being able to control one's
hand to mouth disease. You're so willing to accept that doctors are wrong
when it comes to low carb eating but hey, they gotta be right when it comes
to how the body processes the food put into it.............

People need to learn what works for their OWN bodies to be healthy. You
can't rely on doctors, nutritionsts, or anyone but yourself. Isn't that
what you low carbers have been saying for years?? So why would anyone make
such a statement as this? You don't know them, you don't know their body,
you're making an assumption. I guess you know what THAT makes you. Before
you go passing judgement on every obese person in the world with such a
blanket statement, why don't you educate yourself?

And before you ask? I am only about 15 pounds overweight. But I used to be
quite heavy and guess what? It was food intolerances that was the problem!
Folks, learn your body, keep a food dairy and write down everything if you
think it's possible that you may have a food problem. If you KNOW your food
intake is no more than an average of 1800 calories a day and you're STILL
overweight? And you're active? Investigate the possibility of food
intolerances.

A lurker



After reading your posting, I am interested in how you may address a
few questions.

Why was morbid obesity much less prevalent in the USA two or three
generations ago than it is today?

Why is morbid obesity today much less prevalent in so many other
nations around the world than in the USA.

Fast food, big portions (see "Supersize Me") inactivity, food
commercials on TV, convenience foods, poor choices of food,

Why have some people who were formerly morbidly obese been able to
shed their excess weight following the usual conventional diet and
exercise plans?
The morbidly obeses have a much greater challenge than tgose who are
just a moderate percentage over a healthy weight.

Why have many of the morbidly obese lost significant amounts of weight
following conventional diet and exercise plans and then when they
abandoned those routines gained the weigh back?

Anyone will regain weight if thay abandon attention to intake and
calories being burned,

Why is morbid obesity rarely seen in individuals who have occupations
that demand strenuous physical exertion all day on a daily basis?

For the same reason square tomato and Provini Veal are cultered in
close quarters with no activity.

Do you see any connection between the obesity seen in todays children
and the pronounced decline in their physical activity. (TV, Music
Players, provided transportation to school rather than walking) I
used to see kids playing outdoor games far more than I do today.
When many mothers were Stay-At-Home moms I suspect that the kids meals
were more structured than today. IOW, they did not get so many
snacks and high fat foods at the fast food stores. Schools did not
have candy and soda machines. They ate most or all their meals at
home.

Aprial Gundar

Duh, Aprial I think we are all aware of all of the above.

Diva
*******
219-139

On Sun, 23 May 2004 00:47:01 -0600, "A Lurker"
wrote:

After reading your posting, I am interested in how you may address a
few questions.

Why was morbid obesity much less prevalent in the USA two or three
generations ago than it is today?

answer

That's an interesting question. The WHO did a study back in the late 50's
involving people on an island. It's a much talked about study but I can't
remember the name of it. I'm sure if you research it even alittle you'll
find the study thru google. Anyways, on this island, the inhabitants only
ate what they themselves grew on their island, The rate of heart disease,
cancer, diabetes was practically unheard of on this island. In the years to
follow, a large amount of some type of ore was found on this island. The
people there began exporting their fine ore and since they were becoming
wealthy, they also begain importing foods from American, England, Europe and
other places. The WHO went back into this island in the late 90's repeat
their study. Over 75% of the population now had diabetes, cancer and heart
disease! Of the 25% of the people who were still pretty healthy? They
continued to eat what they grew on their island. If that doesn't tell the
story clearly enough, I don't know what does. It's obvious to me that the
overly processed foods in this country have more to do with the morbid
obesity rate in this country than overeating

The overly processed foods also have a lot more calories than what you can
grow yourself with simple tools.

Compare the calorie content of an ear of corn to a bag of Doritos.

Eating lots of processed food IS overeating.

Thank you for playing.

Joy Hilbert

And you're an idiot who chooses to believe what they want to
believe.............but hey...so does most of the world so you're in good
company.............how can anyone with the sense God gave a jackass say
that it's wrong information for a person to know their own body instead of a
doctor who gets 40 credit hours of nutrition at most schools unless they do
alot of self teaching on their own and even THEN it's only in relationship
to other diseases like heart disease and diabetes?

And your example of an immate of a Serbian or Nazi/Japanese oncentration
camp doesn't hold water either. Obviously if the body is being starved to
death then they WILL lose weight. Duh. How does that example apply to even
a single person posting in these newsgroups? We're talking about people who
eat processed foods, counting carbs, calories and/or fat grams and still not
losing weight. At least that's what I'M talking about, I don't have a clue
what you're rambling on about.........and how much nutritional education
have YOU had? I mean formal training.........not your opinion.


wrote in message
om...
"A Lurker" wrote in message
...
Comments like this just make me laugh. Are you so uneducated about
nutrition that you don't realize that believe it or not, SOME people are
not
fat because they overeat???

Show us a picture of an inmate of a Serbian or Nazi/Japanese
concentration camp who remained fat while all around him/ her wasted
away. If you cannot, then you are a contemptible fool.

Have you never heard of food intolerances
which cause the body to retain and/or generate fluid

Lucky for all of those inmates that their diets were free of these.

in an attempt to "push
out" the offending substance? Same principal as aspiration pneumonia.
Lungs generate fluid to push out the offending food particle and in the
process, the person drowns in their own fluids. Are you a healthcare
worker
who has seen people struggle day in/day out to lose weight and can't lose
very quickly or not at all?

Apparently you believe them when they tell you about their bogus
struggles.

Have you personally met every single solitary
"fat acceptor as you call it" on the face of the planet? How can you
make
a comment that they must be lying then? Do you PERSONALLY know that the
only
way a person gains weight is by overeating? Do you even have a clue how
sharply the diagnose of congestive heart failure is rising in this
country?
YOUNG people are dying from CHF due to an overload of unexplained fluid in
their bodies! Fluid accounts for some that number on the scales you know.
You make me laugh. Medical nutrition has a long ways to go to explain why
people are fat. There are reasons besides not being able to control one's
hand to mouth disease. You're so willing to accept that doctors are wrong
when it comes to low carb eating but hey, they gotta be right when it
comes
to how the body processes the food put into it.............


Show us the pictures of fat prizon camp inmates or you should shut
up and sit down.


People need to learn what works for their OWN bodies to be healthy. You
can't rely on doctors, nutritionsts, or anyone but yourself. Isn't that
what you low carbers have been saying for years?? So why would anyone
make
such a statement as this? You don't know them, you don't know their body,
you're making an assumption. I guess you know what THAT makes you. Before
you go passing judgement on every obese person in the world with such a
blanket statement, why don't you educate yourself?

You are kidding yourself.


And before you ask? I am only about 15 pounds overweight. But I used to
be
quite heavy and guess what? It was food intolerances that was the
problem!
Folks, learn your body, keep a food dairy and write down everything if you
think it's possible that you may have a food problem. If you KNOW your
food
intake is no more than an average of 1800 calories a day and you're STILL
overweight?

Then what you know is wrong. An example of people in prizon work
campes who remained fat, despite being required to build railroads in
the jungle on limited food intake would be useful for giving us a
reason to think you are not an idiot.

And you're active? Investigate the possibility of food
intolerances.



A lurker


"Premium Glossy" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 May 2004, "aurora" wrote:

I remember one case, this lady said her morbidly obese father,
hospitilized,
was put on a 1000 cal/day liquid fast. He still wasn't losing weight.

I would not believe a questionable personal anecdote when such a feat had
never been replicated in a controlled setting. One fat acceptor claimed
she ate no more than 600 calories per day a few years ago.

How could it be possible he was sneaking food in his situation?

The same way drugs are smuggled into high security prisons.

Well duh, no kidding. Where did you see me say it wasn't? Did I not say
that I believe the overly processed foods that we eat is more the cause of
obesity in this country than anything else? And who's playing here? I
thought we were having an intelligent discussion. Perhaps it's PLAY to you
but for those of us who struggle with weight and try everything under the
sun to lose it to no avail? It ain't play, honey. I went to doctors and
tried every diet, every diet pill everything under the SUN to no avail! And
I've had 75 credit hours of formal nutritional training while in nursing
school too. Finally my doctor sent me to a allergist who's big thing is
food intolerances and guess what? All I did was eliminate processed foods
from my diet and milk because it turned out I was highly allergic to sodium
casinate. And I lost from 315 lbs down to 150 lbs in three years. I was
losing weight so fast I had to slow it down! The cause? Just what I said,
processed foods caused severe water retention/generation in my body. Enough
of this crap. I am putting the information out here for anyone interested
in doing their own homework and cutting out the processed foods in their
life. Also, if you get heart burn from any food in particular? That means
YOUR body doesn't particularly like it when you eat that food, I'd eliminate
that as well. I did this and believe it or not, I no longer have GERDS and
haven't had to take meds for it in two years. KNOW YOUR BODY FOLKS IF YOU
REALLY WANT TO LOSE WEIGHT AND BE HEALTHIER! I'm outta here..............



"Joy Hilbert" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 23 May 2004 00:47:01 -0600, "A Lurker"
wrote:

After reading your posting, I am interested in how you may address a
few questions.

Why was morbid obesity much less prevalent in the USA two or three
generations ago than it is today?

answer

That's an interesting question. The WHO did a study back in the late 50's
involving people on an island. It's a much talked about study but I can't
remember the name of it. I'm sure if you research it even alittle you'll
find the study thru google. Anyways, on this island, the inhabitants only
ate what they themselves grew on their island, The rate of heart disease,
cancer, diabetes was practically unheard of on this island. In the years
to
follow, a large amount of some type of ore was found on this island. The
people there began exporting their fine ore and since they were becoming
wealthy, they also begain importing foods from American, England, Europe
and
other places. The WHO went back into this island in the late 90's repeat
their study. Over 75% of the population now had diabetes, cancer and heart
disease! Of the 25% of the people who were still pretty healthy? They
continued to eat what they grew on their island. If that doesn't tell the
story clearly enough, I don't know what does. It's obvious to me that the
overly processed foods in this country have more to do with the morbid
obesity rate in this country than overeating

The overly processed foods also have a lot more calories than what you can
grow yourself with simple tools.

Compare the calorie content of an ear of corn to a bag of Doritos.

Eating lots of processed food IS overeating.

Thank you for playing.

Joy Hilbert