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gout ?



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 25th, 2004, 11:50 PM
superchunk
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Default gout ?

I've been low carbing (Atkins since aril15/04). Have had trouble with low
energy levels ever since i started this regimen. I've lost 34 lbs or so
since starting this WOE (was 336/302). I have kept close to induction levels
for carb consumption most of this time.

My right knee began to give me trouble after about two weeks into the diet
( no injury) and has been giving me trouble ever since ( swelling and pain)
but no redness or heat. X-rays were good , uric acid was slightly elevated.
I have started taking Allopurinal in hopes that it will help relieve the
symptoms. Its slowing me down quite a bit from doing my exercise program .At
the gym today they warned me that atkins will eventually destroy my muscle
tissue in the long run. IM not so sure about that its the only Woe thats
has ever helped me to lose weight almost effortlessly, not having to starve
to lose weight is great. My blood sugar has returned to normal and my
cholesterol/ triglycerides are normal too although i do take Lipitor.

My diet is probably pretty bland by most standards .It consists of bacon
and eggs in the morning, a large salad and protein meat or fish for supper
and high fat snacks of cheese or natural peanut butter in the evening. Not
sure how many carbs or calories Iam consuming but seem to have a steady
weightloss of 3 lbs a week on average. I added walnuts last week and more
essential fatty acids to slow my weightloss down hoping to alleviate my Knee
symptoms. It slowed my weightloss down to 1 and 1/2 lbs a week.

I am wondering if any of you have had trouble with gout while low carbing
and what you did to help it, or if there is any advice you can give me as to
what to add to my diet before exercise regime ( they say at the gym i was at
today that I need grains , carbs to build muscle) but i do not wish to stop
losing weight.Grains scare me now until this last couple of months I never
realised how high Gi carbs worked against me in the battle of the bulge by
boosting my insulin levels and making me hungry and making me eat more. I
guess its a trade-off maybe for now either a sore Knee and lose weight or
stay fat . Any suggestions as to diet and exercise routine that others with
joint problems have used appreciated. Thanks ......Superchunk
336/302/165 atkins apr 15/04


  #2  
Old June 25th, 2004, 11:51 PM
pcx99
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Default gout ?

You can up your carbs a little, or you can take a glucosamine supplement
or both. If you continue to have problems you should consult a physician.

--
-------------
http://www.hunlock.com/health.php
  #3  
Old June 25th, 2004, 11:54 PM
FOB
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Posts: n/a
Default gout ?

Carbs don't build muscles, protein does. These people dont know what they
are talking about. Your pains could be completely unrelated to low carb,
just because thing a happens while you are doing thing b doesn't show cause
and effect, it may not even show correlation. It would be a good idea to
add more low carb vegetables, they are good for you. You could also try
upping your carb level five carbs each week for a while as Atkins suggests
you do for OWL.

In ,
superchunk stated
| I've been low carbing (Atkins since aril15/04). Have had trouble
| with low energy levels ever since i started this regimen. I've lost
| 34 lbs or so since starting this WOE (was 336/302). I have kept close
| to induction levels for carb consumption most of this time.
|
| My right knee began to give me trouble after about two weeks into the
| diet ( no injury) and has been giving me trouble ever since (
| swelling and pain) but no redness or heat. X-rays were good , uric
| acid was slightly elevated. I have started taking Allopurinal in
| hopes that it will help relieve the symptoms. Its slowing me down
| quite a bit from doing my exercise program .At the gym today they
| warned me that atkins will eventually destroy my muscle tissue in the
| long run. IM not so sure about that its the only Woe thats has ever
| helped me to lose weight almost effortlessly, not having to starve to
| lose weight is great. My blood sugar has returned to normal and my
| cholesterol/ triglycerides are normal too although i do take Lipitor.
|
| My diet is probably pretty bland by most standards .It consists of
| bacon and eggs in the morning, a large salad and protein meat or fish
| for supper and high fat snacks of cheese or natural peanut butter in
| the evening. Not sure how many carbs or calories Iam consuming but
| seem to have a steady weightloss of 3 lbs a week on average. I added
| walnuts last week and more essential fatty acids to slow my
| weightloss down hoping to alleviate my Knee symptoms. It slowed my
| weightloss down to 1 and 1/2 lbs a week.
|
| I am wondering if any of you have had trouble with gout while low
| carbing and what you did to help it, or if there is any advice you
| can give me as to what to add to my diet before exercise regime (
| they say at the gym i was at today that I need grains , carbs to
| build muscle) but i do not wish to stop losing weight.Grains scare me
| now until this last couple of months I never realised how high Gi
| carbs worked against me in the battle of the bulge by boosting my
| insulin levels and making me hungry and making me eat more. I guess
| its a trade-off maybe for now either a sore Knee and lose weight or
| stay fat . Any suggestions as to diet and exercise routine that
| others with joint problems have used appreciated. Thanks
| ......Superchunk 336/302/165 atkins apr 15/04


  #4  
Old June 26th, 2004, 12:01 AM
pcx99
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default gout ?

FOB wrote:

Carbs don't build muscles, protein does. These people dont know what they
are talking about. Your pains could be completely unrelated to low carb,
just because thing a happens while you are doing thing b doesn't show cause
and effect, it may not even show correlation. It would be a good idea to
add more low carb vegetables, they are good for you. You could also try
upping your carb level five carbs each week for a while as Atkins suggests
you do for OWL.


Sorry but the body uses sugars to lubricate the joints. When you're in
glucosis your joints swell (this is why many low carbers have trouble
keeping their rings on). As you enter ketosis the body has a harder
time keeping the joints lubricated and in serious cases gout can
develop. The solution is to introduce more carbs into your diet or to
take a glucosamine supplement or both. Medical advice should be sought
if the problem grows worse or persists.
  #5  
Old June 26th, 2004, 12:06 AM
Cubit
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Posts: n/a
Default gout ?

To get the Allopurinol, I assume you must have seen a doctor. There are
anecdotes that say LC can cause gout, if potassium levels get too low. A
blood test can check your potassium levels. If low, your doctor can write a
prescription for a potassium supplement, or you may want to try light salt,
Potassium Chloride from the supermarket.

Also, I know from experience that joints can easily be injured, when over
300. I my case my body rotated while my foot stayed in a fixed position.
Ouch.

It sounds like you are doing great on the diet. 3 pounds a week is very
good. Keep up the good work.

Cubit
311/234.6/165







"superchunk" wrote in message
...
I've been low carbing (Atkins since aril15/04). Have had trouble with

low
energy levels ever since i started this regimen. I've lost 34 lbs or so
since starting this WOE (was 336/302). I have kept close to induction

levels
for carb consumption most of this time.

My right knee began to give me trouble after about two weeks into the diet
( no injury) and has been giving me trouble ever since ( swelling and

pain)
but no redness or heat. X-rays were good , uric acid was slightly

elevated.
I have started taking Allopurinal in hopes that it will help relieve the
symptoms. Its slowing me down quite a bit from doing my exercise program

..At
the gym today they warned me that atkins will eventually destroy my

muscle
tissue in the long run. IM not so sure about that its the only Woe thats
has ever helped me to lose weight almost effortlessly, not having to

starve
to lose weight is great. My blood sugar has returned to normal and my
cholesterol/ triglycerides are normal too although i do take Lipitor.

My diet is probably pretty bland by most standards .It consists of bacon
and eggs in the morning, a large salad and protein meat or fish for supper
and high fat snacks of cheese or natural peanut butter in the evening.

Not
sure how many carbs or calories Iam consuming but seem to have a steady
weightloss of 3 lbs a week on average. I added walnuts last week and more
essential fatty acids to slow my weightloss down hoping to alleviate my

Knee
symptoms. It slowed my weightloss down to 1 and 1/2 lbs a week.

I am wondering if any of you have had trouble with gout while low carbing
and what you did to help it, or if there is any advice you can give me as

to
what to add to my diet before exercise regime ( they say at the gym i was

at
today that I need grains , carbs to build muscle) but i do not wish to

stop
losing weight.Grains scare me now until this last couple of months I never
realised how high Gi carbs worked against me in the battle of the bulge

by
boosting my insulin levels and making me hungry and making me eat more. I
guess its a trade-off maybe for now either a sore Knee and lose weight or
stay fat . Any suggestions as to diet and exercise routine that others

with
joint problems have used appreciated. Thanks ......Superchunk
336/302/165 atkins apr 15/04




  #6  
Old June 26th, 2004, 01:52 AM
Roger Zoul
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default gout ?

superchunk wrote:
|| I've been low carbing (Atkins since aril15/04). Have had trouble
|| with low energy levels ever since i started this regimen. I've lost
|| 34 lbs or so since starting this WOE (was 336/302). I have kept
|| close to induction levels for carb consumption most of this time.
||
|| My right knee began to give me trouble after about two weeks into
|| the diet ( no injury) and has been giving me trouble ever since (
|| swelling and pain) but no redness or heat. X-rays were good , uric
|| acid was slightly elevated. I have started taking Allopurinal in
|| hopes that it will help relieve the symptoms.

Keep in mind that you're heavy....you don't state whether you're male or
female, and how tall or how old you are...but weighing 336 puts a lot of
pressure on joints. I would not assume this is diet related...


Its slowing me down
|| quite a bit from doing my exercise program .At the gym today they
|| warned me that atkins will eventually destroy my muscle tissue in
|| the long run.

total bull****. You're talking to clueless morons at your gym. Sorry. If
anything, it is the opposite.

IM not so sure about that its the only Woe thats has
|| ever helped me to lose weight almost effortlessly, not having to
|| starve to lose weight is great. My blood sugar has returned to
|| normal and my cholesterol/ triglycerides are normal too although i
|| do take Lipitor.
||
|| My diet is probably pretty bland by most standards .It consists of
|| bacon and eggs in the morning, a large salad and protein meat or
|| fish for supper and high fat snacks of cheese or natural peanut
|| butter in the evening.

A large salad? Does that mean only or mostly lettuce? Lettuce as nothing
much in it. You need broccoli, cauliflower, spinach, green beans, greens,
cabbage, squash, etc. Work on the veggies -- that's an important part of
LCing...


Not sure how many carbs or calories Iam
|| consuming but seem to have a steady weightloss of 3 lbs a week on
|| average. I added walnuts last week and more essential fatty acids to
|| slow my weightloss down hoping to alleviate my Knee symptoms. It
|| slowed my weightloss down to 1 and 1/2 lbs a week.

At your size, you can afford to lose at a good clip...weight loss will slow
naturally (most likely) once you get smaller.

||
|| I am wondering if any of you have had trouble with gout while low
|| carbing and what you did to help it, or if there is any advice you
|| can give me as to what to add to my diet before exercise regime (
|| they say at the gym i was at today that I need grains , carbs to
|| build muscle) but i do not wish to stop losing weight.Grains scare
|| me now until this last couple of months I never realised how high Gi
|| carbs worked against me in the battle of the bulge by boosting my
|| insulin levels and making me hungry and making me eat more. I guess
|| its a trade-off maybe for now either a sore Knee and lose weight or
|| stay fat . Any suggestions as to diet and exercise routine that
|| others with joint problems have used appreciated. Thanks

I used to have knee problems. Of course, there is no way to know if mine and
yours are anything alike. I assume you've been to a doctor. Given that, I
suggest some movements in teh gym to help your knees. Stationary biking can
be very good, provided the seat height is right and you're not grinding to
pedal (pedalling should be easy when moving slow and become harder as you
increase speed, and it should feel natural).

Here are some movements that i've found that helped me (YMMV):

http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/...dLegPress.html
http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/...gLegPress.html
http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/...s/LVSquat.html
http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/...s/BBSquat.html

Notes:

1) the BB squat is technical, so start out very light and work out.
2) not all leg press machines are created equal - you may need to limit
your range of motion depending on your body and what machine you have
available at your gym. Start out light and work up over time.
3) IMO you should stay away from the leg extension movement.
4) you can start with bodyweight squats using your hands on a table to keep
balance (I strongly suggest you give this one serious consideration). You
can also do them with your back against a swiss ball which is placed between
you and the wall. You basically roll up and down to/from the squatted
position.

Bicycling is also excellent for your knees. Of course, you need a bike that
is fitted to your body. Otherwise, you could have more problems.


|| ......Superchunk 336/302/165 atkins apr 15/04


  #7  
Old June 26th, 2004, 03:46 AM
Cookie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default gout ?

"superchunk" wrote in message
I've been low carbing (Atkins since aril15/04). Have had trouble with

low
energy levels ever since i started this regimen. I've lost 34 lbs or so
since starting this WOE (was 336/302). I have kept close to induction

levels
for carb consumption most of this time.


Try adding a bit more carbs to your diet at 5 gram increments. Nice green
veggies are great!

My right knee began to give me trouble after about two weeks into the diet
( no injury) and has been giving me trouble ever since ( swelling and

pain)
but no redness or heat. X-rays were good , uric acid was slightly

elevated.
I have started taking Allopurinal in hopes that it will help relieve the
symptoms. Its slowing me down quite a bit from doing my exercise program

..At
the gym today they warned me that atkins will eventually destroy my

muscle
tissue in the long run. IM not so sure about that its the only Woe thats
has ever helped me to lose weight almost effortlessly, not having to

starve
to lose weight is great. My blood sugar has returned to normal and my
cholesterol/ triglycerides are normal too although i do take Lipitor.


I have knee problems too, right knee and take lipitor, along with a few
other things At one point I was told it was gout and I do now have damage,
I need a complete knee replacement...but...I am doing great. After losing 57
pounds and swimming, my BIG secret, I get around fine and have very little
problem with pain. I do exercises in the pool at least 5 times a week for an
hour. Do what you can do, as often as you can do it

My diet is probably pretty bland by most standards .It consists of bacon
and eggs in the morning, a large salad and protein meat or fish for supper
and high fat snacks of cheese or natural peanut butter in the evening.

Not
sure how many carbs or calories Iam consuming but seem to have a steady
weightloss of 3 lbs a week on average. I added walnuts last week and more
essential fatty acids to slow my weightloss down hoping to alleviate my

Knee
symptoms. It slowed my weightloss down to 1 and 1/2 lbs a week.


Fantastic! It sounds like you are on the right track. Do you drink a lot of
water? Sometimes dehydration causes gout symptoms to worsen. FTR, my mother
also has gout, she has more trouble than I do even though she's always been
thin. The big difference in our diets is that I drink a lot of water, she
doesn't. I also have a 4 year old at home so I keep moving. If I ever figure
out how to bottle her energy, I'll send you some!

I am wondering if any of you have had trouble with gout while low carbing
and what you did to help it, or if there is any advice you can give me as

to
what to add to my diet before exercise regime ( they say at the gym i was

at
today that I need grains , carbs to build muscle) but i do not wish to

stop
losing weight.Grains scare me now until this last couple of months I never
realised how high Gi carbs worked against me in the battle of the bulge

by
boosting my insulin levels and making me hungry and making me eat more. I
guess its a trade-off maybe for now either a sore Knee and lose weight or
stay fat . Any suggestions as to diet and exercise routine that others

with
joint problems have used appreciated. Thanks ......Superchunk
336/302/165 atkins apr 15/04


You do need carbs. Atkins or South Beach has carbs, just in smaller amounts
and much higher quality than the average diet. Whole wheat is good, white
stuff isn't good, like rice, potatoes, white bread. I can tell the
difference right away when I have white bread rather than whole wheat or
sourdough (homemade). My sugar and hunger goes up very quickly and I feel
like poo. FTR, losing weight will probably help your knee pain so don't give
up...you are worth the effort

Cookie


  #8  
Old June 26th, 2004, 03:49 AM
Carmen
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Posts: n/a
Default gout ?

Hi,
On 25-Jun-2004, "Pat" wrote:

Sorry but the body uses sugars to lubricate the joints. When
you're in glucosis your joints swell (this is why many low carbers
have
trouble keeping their rings on). As you enter ketosis the body
has a
harder time keeping the joints lubricated and in serious cases
gout can
develop. The solution is to introduce more carbs into your diet
or to take a glucosamine supplement or both. Medical advice
should be
sought if the problem grows worse or persists.


Funny, but that didn't happen with me. Where did you get this info?


Patrick is mistaking glycoproteins for carbohydrates. The joint
fluids contain glycoproteins, which are proteins with small
carbohydrate components on them. The carbohydrate portions are made
by the body.

Take care,
Carmen
  #9  
Old June 26th, 2004, 06:53 AM
Gary Howarth
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default gout ?

Dont listen to Barrack Room lawyers..who know squat.

I cannot for the life of me see how your diet can give you a bad knee ?

Your diet sounds much the same has mine, both knee `s still working.

:-)

Seriously you should look elsewere for the source of your knee problem.
"Gout" incidently is the build up of crystals that usually afect the extreme
proximities of the body ie THE BIG TOE.

As another user of this group usually states "Google is your friend"

Gary

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Always listen to experts.
They'll tell you what can't be done, and why.
Then do it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


"superchunk" wrote in message
...
I've been low carbing (Atkins since aril15/04). Have had trouble with

low
energy levels ever since i started this regimen. I've lost 34 lbs or so
since starting this WOE (was 336/302). I have kept close to induction

levels
for carb consumption most of this time.



  #10  
Old June 26th, 2004, 03:31 PM
pcx99
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default gout ?

Carmen wrote:
Patrick is mistaking glycoproteins for carbohydrates. The joint
fluids contain glycoproteins, which are proteins with small
carbohydrate components on them. The carbohydrate portions are made
by the body.

Take care,
Carmen


You are absolutely correct. I tansposed a small featurette I read in
low carb energy about joint swelling in glucossis and another article on
gout. Which is exactly why you never trust advice you get on the
internet and always double check with your doc

A good background on the issue can be found at this webmd article:
http://my.webmd.com/content/article/...000_1000_ts_02

Atkin's recommendations are pretty much the same as my suggestions
however -- increase the carbs (to slow weightloss) and if that doesn't
help go see a doc for a prescription.

http://atkins.com/helpatkins/newfaq/...yDoAtkins.html

Q:Can patients with high uric acid (gout) safely do Atkins? If so, how
is the Atkins Nutritional Approach adjusted and will gout medication
need to be changed?

A:Gout can be aggravated by the Atkins Nutritional ApproachTM.
Modification usually requires slowing weight loss down to fewer than two
pounds a week and taking 300 mg of the prescription drug Allopurinol. If
the uric acid level remains low, Allopurinol may be tapered down and
stopped after one month, both under a physician's care.

Atkins also has the following to say:
http://atkins.com/Archive/2004/6/24-125741.html

Myth: Controlling carbohydrates can lead to gout.

Fact: Gout can occur when high levels of uric acid crystallize in joints
causing sudden severe pain and swelling. Causes include a genetic
predisposition, overconsumption of alcohol, obesity, crash dieting, use
of diuretics and excessive intake of foods high in purines. Many people
are not aware of having high uric acid levels. Before embarking on any
weight-loss program, it is prudent to have a physical examination and a
complete chemistry profile, including uric acid. If an individual does
have a high uric acid level, sudden and excessive weight loss coupled
with dehydration can cause further elevation, leading to an attack of
gout. Thus, a low-carb program will not cause gout but can exacerbate
the condition if it is pre-existing and not managed properly.
Additionally, there is research that suggests a low-carb approach
actually improves gout by decreasing insulin resistance35.

Individuals who are predisposed to gout can safely follow the ANA by
moderating their weight loss, drinking a minimum of eight glasses of
water a day and limiting those foods that are especially high in
purines, such as: anchovies, herring, sardines packed in oil, liver,
kidneys, sweetbreads and legumes, as well as beer and other alcoholic
beverages. These individuals should also be monitored by a physician.

----------------------------

Sorry for the earlier mis-info, I'll be sure to do a quick refresher
before I jump in on this kind of thread in the future

-------------
http://www.hunlock.com/health.php
 




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