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Milk has carbs, cheese no? Strange



 
 
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  #41  
Old September 12th, 2004, 03:10 AM
Bob (this one)
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Chet Hayes wrote:

Bob, I see you're back to the crude vulgarity and name calling.


wysiwyg, Chet. You don't get to dictate the terms, style or content of
how your behavior gets treated. You don't have to like it. Your
opinion matters not a whit.

It must be a place you're comfortable with when you're on the
losing end of an argument. Would your mother be proud of the
language you use? It really only makes you look desperate.


LOL You're still not very good at this, Chet. The one really
important missing ingredient is content. And intelligence. And
expository skill. Ooops. That's three really important things you
utterly lack.

The deliberate use of language is a place in which I'm extremely
comfortable. That's why editors pay me for what I say and how I say
it. I employ it for very specific effect. In this case, it's to mock
you for your shifty-eyed efforts to evade your own words. It's to
point out your shabby attempts to change what you *said* to what you
sorta *meant* by your offering documentation that doesn't support what
you tried to get away with about cultures doing *all* the curdling of
milk for cheesemaking.

As for cultures, perhaps you recall my examples of paneer and haloumi
(q.v.) and the URL for mozzarella. Might want to read the package
ingredients on most commercial mascarpone, too.

LOL My mother can take your mother.

You shabby dissembler...

You claimed that cultures are only added to "very few" cheeses when
you blasted away at me and started the insults, but, I, a mere
mortal proved you wrong.


Right. I conceded the point that cultures are added to most cheeses.
But that wasn't the point of the discussion. Curdling was, remember?
You said that it all happened *because* of the cultures, remember?
*Only* because of the cultures, remember? You didn't mention anything
else causative for curdling, remember?

In that you were and remain dead wrong. Period. Nothing to argue
about. Curdling for cheesemaking is caused by enzymes and/or acids
added to milk. Until that happens, the best that will occur is yogurt
or kefir or something like them. They aren't cheese.

I thought even you could understand the nice little video provided
by the Wisconsin milk board that explains that they are routinely
added to cheese and ASSIST IN THE CURDLING PROCESS.


Chet, it's all very simple, like you. It's that word ASSIST you're
suddenly introducing.

You didn't say the cultures ASSISTED in the process. You said they
were THE ONLY REASON AND CAUSE FOR THE CURDLING. Your assertion
implied that cultures were NECESSARY AND SUFFICIENT. That's plainly,
untrue and has been demonstrated by the video you couldn't seem to
provide the URL for until the second post where your competence showed
with lamentable, crystalline clarity. But, hey, I posted it before you
managed to, just so the whole discourse would be balanced. No need to
thank me...

Now that you feel the need to snip all the damning examples of your
own words, I guess it makes you feel freed from the burden of being
responsible for what you're posted. I conceded that what I wrote in my
comment about cultures was inaccurate insofar as saying that they
weren't added to cheeses. I said it badly and corrected it later that
cultures are indeed added, but NOT FOR THEIR CURDLING CAPACITY as you
seem to still be insisting.

Get past it, Chet. You sound like a put-upon child who will have his
little tantrums no matter what information comes along, insisting that
somebody else hit him back first. Your snotty little attack on someone
else's post triggered all this. Your nastiness was the initial reason
for my contradicting you. I find it utterly hilarious that you're
trying to pin rudeness on me when your precipitated the whole
discussion. Since then, you've tried to weasel out of what you
actually said and tried to fling all sorts of crap in an effort to
divert attention from your blunders. Nice try. No cigar.

Lightweight.

Pastorio




  #42  
Old September 12th, 2004, 03:10 AM
Bob (this one)
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Chet Hayes wrote:

Bob, I see you're back to the crude vulgarity and name calling.


wysiwyg, Chet. You don't get to dictate the terms, style or content of
how your behavior gets treated. You don't have to like it. Your
opinion matters not a whit.

It must be a place you're comfortable with when you're on the
losing end of an argument. Would your mother be proud of the
language you use? It really only makes you look desperate.


LOL You're still not very good at this, Chet. The one really
important missing ingredient is content. And intelligence. And
expository skill. Ooops. That's three really important things you
utterly lack.

The deliberate use of language is a place in which I'm extremely
comfortable. That's why editors pay me for what I say and how I say
it. I employ it for very specific effect. In this case, it's to mock
you for your shifty-eyed efforts to evade your own words. It's to
point out your shabby attempts to change what you *said* to what you
sorta *meant* by your offering documentation that doesn't support what
you tried to get away with about cultures doing *all* the curdling of
milk for cheesemaking.

As for cultures, perhaps you recall my examples of paneer and haloumi
(q.v.) and the URL for mozzarella. Might want to read the package
ingredients on most commercial mascarpone, too.

LOL My mother can take your mother.

You shabby dissembler...

You claimed that cultures are only added to "very few" cheeses when
you blasted away at me and started the insults, but, I, a mere
mortal proved you wrong.


Right. I conceded the point that cultures are added to most cheeses.
But that wasn't the point of the discussion. Curdling was, remember?
You said that it all happened *because* of the cultures, remember?
*Only* because of the cultures, remember? You didn't mention anything
else causative for curdling, remember?

In that you were and remain dead wrong. Period. Nothing to argue
about. Curdling for cheesemaking is caused by enzymes and/or acids
added to milk. Until that happens, the best that will occur is yogurt
or kefir or something like them. They aren't cheese.

I thought even you could understand the nice little video provided
by the Wisconsin milk board that explains that they are routinely
added to cheese and ASSIST IN THE CURDLING PROCESS.


Chet, it's all very simple, like you. It's that word ASSIST you're
suddenly introducing.

You didn't say the cultures ASSISTED in the process. You said they
were THE ONLY REASON AND CAUSE FOR THE CURDLING. Your assertion
implied that cultures were NECESSARY AND SUFFICIENT. That's plainly,
untrue and has been demonstrated by the video you couldn't seem to
provide the URL for until the second post where your competence showed
with lamentable, crystalline clarity. But, hey, I posted it before you
managed to, just so the whole discourse would be balanced. No need to
thank me...

Now that you feel the need to snip all the damning examples of your
own words, I guess it makes you feel freed from the burden of being
responsible for what you're posted. I conceded that what I wrote in my
comment about cultures was inaccurate insofar as saying that they
weren't added to cheeses. I said it badly and corrected it later that
cultures are indeed added, but NOT FOR THEIR CURDLING CAPACITY as you
seem to still be insisting.

Get past it, Chet. You sound like a put-upon child who will have his
little tantrums no matter what information comes along, insisting that
somebody else hit him back first. Your snotty little attack on someone
else's post triggered all this. Your nastiness was the initial reason
for my contradicting you. I find it utterly hilarious that you're
trying to pin rudeness on me when your precipitated the whole
discussion. Since then, you've tried to weasel out of what you
actually said and tried to fling all sorts of crap in an effort to
divert attention from your blunders. Nice try. No cigar.

Lightweight.

Pastorio




  #43  
Old September 12th, 2004, 03:19 PM
Chet Hayes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Bob, do you suffer from a split personality disorder? It would
explain how you vacillate between your vulgar personality and the
simply rude, arrogant one that likes to drone on.

Here's some more info for you on cheese making:


http://schmidling.netfirms.com/making.htm
"COMMENTS:
What we have just made is really cheese but short circuits the process
in several ways. The vinegar provides the acid that causes the milk to
curdle and produces the acid flavor. The traditional method of
producing the acid is to use a culture of acid producing bacteria.
This is more complicated and takes longer but as it is alive, the
cheese will continue to improve in flavor with age"

http://mdmd.essortment.com/makingcheese_rzgm.htm
THE CURDLING PROCESS
Coagulating or curdling the milk until it turns into curds and whey is
the first step taken when making cheese. Today, cheese is curdled with
a bacteria culture and a coagulating enzyme, both of which help to
speed the separation of liquids and solids.


http://www.ebs.hw.ac.uk/SDA/cheese2.html
Starter Cultures
Cheese is really a form of fermented milk, and acid production is
carried out by starter cultures

Now, all three of these statements from folks who likely know a whole
lot more about making cheese than either you or I, sound remarkably
similar to and consistent with what I stated in my original post that
started all this. Contrary to what you claim, I never said that there
are not other ways to make cheese curdle, though I did focus on the
role bacteria play and overemphasized it.

You, on the other hand, stated that "very few" cheeses use starter
culture, which is clearly wrong. From the same reference:


"Starter is to cheese what yeast is to wine and beer. It is a living
colony of microscopic organisms that give the cheese its
characteristic flavor. One basic difference is that yeast is a fungus
and cheese starter is usually a bacterium. "


So, we both were wrong in some respects. The diffence is I don't find
the need to resort to vulgarity. You should be embarrassed after
blasting away and calling me a "****head", when it turns out you were
wrong too.
  #44  
Old September 12th, 2004, 06:22 PM
Bob (this one)
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Chet Hayes wrote:

So, we both were wrong in some respects. The diffence is I don't find
the need to resort to vulgarity. You should be embarrassed after
blasting away and calling me a "****head", when it turns out you were
wrong too.


Chet, you are a ****head. Let's put that to rest. In your stunted
literary capacity, you were apparently unable to distinguish between
"your ****head idea" and being called a ****head. I didn't call you
that then. Sadly, you subsequently earned being called a ****head by
being one.

I have no embarrassment about calling you that and much more that so
deftly and delicately describes what you do and how you do it. I'm
rather pleased to have been able to come up with a word that conveys
my contempt, your superficiality and your astonishing, continuing
display of infantile unwillingness to assume the appropriate degree of
responsibility for what you said - all on one tidy package. It matters
not a bit whether you dislike my choice of words. Or what you think of
my vocabulary. It seems to be a big deal to you about form - spelling,
mostly, but also what words used how - rather than content. Too
superficial...

If I'd had any respect for you after your shabby, dissembling
performance, I might have moderated both my tone and vocabulary. But
you don't deserve the respect that implies.

The final difference between us is that I conceded and explained my
error. You're still whining about the fact that you made a stupid
statement that you can't quite seem to own up to - and clearly haven't
repudiated. You're clutching desperately to that "we're both wrong"
excuse. Forget it. You were wrong about a major component of
cheesemaking and have weaseled around about it ever since. Whether I
was wrong about a peripheral fact in no way mitigates your error.
Period. You talked ****. It came from your head. You do the math.

Pastorio

  #45  
Old September 14th, 2004, 05:26 PM
Chet Hayes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Bob (this one)" wrote in message ...
Chet Hayes wrote:

So, we both were wrong in some respects. The diffence is I don't find
the need to resort to vulgarity. You should be embarrassed after
blasting away and calling me a "****head", when it turns out you were
wrong too.


Chet, you are a ****head. Let's put that to rest. In your stunted
literary capacity, you were apparently unable to distinguish between
"your ****head idea" and being called a ****head. I didn't call you
that then. Sadly, you subsequently earned being called a ****head by
being one.

I have no embarrassment about calling you that and much more that so
deftly and delicately describes what you do and how you do it. I'm
rather pleased to have been able to come up with a word that conveys
my contempt, your superficiality and your astonishing, continuing
display of infantile unwillingness to assume the appropriate degree of
responsibility for what you said - all on one tidy package. It matters
not a bit whether you dislike my choice of words. Or what you think of
my vocabulary. It seems to be a big deal to you about form - spelling,
mostly, but also what words used how - rather than content. Too
superficial...

If I'd had any respect for you after your shabby, dissembling
performance, I might have moderated both my tone and vocabulary. But
you don't deserve the respect that implies.

The final difference between us is that I conceded and explained my
error. You're still whining about the fact that you made a stupid
statement that you can't quite seem to own up to - and clearly haven't
repudiated. You're clutching desperately to that "we're both wrong"
excuse. Forget it. You were wrong about a major component of
cheesemaking and have weaseled around about it ever since. Whether I
was wrong about a peripheral fact in no way mitigates your error.
Period. You talked ****. It came from your head. You do the math.

Pastorio




Yes, nice job Bob, all about name calling, vulgarity, and your
arrogant attitude, but short on facts. I noticed you didn't bother to
refute any of the links I provided on cheese making which had
statements that were pretty close to what I had posted originally.
Nor did your provide any links so far to back up your claim that "very
few cheeses are made with starter cultures" Ohhh, wait you weren't
wrong, that was just sloppy writing. Funny, that coming from a guy
who claims to write professionally.

But, I feel your pain Bob. Imagine a mere mortal proving the one who
thinks he's the high and mighty grand expert of food wrong. My, that
must really hurt, as evidenced by your resort to name calling and
vulgarity. But, that's OK, the more people see, the better.
 




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