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Verizon blocking access to ALT groups



 
 
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  #11  
Old June 20th, 2008, 03:20 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Aaron Baugher
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Posts: 647
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups

Marengo writes:

On Thu, 19 Jun 2008 22:54:01 -0600, Pramesh Rutaji wrote:
Art wrote:
Just received a notice from Verizon that starting June 24th all but
the big "8" (which doesn't include ALT) will be blocked.


For what I read, they are not blocking anything. What they are doing
is not providing a service that they had previously provided.


It's not that simple. They've been pressured by the New York attorney
general into enforcing government censorship. No need to go into
details, google the new stories.


It's true that there's pressure involved, but that doesn't make it
censorship. Their customers can still use Usenet; it just won't be
provided as part of their Internet service package anymore. They can
even use it for free through horrible interfaces like Google Groups.

That's no more censorship than the fact that my library doesn't carry
every book and magazine I want. It's not censorship if they choose to
spend their grant money on Dickens instead of Penthouse. Internet
providers have to choose which services will cater to the most customers
and make the most profit. Running a full-feed Usenet server is
expensive, and with only a tiny percentage of customers accessing it, it
just doesn't make fiscal sense to keep it up as an internal service.

In the olden days of online communications, when the Internet was pretty
much restricted to government installations, online services like AOL,
Compuserve, and GEnie provided *all* services internally: chat rooms,
forums, games, e-mail, everything. As the Internet made it possible to
distribute those services to anyone from anywhere, the online services
were replaced with ISPs, which have continued to cut back on the
internal services they provide. Some don't even run a mail server
anymore; they just supply an Internet connection, and send their
customers off to Gmail or somewhere if they want a mailbox.

It's still kind of skeevy for some politician to push this, but kind of
irrelevant too. It's a little like shutting down the buggy whip
factories after everyone's already bought a car.



--
Aaron -- 285/247/200 -- aaron.baugher.biz
  #12  
Old June 20th, 2008, 04:27 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Cheri
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Posts: 472
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups


Aaron Baugher wrote in message

That's no more censorship than the fact that my library doesn't carry
every book and magazine I want. It's not censorship if they choose

to
spend their grant money on Dickens instead of Penthouse. Internet
providers have to choose which services will cater to the most

customers
and make the most profit. Running a full-feed Usenet server is
expensive, and with only a tiny percentage of customers accessing it,

it
just doesn't make fiscal sense to keep it up as an internal service.


Yep, I could almost guarantee that it has everything to do with money,
and very little to do with *social good.*

Cheri


  #13  
Old June 20th, 2008, 06:00 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Jeri
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Posts: 134
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups

Cheri gserviceatinreachdotcom wrote:
Aaron Baugher wrote in message

That's no more censorship than the fact that my library doesn't carry
every book and magazine I want. It's not censorship if they choose

to
spend their grant money on Dickens instead of Penthouse. Internet
providers have to choose which services will cater to the most
customers and make the most profit. Running a full-feed Usenet
server is expensive, and with only a tiny percentage of customers
accessing it, it just doesn't make fiscal sense to keep it up as an
internal service.


Yep, I could almost guarantee that it has everything to do with money,
and very little to do with *social good.*


Exactly! I'm betting ISPs have been hoping for this
moment for a long time. It's a HUGE expense to support Usenet servers that
carry binary
groups. Now they can cut costs and blame it all on someone else.

It wouldn't surprise me a bit to see other ISPs jumping on the bandwagon now
that
the NYS AG office has made itself the perfect scapegoat.
--
Jeri
"Change is inevitable, except from vending machines."


  #14  
Old June 20th, 2008, 06:13 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Cheri
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 472
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups


Jeri wrote in message ...

Exactly! I'm betting ISPs have been hoping for this
moment for a long time. It's a HUGE expense to support Usenet servers

that
carry binary
groups. Now they can cut costs and blame it all on someone else.

It wouldn't surprise me a bit to see other ISPs jumping on the

bandwagon now
that
the NYS AG office has made itself the perfect scapegoat.



Yes, I give it about six months until the others follow...right after
they put themselves in the position to be a *paid provider.*

Cheri


  #15  
Old June 20th, 2008, 09:28 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Doug Freyburger
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Posts: 1,866
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups

"Cheri" gserviceatinreachdotcom wrote:
Jeri wrote in message ...

It wouldn't surprise me a bit to see other ISPs jumping on the
bandwagon now that
the NYS AG office has made itself the perfect scapegoat.


Yes, I give it about six months until the others follow...right after
they put themselves in the position to be a *paid provider.*


UseNet is too low budget for that. With individual.net charging
10 Euros per *year* it takes thousands of subscribers to
justify one junior engineer running the servers and tens of
thousands of subscribers to build a server farm. Even charging
$10 per month as an extra service few can justify the head
count.
  #16  
Old June 20th, 2008, 10:27 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
FOB
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 583
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups

And they would be entering a market that already has some topnotch news
server operations.

Doug Freyburger wrote:
|
| UseNet is too low budget for that. With individual.net charging
| 10 Euros per *year* it takes thousands of subscribers to
| justify one junior engineer running the servers and tens of
| thousands of subscribers to build a server farm. Even charging
| $10 per month as an extra service few can justify the head
| count.


  #17  
Old June 23rd, 2008, 03:59 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Aaron Baugher
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Posts: 647
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups

Doug Freyburger writes:

"Cheri" gserviceatinreachdotcom wrote:
Yes, I give it about six months until the others follow...right after
they put themselves in the position to be a *paid provider.*


UseNet is too low budget for that. With individual.net charging
10 Euros per *year* it takes thousands of subscribers to
justify one junior engineer running the servers and tens of
thousands of subscribers to build a server farm. Even charging
$10 per month as an extra service few can justify the head
count.


And there's just no reason for it. When connections were slow and
bandwidth expensive, it made sense to have a newsfeed trickling in all
day so your users could connect to your local server at a decent speed.
I used to run my own news server at home for that reason. (Still do;
but that's because I'm a geek, not because there's any reason to now.)

At today's speeds and pipe sizes, users can't even tell a difference
between connecting to news.my-own-isp.com or news.somewhere-else.com.
With nationwide ISPs, the latter might even be closer or faster than the
former. It doesn't really make any more sense now to offer your users a
local Usenet feed than it would to offer them a local copy of wikipedia.



--
Aaron -- 285/244/200 -- aaron.baugher.biz
  #18  
Old June 30th, 2008, 02:16 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
readandpost
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups

On Jun 17, 4:45*pm, "Art" wrote:
Just received a notice from Verizon that starting June 24th all but the big
"8" (which doesn't include ALT) will be blocked.

Here is a excerpt from their email:

Dear Verizon Online Customer,

As a Verizon Newsgroup service user, we wanted to let you know about some
important changes that we will soon be making to our Newsgroup service.

On June 24, 2008, we will be modifying our Newsgroup offerings to only offer
groups in the Big-8 Newsgroup hierarchies, which are listed below. *The
0.verizon.* newsgroup hierarchy will also continue to be available. *Users
will not be able to post or download from any other newsgroups using our
Newsgroup service.

comp.*
humanities.*
misc.*
news.*
rec.*
sci.*
soc.*
talk.*

More details regarding the Big 8 newsgroup hierarchies is available at:http://www.big-8.org/.


yes, ROADRUNNER followed suit, and we have no newsgroup service
either!
i can get use to GOOGLE i guess!
rosie
  #19  
Old June 30th, 2008, 04:44 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
FOB
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 583
Default Verizon blocking access to ALT groups

Free and cheap newsservers:


http://usenet-news.net/

http://www.news.astraweb.com/

www.teranews.com

http://www.motzarella.org/

www.aioe.org

http://www.albasani.net/


readandpost wrote:
| yes, ROADRUNNER followed suit, and we have no newsgroup service
| either!
| i can get use to GOOGLE i guess!
| rosie


 




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