Drugs

"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I am 28 years old, I have a BMI of 42 and have been overweight all my life.
Things have now got to the point where either I lose weight or I will end
my life - I have no friends, no social life, no confidence and no self
esteem and I am not going to let it continue.

I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic enough
to know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest option I
am not prepared to fall further and further into depression cos of not
only having no life but not being able to eat what I want when I want for
the next 2 years again.
At this stage I dont want to be rude to anyone but I dont need to be told
that drugs are dangerous and potentially addictive, I dont need to be told
that I should be happy the way I am, I dont need to be told that there are
safer ways to do this nor that once the weight is off there are other
challenges in terms of keeping it off - what I would like is advice on the
best drug to use to achieve this weight loss (about 140lbs) and quickly. I
have been on some of the drugs available on the NHS and they were useless
so am looking for advice for non prescription drugs the type of which are
advertised on the US pharmacy web sites offering drugs such as Phentermine
but also if there are ANY others Im open to suggestions (there was one I
read about once which was likened to speed which users ahd huge success
using but I have been unable to find much out about it and its
availablilty so any help there would be useful). I would like advice on
the basics of how each works (ie what it does), how effective they are and
what sort of results I could EXPECT to see and how soon.

As much as I understand peoples concerns PLEASE dont use this as an
opportunity to try and convince me that I dont need to or want to use
these drugs - it really is at the point where if I cant see light at the
end of the tunnel in the next few weeks that I am gonna end it all and I
am gonna use weight loss drugs anyway so some useful advice would be
appreciated.

Thanks for reading

Jay

Unfortunately, you want two things that are nearly polar opposites (lose
weight and eat what and when you want) so you really do have to decide what
you want more.

I say this not to be critical. I was in your position not too long ago. A
lot of people in this NG were. I was 5'5" and over 300 lbs for nearly 10
years of my adult life - obese and morbidly obese since childhood. I tried
every diet known to man and then some. At one time I took Redux and it was
a miracle drug for me, until one day it stopped working. Because I was so
dependent on the effects of the drug, I was no longer satisfied with my
healthy diet, etc. and quickly gained back the weight I'd lost at that time.
In addition, I had to get an echocardiogram to ensure that I didn't have any
of the dangerous side effects of the drug. You might think you want to end
your life but when you find out it might be ending anyway it tends to change
things.

I'm not sure how or why it really happened, but one day I really and truly
decided that I wanted to lose the weight more than pretty much anything
else. I considered surgery until I found out about a medically supervised
liquid diet - mine was called HMR. I decided that I was desperate enough to
try it and it worked great for me. I lost about 155-160 lbs from Jan-Nov of
2003. Maintenance is a bitch though and I did develop (or already had
probably) some health problems that make it a challenge for me to keep
weight off - these aren't excuses, they just mean it takes more effort for
me to do what some people do with a lot less work. Add to that an eating
disorder that's been a part of me since early adolescence and it's been
quite a ride. In spite of the difficulties, it's been worth it because I'm
fixing long-term problems that have been either hidden or stuffed down for
years and years.

I don't normally recommend the liquid diet as a rule, but in your case, I'd
seriously look into it because you can get your quick results which is what
you seem to want more than necessarily taking the drugs. There are three
kinds of people I've seen have problems with maintenance with this plan:
- People who think it's a magic cure and go right back to their old eating
habits and stop exercising when they're at goal
- People who use the fast to go all of the way down to goal weight rather
than using it to lose x% of the weight and then transitioning to a healthy
supervised eating plan to lose the rest (this was part of my problem)
- Women who are not yet near menopause and lose a lot of body fat quickly
(this is also part of my problem). The women in the groups I attended who
were already in perimenopause or post menopause had many fewer problems than
those of us who were younger.

Anyway, it's safer than the street drugs and you will get results quickly.
The quick results may help you to get a handle on things and attend to the
other problems at hand. In your case I also HIGHLY recommend you get some
counseling because I can tell you from experience, being thin doesn't
automatically make all of your problems go away. If you aren't into
counseling, fine, but as you are talking about ending it all and looking
into pretty dangerous options, it wouldn't hurt.

I'm willing to discuss this with you further. You can post here or my email
on this account works.

Jenn

"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I am 28 years old, I have a BMI of 42 and have been overweight all my life.
Things have now got to the point where either I lose weight or I will end
my life - I have no friends, no social life, no confidence and no self
esteem and I am not going to let it continue.

I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic enough
to know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest option I
am not prepared to fall further and further into depression cos of not
only having no life but not being able to eat what I want when I want for
the next 2 years again.
At this stage I dont want to be rude to anyone but I dont need to be told
that drugs are dangerous and potentially addictive, I dont need to be told
that I should be happy the way I am, I dont need to be told that there are
safer ways to do this nor that once the weight is off there are other
challenges in terms of keeping it off - what I would like is advice on the
best drug to use to achieve this weight loss (about 140lbs) and quickly. I
have been on some of the drugs available on the NHS and they were useless
so am looking for advice for non prescription drugs the type of which are
advertised on the US pharmacy web sites offering drugs such as Phentermine
but also if there are ANY others Im open to suggestions (there was one I
read about once which was likened to speed which users ahd huge success
using but I have been unable to find much out about it and its
availablilty so any help there would be useful). I would like advice on
the basics of how each works (ie what it does), how effective they are and
what sort of results I could EXPECT to see and how soon.

As much as I understand peoples concerns PLEASE dont use this as an
opportunity to try and convince me that I dont need to or want to use
these drugs - it really is at the point where if I cant see light at the
end of the tunnel in the next few weeks that I am gonna end it all and I
am gonna use weight loss drugs anyway so some useful advice would be
appreciated.

Thanks for reading

Jay

Unfortunately, you want two things that are nearly polar opposites (lose
weight and eat what and when you want) so you really do have to decide what
you want more.

I say this not to be critical. I was in your position not too long ago. A
lot of people in this NG were. I was 5'5" and over 300 lbs for nearly 10
years of my adult life - obese and morbidly obese since childhood. I tried
every diet known to man and then some. At one time I took Redux and it was
a miracle drug for me, until one day it stopped working. Because I was so
dependent on the effects of the drug, I was no longer satisfied with my
healthy diet, etc. and quickly gained back the weight I'd lost at that time.
In addition, I had to get an echocardiogram to ensure that I didn't have any
of the dangerous side effects of the drug. You might think you want to end
your life but when you find out it might be ending anyway it tends to change
things.

I'm not sure how or why it really happened, but one day I really and truly
decided that I wanted to lose the weight more than pretty much anything
else. I considered surgery until I found out about a medically supervised
liquid diet - mine was called HMR. I decided that I was desperate enough to
try it and it worked great for me. I lost about 155-160 lbs from Jan-Nov of
2003. Maintenance is a bitch though and I did develop (or already had
probably) some health problems that make it a challenge for me to keep
weight off - these aren't excuses, they just mean it takes more effort for
me to do what some people do with a lot less work. Add to that an eating
disorder that's been a part of me since early adolescence and it's been
quite a ride. In spite of the difficulties, it's been worth it because I'm
fixing long-term problems that have been either hidden or stuffed down for
years and years.

I don't normally recommend the liquid diet as a rule, but in your case, I'd
seriously look into it because you can get your quick results which is what
you seem to want more than necessarily taking the drugs. There are three
kinds of people I've seen have problems with maintenance with this plan:
- People who think it's a magic cure and go right back to their old eating
habits and stop exercising when they're at goal
- People who use the fast to go all of the way down to goal weight rather
than using it to lose x% of the weight and then transitioning to a healthy
supervised eating plan to lose the rest (this was part of my problem)
- Women who are not yet near menopause and lose a lot of body fat quickly
(this is also part of my problem). The women in the groups I attended who
were already in perimenopause or post menopause had many fewer problems than
those of us who were younger.

Anyway, it's safer than the street drugs and you will get results quickly.
The quick results may help you to get a handle on things and attend to the
other problems at hand. In your case I also HIGHLY recommend you get some
counseling because I can tell you from experience, being thin doesn't
automatically make all of your problems go away. If you aren't into
counseling, fine, but as you are talking about ending it all and looking
into pretty dangerous options, it wouldn't hurt.

I'm willing to discuss this with you further. You can post here or my email
on this account works.

Jenn

"JMA" wrote in message
...

"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic
enough to know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest
option I am not prepared to fall further and further into depression cos
of not only having no life but not being able to eat what I want when I
want for the next 2 years again.

Unfortunately, you want two things that are nearly polar opposites (lose
weight and eat what and when you want) so you really do have to decide
what you want more.

I'm correcting myself here...
You can definitely lose weight eating what you want and when you want,
provided you control *how much* you want. There are a few good examples of
that in this group.

Jenn

"JMA" wrote in message
...

"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic
enough to know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest
option I am not prepared to fall further and further into depression cos
of not only having no life but not being able to eat what I want when I
want for the next 2 years again.

Unfortunately, you want two things that are nearly polar opposites (lose
weight and eat what and when you want) so you really do have to decide
what you want more.

I'm correcting myself here...
You can definitely lose weight eating what you want and when you want,
provided you control *how much* you want. There are a few good examples of
that in this group.

Jenn

"JMA" wrote in message
...

"JMA" wrote in message
...

"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic
enough to know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest
option I am not prepared to fall further and further into depression cos
of not only having no life but not being able to eat what I want when I
want for the next 2 years again.

Unfortunately, you want two things that are nearly polar opposites (lose
weight and eat what and when you want) so you really do have to decide
what you want more.

I'm correcting myself here...
You can definitely lose weight eating what you want and when you want,
provided you control *how much* you want. There are a few good examples
of that in this group.

Jenn


sorry I didnt mean that Im naive enough to think that I can eat what I want
when I want and still lose weight - I want to lose weight and if i thought
total starvation was a vaible opition then I would it

"JMA" wrote in message
...

"JMA" wrote in message
...

"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic
enough to know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest
option I am not prepared to fall further and further into depression cos
of not only having no life but not being able to eat what I want when I
want for the next 2 years again.

Unfortunately, you want two things that are nearly polar opposites (lose
weight and eat what and when you want) so you really do have to decide
what you want more.

I'm correcting myself here...
You can definitely lose weight eating what you want and when you want,
provided you control *how much* you want. There are a few good examples
of that in this group.

Jenn


sorry I didnt mean that Im naive enough to think that I can eat what I want
when I want and still lose weight - I want to lose weight and if i thought
total starvation was a vaible opition then I would it

You should be talking to your doctor but I have to tell you the truth. The
Meridia ads say a) it only helps you lose about 20 pounds (I lost that much
when I was forced to go on thyroid drugs) b) you have to exercise c) you
have to change how you eat.

"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I am 28 years old, I have a BMI of 42 and have been overweight all my
life.
Things have now got to the point where either I lose weight or I will end
my
life - I have no friends, no social life, no confidence and no self esteem
and I am not going to let it continue.

I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very
limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic enough to
know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest option I am
not
prepared to fall further and further into depression cos of not only
having
no life but not being able to eat what I want when I want for the next 2
years again.

At this stage I dont want to be rude to anyone but I dont need to be told
that drugs are dangerous and potentially addictive, I dont need to be told
that I should be happy the way I am, I dont need to be told that there are
safer ways to do this nor that once the weight is off there are other
challenges in terms of keeping it off - what I would like is advice on the
best drug to use to achieve this weight loss (about 140lbs) and quickly. I
have been on some of the drugs available on the NHS and they were useless
so
am looking for advice for non prescription drugs the type of which are
advertised on the US pharmacy web sites offering drugs such as Phentermine
but also if there are ANY others Im open to suggestions (there was one I
read about once which was likened to speed which users ahd huge success
using but I have been unable to find much out about it and its
availablilty
so any help there would be useful). I would like advice on the basics of
how
each works (ie what it does), how effective they are and what sort of
results I could EXPECT to see and how soon.

As much as I understand peoples concerns PLEASE dont use this as an
opportunity to try and convince me that I dont need to or want to use
these
drugs - it really is at the point where if I cant see light at the end of
the tunnel in the next few weeks that I am gonna end it all and I am gonna
use weight loss drugs anyway so some useful advice would be appreciated.

Thanks for reading

Jay

I understand your dispair. Really. It doesn't matter if you have ten or a
hundred pounds to lose, what matters is your confidence in knowing you can
achieve a goal.

Drugs may help you. As an RN, I have to advise to please work with a health
care provider to make intelligent decisions.

What I really want to impress upon you is that you do not have to reach your
goal weight to be more confident and feel good about yourself. I know this
from experience. Please, consider how you will feel when you lose twenty,
thirty and fifty pounds. Shopping for clothes that are smaller than the
ones you are leaving behind is a high.

Also, feeling good is a tremendous benefit. I accomplished this by
challenging myself physically. Currently, I walk almost every morning four
miles. I started off walking two or so miles. I got winded. It was ugly.
My most recent record was 94 miles (at four miles a day) without a day off.
I used to cut myself a break when it was the weekend, etc. Gradually, as
you appreciate the changes in your body you are loathe to give up that hour.
I have a very demanding job. I really don't have time to exercise. Yet, I
get more done because I take the time. It is like an hour in the morning
gives me two or more extra hours in the day because I have set priorties and
can focus.

Depression is a disease all until itself. It works like this. You are
depressed so you eat more. Then you weigh more. That depresses you even
more. So you eat more.

A little antidepressant might go a long way to break the cycle. They are
relatively cheap these days. I would ask your doc about an 'SSRI'.

I wish you luck. I hope you stay here in ASD. I would love to hear about
your progress.

j


"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I am 28 years old, I have a BMI of 42 and have been overweight all my
life.
Things have now got to the point where either I lose weight or I will end
my
life - I have no friends, no social life, no confidence and no self esteem
and I am not going to let it continue.

I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very
limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic enough to
know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest option I am
not
prepared to fall further and further into depression cos of not only
having
no life but not being able to eat what I want when I want for the next 2
years again.

At this stage I dont want to be rude to anyone but I dont need to be told
that drugs are dangerous and potentially addictive, I dont need to be told
that I should be happy the way I am, I dont need to be told that there are
safer ways to do this nor that once the weight is off there are other
challenges in terms of keeping it off - what I would like is advice on the
best drug to use to achieve this weight loss (about 140lbs) and quickly. I
have been on some of the drugs available on the NHS and they were useless
so
am looking for advice for non prescription drugs the type of which are
advertised on the US pharmacy web sites offering drugs such as Phentermine
but also if there are ANY others Im open to suggestions (there was one I
read about once which was likened to speed which users ahd huge success
using but I have been unable to find much out about it and its
availablilty
so any help there would be useful). I would like advice on the basics of
how
each works (ie what it does), how effective they are and what sort of
results I could EXPECT to see and how soon.

As much as I understand peoples concerns PLEASE dont use this as an
opportunity to try and convince me that I dont need to or want to use
these
drugs - it really is at the point where if I cant see light at the end of
the tunnel in the next few weeks that I am gonna end it all and I am gonna
use weight loss drugs anyway so some useful advice would be appreciated.

Thanks for reading

Jay

I understand your dispair. Really. It doesn't matter if you have ten or a
hundred pounds to lose, what matters is your confidence in knowing you can
achieve a goal.

Drugs may help you. As an RN, I have to advise to please work with a health
care provider to make intelligent decisions.

What I really want to impress upon you is that you do not have to reach your
goal weight to be more confident and feel good about yourself. I know this
from experience. Please, consider how you will feel when you lose twenty,
thirty and fifty pounds. Shopping for clothes that are smaller than the
ones you are leaving behind is a high.

Also, feeling good is a tremendous benefit. I accomplished this by
challenging myself physically. Currently, I walk almost every morning four
miles. I started off walking two or so miles. I got winded. It was ugly.
My most recent record was 94 miles (at four miles a day) without a day off.
I used to cut myself a break when it was the weekend, etc. Gradually, as
you appreciate the changes in your body you are loathe to give up that hour.
I have a very demanding job. I really don't have time to exercise. Yet, I
get more done because I take the time. It is like an hour in the morning
gives me two or more extra hours in the day because I have set priorties and
can focus.

Depression is a disease all until itself. It works like this. You are
depressed so you eat more. Then you weigh more. That depresses you even
more. So you eat more.

A little antidepressant might go a long way to break the cycle. They are
relatively cheap these days. I would ask your doc about an 'SSRI'.

I wish you luck. I hope you stay here in ASD. I would love to hear about
your progress.

j


"Jay" sales@*remove this bit*knickershop.co.uk wrote in message
...
I am 28 years old, I have a BMI of 42 and have been overweight all my
life.
Things have now got to the point where either I lose weight or I will end
my
life - I have no friends, no social life, no confidence and no self esteem
and I am not going to let it continue.

I have tried dieting all my adult (and some of my childhood) life with
very
limited success - I have considered surgery but I am realistic enough to
know I cant afford it and, despite, dieting being the safest option I am
not
prepared to fall further and further into depression cos of not only
having
no life but not being able to eat what I want when I want for the next 2
years again.

At this stage I dont want to be rude to anyone but I dont need to be told
that drugs are dangerous and potentially addictive, I dont need to be told
that I should be happy the way I am, I dont need to be told that there are
safer ways to do this nor that once the weight is off there are other
challenges in terms of keeping it off - what I would like is advice on the
best drug to use to achieve this weight loss (about 140lbs) and quickly. I
have been on some of the drugs available on the NHS and they were useless
so
am looking for advice for non prescription drugs the type of which are
advertised on the US pharmacy web sites offering drugs such as Phentermine
but also if there are ANY others Im open to suggestions (there was one I
read about once which was likened to speed which users ahd huge success
using but I have been unable to find much out about it and its
availablilty
so any help there would be useful). I would like advice on the basics of
how
each works (ie what it does), how effective they are and what sort of
results I could EXPECT to see and how soon.

As much as I understand peoples concerns PLEASE dont use this as an
opportunity to try and convince me that I dont need to or want to use
these
drugs - it really is at the point where if I cant see light at the end of
the tunnel in the next few weeks that I am gonna end it all and I am gonna
use weight loss drugs anyway so some useful advice would be appreciated.

Thanks for reading

Jay

Jay wrote:

sorry I didnt mean that Im naive enough to think that I can eat what I want
when I want and still lose weight - I want to lose weight and if i thought
total starvation was a vaible opition then I would it

Hi Jay,

I'm the person Ig said was taking an ECA stack. Actually, I don't take
the aspirin anymore, but I do still take a small dose of ephedrine and
caffeine. I buy ephedrine HCl in 8 mg tablets over the internet and get
no-doz tablets and cut them with a pill cutter. You can also get
ephedrine HCl in the form of Bronkaid asthma medication in the drugstore.

www.drumlib.com has information on why this works, but I have my own
theories. First of all, it *is* a stimulant. That means you will feel
jittery and like you're on speed if you start out at too high a dose. I
always, always ALWAYS ramp up and down. (That's one reason I like 8 mg
tablets.) Anyway, a stimulant makes you have more energy, so it makes
me more likely to not feel too tired to exercise.

It is also an appetite suppressant, so I think it makes me more likely
not to snack mindlessly on things.

It's supposed to give me a thermogenic boost, but the boost is so small
that I think the boost it gives me towards exercising more and eating
less is the real important effect.

Some other points: I've discussed this with my doctor, and I find that
the stimulant helps me in a situation where I typically need stimulants
(and in the past relied on coffee and chocolate) AND I have asthma so
taking an over-the-counter asthma med is beneficial to me, even though
I'm taking it off-label.

So, that's what I know about EC stacks.

But here's what I know about weight loss.

If you want to change you've got to change. Think about this: your life
seriously sucks. Through a complete lack of imagination all you can
find to change it is suicide. I'm here to tell you that there turn out
to be LOTS of things you can change that will work better for you than that.

I don't know how to teach the epiphany that you need, but at some level
you've got to say, "this isn't working for me so I'll try something
different". If being sedentary and eating too much has made you fat and
you're unhappy with that then you need to move more and eat less.

We can help you work out the details, but you've got to do the first
step, which is to think about why you've gotten fat and what the PAYOFFS
for you are for being fat. After all, at some level this HAD been
working for you. You got to eat recreationally, you got to watch tv
instead of doing sports, you got to exempt yourself from the dating
scene... fill in YOUR blanks. A helpful book on this topic is
"Fattitudes" by a married couple called Willard (I think).

To stop being fat you've got to choose to live like a slender person.
Please understand that I'm not advocating that choice: there's nothing
wrong with being fat and it sounds like you could use some counseling in
that arena, but if you truly don't want to be then this is what you're
going to have to do:

You're going to have to move more. Find a sport, get out walking, join
a swim class, start weightlifting, ride your bike to work, hike a
mountain, wear a pedometer and aim for 10,000 steps... whatever works
for you. You'll have to experiment a bit and you're going to have to
force yourself to do it until it becomes a habit, but at some point
you're going to have to put activity into your life.

You're going to have to become a restrained eater. You can still eat
good food, you should NEVER go hungry, you don't have to be restrained
ALL of the time, but you are going to have to take a good look at your
eating habits and figure out how to live within a reasonable calorie
budget. We can help you on this journey, but you're going to have to
experiment and listen to your body and tweak your lifestyle and come up
with the mechanics of how to implement this for you.

And then you're going to have to live like this for the rest of your
life... eating sensibly to fuel your body and using your body to move
through your world.

I've lost 70 pounds and gone from obese to reasonably slender in the
past two years. I know it can be done and I know how to do it and I'd
be happy to show you.

Good luck,

Dally