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How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.



 
 
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  #1  
Old May 22nd, 2012, 08:31 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Dogman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 540
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.


Opinion: Misleading Drug Trials

Amgen’s incomplete report on an early major trial of epoetin misled
the medical community about the anemia drug’s risks and benefits—and
helped make Amgen rich.

By Daniel W. Coyne | May 14, 2012

http://the-scientist.com/2012/05/14/...g-drug-trials/

"And if the intent was not to mislead, why not just publish subsequent
articles clarifying the results, especially the quality of life
results? The anemia workgroups that developed the KDOQI guidelines
included one of the 1998 NEJM authors. Why not notify the KDOQI
organization and other workgroup members that they were misreading the
1998 NEJM results? I cannot imagine what Amgen would have done if they
had intended to mislead."

Now, James and Trader would no doubt subscribe this to be incompetence
or merely an unfortunate accident. I, on the other hand, would
subscribe this to GREED.

Unless, of course, "increased quality of life" actually means DEATH.

--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman
  #2  
Old May 22nd, 2012, 08:54 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
James Warren
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 150
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On 5/22/2012 4:31 PM, Dogman wrote:

Opinion: Misleading Drug Trials

Amgen’s incomplete report on an early major trial of epoetin misled
the medical community about the anemia drug’s risks and benefits—and
helped make Amgen rich.

By Daniel W. Coyne | May 14, 2012

http://the-scientist.com/2012/05/14/...g-drug-trials/

"And if the intent was not to mislead, why not just publish subsequent
articles clarifying the results, especially the quality of life
results? The anemia workgroups that developed the KDOQI guidelines
included one of the 1998 NEJM authors. Why not notify the KDOQI
organization and other workgroup members that they were misreading the
1998 NEJM results? I cannot imagine what Amgen would have done if they
had intended to mislead."

Now, James and Trader would no doubt subscribe this to be incompetence
or merely an unfortunate accident. I, on the other hand, would
subscribe this to GREED.


Incompetence, accident and greed do sometimes rear their ugly head.
But science is self correcting in the long term.


Unless, of course, "increased quality of life" actually means DEATH.


  #3  
Old May 22nd, 2012, 08:58 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Dogman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 540
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On Tue, 22 May 2012 16:54:05 -0300, James Warren
wrote:

[...]
Now, James and Trader would no doubt subscribe this to be incompetence
or merely an unfortunate accident. I, on the other hand, would
subscribe this to GREED.


Incompetence, accident and greed do sometimes rear their ugly head.


"Sometimes," eh?

Yeah, and sometimes it gets hot in Florida.

--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman
  #4  
Old May 22nd, 2012, 09:05 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
James Warren
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 150
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On 5/22/2012 4:58 PM, Dogman wrote:
On Tue, 22 May 2012 16:54:05 -0300, James Warren
wrote:

[...]
Now, James and Trader would no doubt subscribe this to be incompetence
or merely an unfortunate accident. I, on the other hand, would
subscribe this to GREED.


Incompetence, accident and greed do sometimes rear their ugly head.


"Sometimes," eh?

Yeah, and sometimes it gets hot in Florida.


Ooh you just claimed the most science succumbs ro incompetence, accident
and greed. I don't suppose you have much evidence for that, do you?

  #5  
Old May 22nd, 2012, 09:54 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Dogman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 540
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On Tue, 22 May 2012 17:05:35 -0300, James Warren
wrote:

On 5/22/2012 4:58 PM, Dogman wrote:
On Tue, 22 May 2012 16:54:05 -0300, James Warren
wrote:

[...]
Now, James and Trader would no doubt subscribe this to be incompetence
or merely an unfortunate accident. I, on the other hand, would
subscribe this to GREED.

Incompetence, accident and greed do sometimes rear their ugly head.


"Sometimes," eh?

Yeah, and sometimes it gets hot in Florida.


Ooh you just claimed the most science succumbs ro incompetence, accident
and greed. I don't suppose you have much evidence for that, do you?


--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman
  #6  
Old May 22nd, 2012, 10:17 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 993
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On May 22, 4:54*pm, Dogman wrote:
On Tue, 22 May 2012 17:05:35 -0300, James Warren





wrote:
On 5/22/2012 4:58 PM, Dogman wrote:
On Tue, 22 May 2012 16:54:05 -0300, James Warren
*wrote:


[...]
Now, James and Trader would no doubt subscribe this to be incompetence
or merely an unfortunate accident. I, on the other hand, would
subscribe this to GREED.


Incompetence, accident and greed do sometimes rear their ugly head.


"Sometimes," eh?


Yeah, and sometimes it gets hot in Florida.


Ooh you just claimed the most science succumbs ro incompetence, accident
and greed. I don't suppose you have much evidence for that, do you?


--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Dogman, next time you get seriously ill, don't go to a Doctor.
Refuse any tests. Don't take any drugs. Don't go to a hospital,
because science is just corrupt and incompetent. Just treat
yourself with diet and sleep and read Duesburg's book again.
That should work just fine and we'll all be happy.
  #7  
Old May 22nd, 2012, 10:26 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Dogman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 540
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On Tue, 22 May 2012 17:05:35 -0300, James Warren
wrote:

[...]
Now, James and Trader would no doubt subscribe this to be incompetence
or merely an unfortunate accident. I, on the other hand, would
subscribe this to GREED.

Incompetence, accident and greed do sometimes rear their ugly head.


"Sometimes," eh?

Yeah, and sometimes it gets hot in Florida.


Ooh you just claimed the most science succumbs ro incompetence, accident
and greed. I don't suppose you have much evidence for that, do you?


What good would someone like you make of it? That article I recently
posted in The Scientist is not an anomaly, similar crap happens
virtually every single day. Some disclosures do make it to the major
journals, but most do not. The only reason you heard of this one is
because I posted it here, otherwise you'd likely never hear of it.

AMGEN made 37 billion dollars on their murderous deceit, which is why
it happens so frequently. Because there's $$$$ in it. 37 billion
dollars is mere chump change to AIDS Inc.

You're just an incurious and gullible person, James. The first step in
any 12-Step program is to admit that you have a problem. I just don't
see you doing that. Ever.

--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman
  #8  
Old May 22nd, 2012, 10:42 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Dogman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 540
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On Tue, 22 May 2012 14:17:59 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

[...]
Dogman, next time you get seriously ill, don't go to a Doctor.
Refuse any tests. Don't take any drugs. Don't go to a hospital,
because science is just corrupt and incompetent. Just treat
yourself with diet and sleep and read Duesburg's book again.
That should work just fine and we'll all be happy.


If I ever do get seriously ill, I'll make sure the doctor I see knows
what he or she is talking about, is someone who never stops learning,
and is someone who fully understands what The Scientific Method and
the Hippocratic Oath actually are.

In other words, no, I probably won't be seeing any of *your* doctors.

And I'll be totally responsible for what tests get done, and what
treatments, etc., if any, are being entertained. And I'll even pitch
in with the interpretations of the test results, too. Not my doctor.

I'm in charge of my health, not my doctor.

--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman
  #9  
Old May 23rd, 2012, 12:56 AM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
James Warren[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 40
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On 22/05/2012 6:26 PM, Dogman wrote:
On Tue, 22 May 2012 17:05:35 -0300, James Warren
wrote:

[...]
Now, James and Trader would no doubt subscribe this to be incompetence
or merely an unfortunate accident. I, on the other hand, would
subscribe this to GREED.

Incompetence, accident and greed do sometimes rear their ugly head.

"Sometimes," eh?

Yeah, and sometimes it gets hot in Florida.


Ooh you just claimed the most science succumbs ro incompetence, accident
and greed. I don't suppose you have much evidence for that, do you?


What good would someone like you make of it? That article I recently
posted in The Scientist is not an anomaly, similar crap happens
virtually every single day. Some disclosures do make it to the major
journals, but most do not. The only reason you heard of this one is
because I posted it here, otherwise you'd likely never hear of it.

AMGEN made 37 billion dollars on their murderous deceit, which is why
it happens so frequently. Because there's $$$$ in it. 37 billion
dollars is mere chump change to AIDS Inc.

You're just an incurious and gullible person, James. The first step in
any 12-Step program is to admit that you have a problem. I just don't
see you doing that. Ever.


But you said such things are rampant and you produce only one case.

--
-jw
  #10  
Old May 23rd, 2012, 01:05 AM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Dogman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 540
Default How a real scientist can make a difference. Eventually.

On Tue, 22 May 2012 20:56:12 -0300, James Warren
wrote:

But you said such things are rampant and you produce only one case.


That's because I'm done doing your work for you. You're like a broken
record. Do your own due diligence.

--
Dogman

"I have approximate answers and possible beliefs in different degrees of certainty
about different things, but I'm not absolutely sure of anything" - Richard Feynman
 




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